Am I missing something obvious?

[DarkMonster620]

Reading this, "I'm looking for a first bike and eventual commuter" somehow doesn't compute for me at least with S4R . . .

If, again my HO, first bike, from this group either the S2R800 or S2R1K, if you want to rip the roads then a S4R/S would be your choice .. .Again, my 0.02

[justinrhenry]

Go with the larger engine.  My vote is for the 1100.   If not, you'll just want one in a few months anyway. 

[Heath]

I wouldn't let the turn signal scare you.  Ducati OEM turn signals break easy by a simple kick of the foot.  Best way is to go see the bike and get a feel for the person.  Do you have any close friends that ride? Take one of them to check it out.

I would get the bigger bikes out of your mind real quick.  They are not bikes for beginners.  Starting out small is a safety net and makes it harder to get in to trouble.  Even the smaller bikes are fast enough for the street. I have owned my 2006 S2R800 since new for 6 years now. Only recently did I buy a bigger bike.

Keep in mind if you get to the point the bike doesn't have enough power there are upgrades.  Right now you need to focus on learning how to ride and everything that goes with that.  You are smart by taking the class, that is a great starting point.

I am shocked people are recommending big bikes for a FIRST bike.

[DarkMonster620]

I wouldn't let the turn signal scare you.  Ducati OEM turn signals break easy by a simple kick of the foot.  Best way is to go see the bike and get a feel for the person.  Do you have any close friends that ride? Take one of them to check it out.

I would get the bigger bikes out of your mind real quick.  They are not bikes for beginners.  Starting out small is a safety net and makes it harder to get in to trouble.  Even the smaller bikes are fast enough for the street. I have owned my 2006 S2R800 since new for 6 years now. Only recently did I buy a bigger bike.

Keep in mind if you get to the point the bike doesn't have enough power there are upgrades.  Right now you need to focus on learning how to ride and everything that goes with that.  You are smart by taking the class, that is a great starting point.

I am shocked people are recommending big bikes for a FIRST bike.

What he said . . .

[justinrhenry]

i've never been a fan of telling new riders they should buy less powerful bikes.  any bike can get you in trouble and a more powerful bike gives you more control in my opinion.  regardless, if you're going to wreck you'll do it no matter what bike your on.  having a less powerful bike could give you a false sense of security and having a more powerful bike will hopefully make you overly cautious.  just my 2 cents.  to each their own. 

[hbliam]

Big or little, they both go 100MPH. You can kill yourself on both. You don't have to twist the throttle the whole way on either bike. Better to buy something with some balls instead of trying to hop up a smaller bike later.

Regarding 696's have the same power as old 900's....as of 2005 Ducati started quoting crank HP (like everyone else) instead of rear wheel HP thus the "miraculous" advances in the baby monsters. 

[Kev M]

Saying both can kill you or both can do 100 mph is hiding your head in the sand and ignoring the facts that we're not warning about self restraint, we're warning about the severity of the bike's reaction to the rider screwing up, specially on throttle.

I've seen a newbie hit a pothole or chopped pavement and grab at the grip, opening the throttle and rocketing them through a red light.

I've seen a newbie ham fist the throttle trying to roll back on past the apex of the curve and spin the bike out from under himself.

Hell, I've seen a newbie blow a shift and vault the front wheel when the clutch was released too quickly.

There's a reason new skiers stay off the black diamonds for a while.

There's a reason racers don't start out in an F1 car or supersport bike.

There's a reason beginners don't fight black belts.

And the few exceptions who "were fine" don't constitute justification to recommend against common sense.

No it's not instant or guaranteed death, but it's all an odds game, like wearing a helmet or other gear.

[muskrat]

That's cause it is generally a bad idea....

generally but it appears he has his head on straight and is exactly why I said if he considers himself responsible then why not?  No matter the size he as the rest of us can pay the price.  Shit, I was riding my mountain bike and fell no more than 2 feet and broke my ankle in 4 places.  I've also been known to jump shit, early years, and land more than 20 feet away with no broken bones.  His question on whether or not he might outgrow the bike in 2 years led me to believe he is soliciting more than "newbie" recommendations and as such stated my thoughts for that reason.  It's my opinion that he will grow out of the bike in months and today's Monsters are more forgiving and easier to ride than the jerky S4's which is why I suggested the 1100. 

He's an adult and warning him is one thing but whether or not he will listen is his choice.  He asked for opinions and after reading his stature I put myself in his shoes because we are the same size.  I believe it's a stretch you are comparing F1 cars and black diamonds, not the same for me anyway.  My first ski trip I actually took a black diamond and survived better than skiers with years under their belt.  I know my own personal limits and having water skied my entire life and being on the college ski team helped me a great deal.  

I saw a black belt get knocked out in an instant too and more than twice.    A supervised fight is much different than a street brawl.  BTW, it was a fraternity brother that we started calling WIMPER because he got his ass beat regularly despite his black belt. 

[Raux]

I've had the 696 for 5 years now. one time I've said i want more power. i was on the autobahn doin 100mph+ and an inline 4 japanese bike passe me and i couldn't reel him in

as a commuter, back road terror and crossalp tourer the 696 has been more than enough

bigger bike doesn't make u more of a man or a better rider
just means u spend more on gas, insurance and at times can go faster

[hbliam]

bigger bike doesn't make u more of a man or a better rider
just means u spend more on gas, insurance and at times can go faster

For alot of us, bigger bike power is more fun. I bought a CRF250 a few years back. I sold it to a friends two weeks later and bought the 450. Having the power on tap to spin the rear at will and pick up the front is more fun.

There is a limit. I'll concede that the Panigale is a bit much. I think a late model S4RS or T is about as much as I need.

[hbliam]

Saying both can kill you or both can do 100 mph is hiding your head in the sand and ignoring the facts that we're not warning about self restraint, we're warning about the severity of the bike's reaction to the rider screwing up, specially on throttle.

I've seen a newbie hit a pothole or chopped pavement and grab at the grip, opening the throttle and rocketing them through a red light.

I've seen a newbie ham fist the throttle trying to roll back on past the apex of the curve and spin the bike out from under himself.

Hell, I've seen a newbie blow a shift and vault the front wheel when the clutch was released too quickly.

There's a reason new skiers stay off the black diamonds for a while.

There's a reason racers don't start out in an F1 car or supersport bike.

There's a reason beginners don't fight black belts.

And the few exceptions who "were fine" don't constitute justification to recommend against common sense.

No it's not instant or guaranteed death, but it's all an odds game, like wearing a helmet or other gear.

Half that stuff the newb will do on a 125 as well.

I'm not saying go buy an R1. An 1100M is not that fast. Until we get into Ducati SBK's there isn't much of a worry. The Monster/Hypermotard lineup is pretty tame and forgiving.

[Kev M]

Muskrat, exceptions don't disprove the logic. We're talking about playing the best odds.

Hb, it's a matter of degrees, but the logic still applies.

[muskrat]

Anyhow, back to the thread. 

Any update on your search and thoughts?

[Curmudgeon]

bigger bike doesn't make u more of a man or a better rider
just means u spend more on gas, insurance and at times can go faster

And..., often an excess of power can be more work to handle and less fun than something lighter and more nimble, not to mention better manners! 

[wrl]

Anyhow, back to the thread. 

Any update on your search and thoughts?

I'm off to look at the 696 in half an hour. I'll follow the recommendations here regarding maintenance history, modifications, and inspecting for damage, but otherwise my primary concern is ergonomics once I have a chance to sit on it. I don't mind starting off on a smaller engine to learn, but there are several additional factors I'm considering.

I don't want to rush into just any Monster simply because it's local and convenient when it might be the wrong bike. I've received several concerned replies that this bike might physically be too small for my frame and that's a major consideration. I do plan on ending up on something larger in the 800-1100cc range eventually, but I have to remind myself that a significant portion of my motivation is to get a more fuel economy-conscious commuter--I'm not a racer and don't have any track ambitions. I'm not terribly concerned with starting on a larger bike as, no matter what I end up on, my plan is to spend the first few weeks in empty parking lots and gradually work my way up to low-traffic neighborhoods. It will likely be at least 1-2 months before I consider riding it to work (21 miles on one city highway with 2-3 curves and ~15 lights, but 45min in traffic). However, I'm also not one to entirely ignore advice from those more experienced.

If the 696 simply feels too small for my body to comfortably ride, I'll scratch the idea and keep looking at craigslist, ebay, cycletrader, et al. While the S4R in Senna/red (I've only seen that combination on S4Rs for some reason) is wildly appealing to me (I also like the red/white stripe), it would be difficult to justify the 'scarier' engine size and more difficult learning curve if the fuel economy isn't a significant increase over the ~22 MPG I'm getting in the truck, or the ~30 MPG I'm hoping to get in a future Jeep. Recently seeing a youtube video with an M1100 Evo is at least partly to blame for my recent decision to finally get started, but I'm not willing to spend $12K on a first bike.

Furthermore, the nearest Ducati-only dealer is 300 miles away. There's a closer dealership that does Ducati-Triumph-BMW-Aprilia, but they're still ~100 miles away. If a repair is beyond my capacity, then it's going to be a pain to get it worked on. Although newer bikes can have their problems, I worry about the maintenance on older ones.

Anyway, I should get ready to go. I'll report back after I look at the 696.

Thanks, all!