Monsterlover rejoins the fold

[Monsterlover]

I don't think so, no. So that would point to things being too tight.

However, I have similar measurements on the front cylinder closers and that cam flys around with zero drag. So that might point to something else.

[ducpainter]

I don't think so, no. So that would point to things being too tight.

However, I have similar measurements on the front cylinder closers and that cam flys around with zero drag. So that might point to something else.

Every time I think, I swear I'll never do it again.

If you're uncomfortable with the drag, reset the closers and see if the drag goes away. I wouldn't jump right to .003. I'd go .001 at a time, 1 valve at a time to see if you can isolate the issue.

[Speeddog]

Try to isolate which valve it is and debug that.

The shims and half rings are not perfect, rocker faces and such not maybe perfectly perpendicular and lotta stackup.
Brand new 7mm half rings have squashed ends from the cutting and need to be deburred.
Shims and valve stems wear.
Spin the closer shim relative to the valve and see if you can find tight spots

If you're using 'measuring opener clearance then pushing the closer down and re-measuring'....
the measuring increments of 0.001" and measurement error starts to fuxxor the numbers when you get close to zero.
You can try '0.004" fits thru with this feel of slip on the feeler, so I'll push down on the closer rocker and try to get a 0.005" to slide the same'

Sometimes it's that old move 50% less each step you take and you never get there.

[Monsterlover]

Try to isolate which valve it is and debug that.

It's both

The shims and half rings are not perfect, rocker faces and such not maybe perfectly perpendicular and lotta stackup.
Brand new 7mm half rings have squashed ends from the cutting and need to be deburred.
Shims and valve stems wear.
Spin the closer shim relative to the valve and see if you can find tight spots

Noted!

-snip-
You can try '0.004" fits thru with this feel of slip on the feeler, so I'll push down on the closer rocker and try to get a 0.005" to slide the same'

This is exactly how I did it. I looked for the same feel with larger feeler gages while keeping pressure on the closing rocker.

[Speeddog]

It is possible to push down on the closer rocker hard enough to 'spring' it and make more clearance.
You only need to push hard enough to overcome the closer spring.

It's possible to get carbon sitting on the seat/valve face that fuxxors with the measurements.
Sometimes the seating of the shims/halfrings is a little sticky.
Rotate the cam with the opener rocker off so you can push the valve open a good bit and let it snap closed a couple times and see if there's a bit of swarf spoiling the party

Worn valves and seats they don't sit the same every time

When pushing on the closer rocker try to avoid the tool slipping off and shanking the valve stem or seal

[Monsterlover]

I'm on the right track. I pulled both exhaust closers from the rear cylinder and worked on them.

The intake closer had drag so I ground .0005-.0008 of off it and reinstalled. No drag and .0005+ on clearance.

Had to break out the Norton stone kit. .004 increments just aren't enough.


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[Speeddog]

Dude WTF you're missing like 5 stones.
















 
I've got a tiny collection of stones sitting in a drawer and it's surely a sin of some sort.

That setup is like gold wrapped in bacon I never knew such a thing existed.

[Monsterlover]

Those five are lost to the ages. Seemed like a better method than sand paper.

A few drops of motor oil then make circles. Rotate the shim a little then more circles.

Check progress with mics or calipers. I had some that ended up being maybe a few tenths out of flat but was able to mostly fix that with a sharpie and strategic stoning on half the shim.

I don't know if it even matters. The oem ones aren't flat either. They're out more than a few tenths.

[koko64]

A good effort to get that bee's dick of clearance to get them spot on.

[koko64]

It is possible to push down on the closer rocker hard enough to 'spring' it and make more clearance.
You only need to push hard enough to overcome the closer .

This^, it's about feel. The same goes for feeling for drag on the cam base circle. The cam roller bearings in the old motors spin different to the cam plain bearings in the new motors imo, so drag feels different.

[Speeddog]

I'm trying to remember if i ever took too much off a whole shim face by hand. nope.
The 7mm stuff is right on the edge of awkward for fingers in general.
Not sure what the V4 have but there are lots of them.

They seem to work OK if they're out a few tenths.
Everything floats around on oil and if we saw slo-mo at 9krpm it'd be like diving boards and fish flapping around I bet.

Feel, yeah, first time I turned the crank on a single phase motor was a big "Uh oh" about nothing.

Mike's EMS shims were very nice, hopefully the quality can be retained.

[ducpainter]

Those five are lost to the ages. Seemed like a better method than sand paper.

A few drops of motor oil then make circles. Rotate the shim a little then more circles.

Check progress with mics or calipers. I had some that ended up being maybe a few tenths out of flat but was able to mostly fix that with a sharpie and strategic stoning on half the shim.

I don't know if it even matters. The oem ones aren't flat either. They're out more than a few tenths.

I get better results with figure 8's when trying to retain flatness. Those stones are a little small to do that, I guess.

[Monsterlover]

I get better results with figure 8's when trying to retain flatness. Those stones are a little small to do that, I guess.

It can be done but it slowed things down too much. I'm good with circles, measuring the shim and fixing the high spots.

[Monsterlover]

Ok, here's where the valve adjustment sits. I just finished working on the last two closers. I have pretty tight closer clearances and no cam drag at all on either cylinder.

Front cylinder-
Intake open .005
Intake close .000+
Exhaust open .005
Exhaust close .0005 or .000+

Rear cylinder-
Intake open .004
Intake close .000+ or .0005
Exhaust open .005
Exhaust close .001

Does that look like a winner or should I keep going?

[Speeddog]

No need to paint it, just ship it