Electrical Troubleshooting help

[Barney]

What up everyone - I'm looking for some advice on where to start troubleshooting here.

I put about 250 miles on my M1100evo over the weekend before it left me stranded.  I was on the road for about 3 hours yesterday, even stopped for gas at one point and had absolutely no issues with the bike.  I finally stopped to stretch my legs and grab a water, and when I came back out to the bike the battery was totally flat.  Wouldn't attempt to crank, and there's not even enough juice to power the dash.  Got the bike on the back of a truck and to the house, but I don't have any real idea where to start troubleshooting.

Bike's got ~21,500 miles on it at this point, the battery was replaced last year with a Shorai lithium battery that up until this point hasn't given me any issues. The only  change I've made recently was putting in a new headlight bulb that I swapped from a regular H4 or whatever it is to a cheap LED bulb I grabbed off amazon - I did that about two weeks ago and it hadn't given me any issues, but I did notice yesterday that the high beam indicator light on the dash was on even with the high beams off.  Bulb was still working fine though, so I didn't think too much of it other than that I was planning on pulling the new bulb out and reseating it.

I read the other battery thread, and am thinking about ordering a new rectifier from Rick's, but I'm curious what you guys think?

Thanks everyone!

Shulze

[Buhgaboo]

If your lithium battery went to zero...it's gone...chemistry...the rectifier might be an issue too...but if you replace it and find nothing changes...try a different battery

[greenmonster]

1. Start w other battery and check charging.
When revved, 14,0V +\- 0,2V, charge ok.
If not, buy the Rick’s and new battery.

[koko64]

Bad regulators kill batteries every day. Consult the Shorai distributor,  maybe you can send your Shorai to the distributor to see if they can resurrect it. Probably not, but I did it once myself and the battery works over ten years later. The charging port under the seat will let you charge that battery, unless you have a pigtail off the battery itself. You must use a lithium specific battery charger for safety. Check the owners manual to locate the charging plug in the loom under the seat. If you can restart it you can scroll the dash to voltage and do the charging test that way.
Doing the charging test mentioned or with a borrowed battery will tell you if the Shorai was starved to death. If the voltage doesnt rise enough with revs then the first suspect is the regulator.
What a pita changing the battery is on those things!

[Barney]

Thanks for the insight guys

 

Bad regulators kill batteries every day. Consult the Shorai distributor,  maybe you can send your Shorai to the distributor to see if they can resurrect it. Probably not, but I did it once myself and the battery works over ten years later. The charging port under the seat will let you charge that battery, unless you have a pigtail off the battery itself. You must use a lithium specific battery charger for safety. Check the owners manual to locate the charging plug in the loom under the seat. If you can restart it you can scroll the dash to voltage and do the charging test that way.
Doing the charging test mentioned or with a borrowed battery will tell you if the Shorai was starved to death. If the voltage doesnt rise enough with revs then the first suspect is the regulator.
What a pita changing the battery is on those things!

I've actually already started an RMA request with Shorai - hoping you're right and they'll be able to resurrect it in the event it's been drain too low, which really wouldn't surprise me. I do have a charger for it too, so I'll throw it on there for a bit to see what's what. I looked up my original purchase and it actually looks like it was actually just about two years ago that I purchased it, so it would be a bummer to have to replace it already.  You're right, getting to the battery on these things is a royal pain in the ass. Oh well.  Looks like I've at least got a few troubleshooting steps I can take tonight.

I've never had a regulator go bad, but I would think if the battery weren't charging I'd have been seeing issues starting the bike over the past few days, since it's been getting regular use lately both commuting on longer rides.

[Barney]

Update:  I got the bike started, and it looks like I'm only getting 13-13.1 volts while it's running according to the dash, no change from when the bike is off, and doesn't seem to be effected by revving the engine what-so-ever.  Does this point to the regulator?

[ducpainter]

Update:  I got the bike started, and it looks like I'm only getting 13-13.1 volts while it's running according to the dash, no change from when the bike is off, and doesn't seem to be effected by revving the engine what-so-ever.  Does this point to the regulator?

Typically, that is the case.

[Howie]

Before replacing the regulator make sure the stator is good.

This saves me a lot of typing
https://cdn.shopify.com/s/files/1/1091/5694/files/fault-finding-diagram.pdf?235929069374954073

Either way, if you are going to use a Shoria battery again I would get a lithium compatible regulator from Rick's.
https://ricksmotorsportelectrics.com/Rectifier-Regulator-Lithium-Compatible-14_008

[Barney]

Typically, that is the case.

Before replacing the regulator make sure the stator is good.

This saves me a lot of typing
https://cdn.shopify.com/s/files/1/1091/5694/files/fault-finding-diagram.pdf?235929069374954073

Either way, if you are going to use a Shoria battery again I would get a lithium compatible regulator from Rick's.
https://ricksmotorsportelectrics.com/Rectifier-Regulator-Lithium-Compatible-14_008

Thanks guys - I'll work through that flow chart this afternoon.   Howie, I was planning on picking up a new regulator at this point anyway and I came across the hot shot regulator rectifier on the Mike's site - it looks to me like the difference is that the hot shot is a Mosfet Rectifier, is there a significant advantage there over the product in the link you shared?

Edit: google tells me the mosfet device should run cooler and require less voltage. Is that worth the extra 35 bucks? f it, went with the mosfet device. Hopefully will get here Friday.   Still planning on testing the stator this evening, but I've already taken Friday off and I want to ride this weekend.

As always, I appreciate everyone's input - I've said it before, but this has got to be the single best forum of any kind on the interwebz.

[Orange16]

You may bring the Shorai back to life by hooking it up to a large car or truck battery + to + and - to - and just let it sit for a couple of days.

[Barney]

You may bring the Shorai back to life by hooking it up to a large car or truck battery + to + and - to - and just let it sit for a couple of days.

Thanks man!  I hooked it up to the tender for a couple of hours and it held enough juice to get the bike running again, but Shorai will hook me up with a new battery at 50% off as well, so we'll see what happens there. Unfortunately I didn't get to do any work on the thing over the weekend, but I'm hoping to get it back together this evening.

[Barney]

well, couldn't be the f'in easy one, and why would it?  I've got the new rectifier here, but i plugged it in and didn't see any change on the voltage, so I ran the tests on the stator and I'm gettin >50VAC on 2 of the 3 pairs but only ~30 VAC on the 3rd at ~5k RPM - I checked the resistance between all three connections as well, and it's 1.1-1.2 between all of them, but this sounds like the stator's the issue here at this point, right?  

how much of a pain in the ass to do this job?  I haven't found a fantastic write up/video on it, so I'm not sure this is one I'm interested in tackling myself.

In other news, the battery seems to be holding a charge just fine, so maybe I got lucky there?  Shorai offered me 50% off a new one, and I don't have to send the old one back, so I'll probably pick one up anyway...

[Howie]

Unfortunately you need a stator.  Expensive but not difficult.  Get the new battery.

[Barney]

Unfortunately you need a stator.  Expensive but not difficult.  Get the new battery.

Rick's has the stator and it's actually not that bad compared to what I assume the OEM part would cost, so that's cool. I figured when I ordered the RR that I'd keep the it regardless of whether or not it was the issue, but I guess I should've just ordered both at the same time.  Do I need anything other than a gasket to do the job?  I saw one video that mentioned a tool to pull the case apart, but that guy was working on a 1098 or something, so I'm not sure it's the same thing here. Looks like I'll need to drain the oil as well? 

[Howie]

You can do it without the tool, but you may damage something.  A cheap steering wheel puller with the correct bolts will do the job.  Your gasket is Threebond 1215 or similar.

You should have checked stator output before ordering parts.