So my 1098 is in the shop for the second time now for warranty repairs. The first time it needed a new dash and it was there for 2months waiting for parts and getting repaired. Now it is in there again because the low beam went out and the radiator is leaking out of the top. This is bein repaired again under warranty. It has been exactly 3 weeks as of tomorrow and when i called them today for an update they told me the radiator is back ordered. My guess is i'm looking at another 3 weeks before i get it back.
My question to all of you have dealt with warranty issues before is if it is normal to have your bike at the dealer for over a month. This is extredmely frustrating to me since i have had the bike for all of 7months now and about 40% of that time has involved the bike being in the shop.
Quote from: GLantern on December 19, 2008, 07:33:55 PM
So my 1098 is in the shop for the second time now for warranty repairs. The first time it needed a new dash and it was there for 2months waiting for parts and getting repaired. Now it is in there again because the low beam went out and the radiator is leaking out of the top. This is bein repaired again under warranty. It has been exactly 3 weeks as of tomorrow and when i called them today for an update they told me the radiator is back ordered. My guess is i'm looking at another 3 weeks before i get it back.
My question to all of you have dealt with warranty issues before is if it is normal to have your bike at the dealer for over a month. This is extredmely frustrating to me since i have had the bike for all of 7months now and about 40% of that time has involved the bike being in the shop.
My 695 sat in the shop for warranty work for almost 3 months. Just for one problem.
My advice, be polite but firm and ask for frequent updates and timelines.
I'm sure others will chime in too.
When i asked for a phonecall for updates i did not receive one so i have had to contact them several times just to keep up to date. And the timelines seem to always stretch out further and further everytime i talk to them.
How was your dealer when it came to timelines?
Quote from: GLantern on December 19, 2008, 07:43:47 PM
When i asked for a phonecall for updates i did not receive one so i have had to contact them several times just to keep up to date. And the timelines seem to always stretch out further and further everytime i talk to them.
How was your dealer when it came to timelines?
Not that great. But honestly, I blame DNA more than the dealer. DNA drug their feet as far as determining whether it was warranty work and also drug their feet as far as approving each move the dealer techs had to make.
Communication sucked. I always had to call them for updates. For instance, if on a wednesday they (DNA or the dealer) were supposed to call me with an update, they wouldn't. Then I would have to call late Thursday to get an update from anybody.
Does your state have a lemon law for motorcycles? 3 months is well outside the lemon law for most states...
Quote from: NAKID on December 19, 2008, 07:51:56 PM
Does your state have a lemon law for motorcycles? 3 months is well outside the lemon law for most states...
If you're referring to my situation, yes, NC does have a Lemon Law for motos. I thought I'd give my dealer and DNA a chance and I wanted to keep a relationship with them but after 2.5 months, I threatened Lemon Law and the bike was suddenly fixed very quickly. Parts got shipped quicker, my bike got moved to the top of the list.
Well, I was referring to the OP since you have your bike back, but yes, it's interesting how motivated they get when they hear that phrase...
GLattern is in LI (right? lol)
There is no lemon law in NY for MOTORCYCLES. only for cars. ( i looked it up) The shop i went to said 2 weeks backordered.... i was cool about it for 5 weeks and then i started pressuring them and when i got pissed of at them and gave them a deadline to give me a deadline. the parts were available again magically in 2 hours.
Even though its winter time and snowing i wouldnt mind waiting a bit longer. Id ask for a target deadline first.
Ducati here in the UK are very good over warranty work, I got a new hub 6 months past the warranty and a new tank (they gave me a CF over the steel) and that was 14 months past the warranty.
I love them [wine]
I found that I can not rely on my Dealer to call me. I must call them.
Which is fine with me.
I give them a time frame and continue to request updates.
Yes i am in Long Island, NY and there is not a lemon law for motos here. However there is some federal law that can be applied to this situation but i do not want to go that route since it is getting fixed.
So it seems lack of communication with the customer seems to be the standard so far, this is very dissapinting. I worked in customer service for a while and this would have gotten me fired in my field. But it looks like something i am going to have to deal with. Also even though it is winter i still intend to ride whenever the temps are above freezing, i have heated gear ready togo, so to me this is still cutting into my riding. Not as bad as the first defect which was in august and took a huge chunk out of my riding time.
Now i really do not blame the dealer either on the time considering it is DNA who has to approve everything, and since the part is backorderded that is clearly not the dealer's fault. I have contacted DNA with my concerns and hopefully should be hearing from the regional representative to discuss this with them.
As a community this is not something we should take lieing down it is not like DNA is doing us a favor by doing warranty work for us, we payed for these bikes and it would be nice to ride it.
Quote from: GLantern on December 20, 2008, 08:10:18 AM
Yes i am in Long Island, NY and there is not a lemon law for motos here. However there is some federal law that can be applied to this situation but i do not want to go that route since it is getting fixed.
So it seems lack of communication with the customer seems to be the standard so far, this is very dissapinting. I worked in customer service for a while and this would have gotten me fired in my field. But it looks like something i am going to have to deal with. Also even though it is winter i still intend to ride whenever the temps are above freezing, i have heated gear ready togo, so to me this is still cutting into my riding. Not as bad as the first defect which was in august and took a huge chunk out of my riding time.
Now i really do not blame the dealer either on the time considering it is DNA who has to approve everything, and since the part is backorderded that is clearly not the dealer's fault. I have contacted DNA with my concerns and hopefully should be hearing from the regional representative to discuss this with them.
As a community this is not something we should take lieing down it is not like DNA is doing us a favor by doing warranty work for us, we payed for these bikes and it would be nice to ride it.
There is a form that your dealer can fill out to request a part in special circumstances like this - when it is for a warranty bike and the part is back ordered. I wonder if they requested VOR? If we do this our service manager gets us the part as he realizes it is very important. Bikes in for warranty can't sit for months!
VOR my ass.
My valve guides were VOR'ed for 2 weeks after the heads were sitting on a bench for another 2 weeks. Said it was on a boat from Italy. after i start dialed up the pressure a set magically was avaiable in the shop.
I really have to questions the entire idea of "back ordered"..... someone has a part somewhere. They just dont wanna go through the work of finding it. So they just order a new one and charge it DNA or something.
What is VOR? My dealer did mention that they have my bike on some rush order list since it is in for warranty work and can not be ridden.
Just curious do dealers like warranty work? I mean does it take them awhile to get paid from DNA for it?
Would they rather be working on a Cash in Hand customer than a wait for the money warranty?
These are honest questions because I truly do not know how thay operate.
Desmoworks since you are involved with the dealer how long does warranty work usually take in your shopon average, just ? And i would also like to know the answers to the questions that duclvr asked.
Quote from: duclvr on December 20, 2008, 09:56:28 AM
Just curious do dealers like warranty work? I mean does it take them awhile to get paid from DNA for it?
Would they rather be working on a Cash in Hand customer than a wait for the money warranty?
These are honest questions because I truly do not know how thay operate.
All dealers are different. Some (not just Ducati) don't like warranty work as it is often a hassle. There is a lot of paper work that takes time and now a lot of it is on the internet and service managers aren't always computer wizards. Warranty work is done on a hourly basis as specified by the manufacture and paid to the dealer at the posted shop rate. On some jobs it is very hard to meet the times... for example a base gasket on a superbike. The book only allows a few hours, but for anyone who has done it they know it take quite a while.
Anyhow, our shop doesn't mind warranty work at all. We take anything that comes in and try to complete it as quickly and effeciently as possible. We view it as part of the job and part of what you have to do to keep customers happy! Sometimes it is hard to get parts quickly if they are backordered from Ducati, but if you (as a dealer) are working with your service rep and follow the correct procedure it is often possible to make things happen.
Not always though - if the parts don't exist then they don't exist. There is nothing that can be done in this case. They will just have to be ordered and waited for.
Quote from: GLantern on December 20, 2008, 11:12:38 AM
Desmoworks since you are involved with the dealer how long does warranty work usually take in your shopon average, just ? And i would also like to know the answers to the questions that duclvr asked.
Every job varies based on many things. The bike has to be brought in and the problem has to be determined. If it is something simple like the Voltage Regulators on the 848/1098 it takes 20min. If it is bad valve guides on the 1000DS motor it takes much more time. There is a procedure to follow for diagnosis which can take a little time if the issue isn't found immediately.
Once we order the parts if they are in stock with Ducati in Italy we will have them 2-3 business days later and then fix the issue. If they aren't available we will do what we can to find them and if they can't be found we just have to wait for them to be produced like everyone else.
desmoworks thanks for the insight. [thumbsup]
No problem... most is just my opinion and EVERY dealer has their own thoughts on service and warranty.
Thanks a lot desmo, much appreciated its nice to have some insight on this!
Quote from: GLantern on December 20, 2008, 06:29:38 PM
Thanks a lot desmo, much appreciated its nice to have some insight on this!
+1 , sounds like you guys have a good business model. Because VOR'ed to me sound like some guy is actually going to look for the part and express mail it. But i guess its all about the dealer getting the call in and pushing for it to be done.
Glattern are you using the same guys that did your 1098 last time?
Quote from: GLantern on December 20, 2008, 08:25:02 AM
What is VOR? My dealer did mention that they have my bike on some rush order list since it is in for warranty work and can not be ridden.
VOR means vehicle off road. Most manufacturers provide two methods for ordering parts, vehicle off road or supplemental parts order. Think of this as next day mail or second class mail. SPO is less expensive. It is up to the dealer how to order the part. Most manufacturers have some avenue for covering the additional cost of VOR on crucial warranty parts. Ducati has some sort of finagle system and I am not sure how it works. Back order means there are none in the warehouse. This does not prevent the dealer from attempting to find the part at another dealer. Back order is also not always the manufacturer's fault, since many of the parts are outsourced.
Quote from: He Man on December 20, 2008, 07:24:44 PM
+1 , sounds like you guys have a good business model. Because VOR'ed to me sound like some guy is actually going to look for the part and express mail it. But i guess its all about the dealer getting the call in and pushing for it to be done.
Glattern are you using the same guys that did your 1098 last time?
Yes i am, they did me right last time and well its the closest dealer to me and since i got the bike from there i feel like i get treated a little better. The next closest one is goldcoast motorsports but that is 2 hours from my house.
I guess my dealer must have VORed my part, he told me they would be getting it straight from the assembly line.
I'm not really too mad about the whole thing right now just rather upset overall, my experience hasn't been too bad. It just hasn't been great the lack of communication is what really bugs me. And the actual amount of time it takes for this thing to get repaired every single time. From what it sounds like, judging from desmo's words and what my dealer has told me, its more on Ducati's end than anything. Its always waiting for parts or approval, which as a company is not something a customer wants to hear.
Personally i am looking forward to meeting with the regional representative to discuss these issues and would love if more people could chime in with their experiences when it came to warranty repairs.
I have had good luck when it comes to having either my #1 S4Rs , BMW K1200S or !098R worked on just by calling the Dealer ( who happens to sell both Marques ) and make an appt. unless the parts aren't in stock and are already on back order.
That hasn't been a problem so far except when I ordered a Full Termi Exhaust for my #1 S4Rs and it was in the Summer when Ducati and all of Italy takes a month long Holiday ...so it took 3 months to get my exhaust. Dolph
Any dealer with half a brain should love warranty work as they know it'll be paid by the manufacturer and they don't have to worry about the customer not approving the work or paying for it. Some dealers apparently have more of a clue about processing claims and ordering parts than other dealers, and that's really where the problems lie. And yes, VOR means Vehicle Off Road, and all manufacturers have some form of this order type that allows the dealer to order parts in an expedited fashion to prevent long delays in receiving parts. Again, some parts departments out there just don't have a clue about the tools available to them and fail to handle their customers' needs properly because of it. Figure out which dealers in your area know what they're doing and your results will invariably be good.
As for back-orders, they're very real and all too common. In a nutshell, often times manufacturers fail to accurately estimate what the demand will be for parts for each model and there will therefore be shortfalls. One particular model may have a higher crash incident rate, thus resulting in increased demand for those body parts or radiators, gas tanks, whatever it may be. They may have a bad batch of a particular part, which spikes the need for that part sooner than the supplier can get stocks to the manufacturer, also resulting in a sudden shortfall and hence a back-order. Smarter manufacturers always keep on hand a small reserve of critical parts for those heat cases that will arise that must be handled outside the normal channel of parts distribution, but this is not always the case. Even the largest warehouse runs out of something sometime, so back-orders are a part of life in the parts business. DNA is working on establishing a North American parts distribution network that will, eventually, rectify the current lag in response time on parts orders and increase stock and minimize back-orders. It can certainly only get better.
Update, long story short i contacted DNA with my concerns and they got right back to me! My radiator shipped out today from Italy and to top it off my dealer , formula one motorsports, lost their ducati mechanics ??? DNA however will be taking my bike, on their dime, to a much better dealer about an hour from this one getting it repaired then arranging bringing it back to me. I asked for a closer one but they insisted that the new dealer, gold coast motorsports, has a top notch team and they want my bike taken care of. And the DNA rep said she will be emailing/calling me regularly with updates and to make sure everything is take care of to my satisfaction.
+1 to DNA you guys made a bad situation right!
Now i wonder if F1 will ever call me with any updates about these happenings [roll]
I know one of the guys that works at Gold Coast.
You are in good hands I think.
Quote from: ducpainter on December 22, 2008, 02:30:46 PM
I know one of the guys that works at Gold Coast.
You are in good hands I think.
Your the 4th person to tell me that today, good to hear duc [thumbsup]
I had my bike worked on at Gold Coast, good guys, if you can stop by, they are really nice to talk to. They were recommended by Steve and Jay at ECS, and those guys are top notch. not sure if they opened up a shop that accepts warranty work yet though.
Eitherway, if the parts are in then you should be fine. As long as they dont outsource the work to Fast by Ferrachi....
Quote from: He Man on December 22, 2008, 03:55:04 PM
I had my bike worked on at Gold Coast, good guys, if you can stop by, they are really nice to talk to. They were recommended by Steve and Jay at ECS, and those guys are top notch. not sure if they opened up a shop that accepts warranty work yet though.
Eitherway, if the parts are in then you should be fine. As long as they dont outsource the work to Fast by Ferrachi....
Steve and Jay at ECS are not a dealer.
Only dealers can do warranty work.
Steve and Jay are both great guys, excellent techs, and good friends.
Quote from: He Man on December 22, 2008, 03:55:04 PM
I had my bike worked on at Gold Coast, good guys, if you can stop by, they are really nice to talk to. They were recommended by Steve and Jay at ECS, and those guys are top notch. not sure if they opened up a shop that accepts warranty work yet though.
Eitherway, if the parts are in then you should be fine. As long as they dont outsource the work to Fast by Ferrachi....
I do intend on stopping in to meet the people working on it when i get the chance. And my part should be here in 2-3days, DNA confirmed it shipped this morning
No offense but is ducati outsourcing more of their parts.
There seems to be alot more early failures on the new
models. I guess that is how they are staying a float.
They said they were cutting costs. I seen the new streetfighter
at the Int.Cycle show. It looks good but man you look close
and there is alot of cheap plastic and nothing lines up right!
I've read a lot of this on the www.ducatispot.com/ 1098 / 848 forum. I'm astounded at the lengthy turn around times.
My 848 has been in the shop 3 times for warranty work. Radiator and regulator issues where both fixed at 2 different dealers in less than a day.
Tank leak took a few days because they had to get permission from DNA to give me a tank off a new bike. DNA came through [thumbsup]
I hear of bikes in shops for months with these same KNOWN sbk issues...
wow. That's f'ing sucky.
Not normal from my experience in California (where there are a lot of Ducati.)
Side note on new bike issues: I'm in Industrial Design and manufacturing. Everything new has manufacturing issues whether its cell phones or Super Bikes. It's just the reality of taking something to market and the price you pay for having the latest thing. (& why there's a warranty)
I got this 848 knowing this, AND counting on quick turn around from my dealers.
That said, premium brands do well when this stuff is forecasted and solved so customers have good experiences. That's why we're willing to pay more. No one wants to see cheaper parts thrown in to save a few bucks. That's just not the brand I bought into.
I liken to APPLE computer. They got cheap once and they almost went out of business. Everyone else does that WAY better. Then they got innovative and now they rule the market as the premium tech brand. ie iMac, iPod, iPhone, iTunes... They do not compromise on manufacturing quality and innovation. They stay ahead. People are willing to pay for it.
If I wanted cheap and practical I'd buy a Honda. They do that WAY better.
So far I love this 848 and hope/pray Ducati stays Ducati. [thumbsup]
Quote from: ducpainter on December 22, 2008, 03:57:33 PM
Steve and Jay at ECS are not a dealer.
Only dealers can do warranty work.
Quote
not sure if they opened up a shop that accepts warranty work yet though.
When they were working on my forks Steve said he wanted to get a larger shop a little closer to the city and become a dealer.
Quote from: He Man on December 22, 2008, 04:44:30 PM
When they were working on my forks Steve said he wanted to get a larger shop a little closer to the city and become a dealer.
They would be an awesome dealer.
Not sure if Jay wants to give up his winter gig though.