I want to use Mobil 1 20/50 full synthetic for V-Twins, along with a K&N oil filter. The Mobil 1 oil is available at Wal Mart for only $8.50 per quart. I like this as opposed to using Shell synthetic blend for a higher price.
I change my oil every 2,500 miles.
Any pros or cons to this choice? 2007 S2R 1K. ???
Use a regular synthetic automobile oil....
it's a quality oil just like their 4T 10w40. make sure your temp range is right though, if you are in the USA, I wouldn't use it unless you live in SoCal or somewhere the temp never goes below 50 F in the winter.
Quote from: NAKID on January 05, 2010, 05:42:11 PM
Use a regular synthetic automobile oil....
+1. The V-twin oil was designed for Harley type engines that run at lower RPMs than high perfromance Ducatis. I run regular Mobil 1 oil in my Duc with no problems.
Scott
Quote from: NAKID on January 05, 2010, 05:42:11 PM
Use a regular synthetic automobile oil....
I used Mobil 1 synthetic automobile oil on my Duc 900 SS and had no problems for 13,000 miles, but my neighbor, who manages an MC shop, convinced me to go with motorcycle specific oil.
Quote from: scott_araujo on January 05, 2010, 06:39:18 PM
+1. The V-twin oil was designed for Harley type engines that run at lower RPMs than high perfromance Ducatis. I run regular Mobil 1 oil in my Duc with no problems.
Scott
I figured that the Mobil 1 V-Twin oil was designed for a Harley, but Mobil 1 also makes a full synthetic sport bike oil. I thought that the characteristics of the S2R 1k motor were closer to a Harley V-twin than to a high revving sport bike.
Actually, the S2R 1K is probably a "tweener." Not quite like a Harley V-twin, but not quite like a high revving sport bike.
Quote from: ducatiz on January 05, 2010, 05:43:11 PM
it's a quality oil just like their 4T 10w40. make sure your temp range is right though, if you are in the USA, I wouldn't use it unless you live in SoCal or somewhere the temp never goes below 50 F in the winter.
Thanks! I live in So Cal, and 50 degrees is getting pretty darn cold! 8)
(10 miles from Mexicali) [evil]
Quote from: Desert Dust on January 05, 2010, 07:35:47 PM
I figured that the Mobil 1 V-Twin oil was designed for a Harley,
Moto specific oils are usually intended for wet clutches, which we don't have to worry about...
Quote from: NAKID on January 05, 2010, 07:39:50 PM
Moto specific oils are usually intended for wet clutches, which we don't have to worry about...
Excelent point!
Quote from: Desert Dust on January 05, 2010, 07:38:24 PM
Thanks! I live in So Cal, and 50 degrees is getting pretty darn cold! 8)
(10 miles from Mexicali) [evil]
El Centro? There are some nice roads going up towards the mountains...
I run 10w40 but wasn't going to mention it to avoid the holy war ;) As mentioned it covers most temps for riding season most places in the US. I get colder temps here in Portland and take occasional winter rides. 10w40 covers me for the whole year here.
Unless an auto oil is marked as being 'energy conserving' or having 'friction reducers' it should be ok for use with a moto wet clutch. Some of us (800's) still have wet clutches. Of course some oils cause slipping for some people with some clutches. That said, don't be afraid to try/use a good quality auto oil.
Tweener?!?!? I don't know about that. If someone asks me if my Monster is more like a Harley or an R6 I know what my answer is! ;) That said if all I had was V-twin oil I'd use it and move on.
Scott
Quote from: NAKID on January 05, 2010, 07:39:50 PM
Moto specific oils are usually intended for wet clutches, which we don't have to worry about...
They are also designed to deal with the higher shearing forces in moto engines coming from the transmission gears...which car oils do not have to deal with. Have you already forgotten everything from the old oil thread? [cheeky]
Personally I stick with moto specific synthetic oils...usually Motul (40 wt.) as it is easiest for me to get and "reasonably" priced.
Lots of people use regular synthetic without problems though...so whatever you are comfortable with.
No! Nooooo!!!! Not another oil thread!!!!!
[laugh]
I do admit that part of the reason I use Mobil 1 is that it is more convenient and cheaper to get than synthetic moto oil. Not much though on either count. I also think that regular oil changes with anything decent are way more important than the specific brand/type/weight oil you use. Just how I live my life. You're free to do whatever you want.
How did I let myself get sucked into another oil thread [bang]
Just a side question if anyone knows on the Mobil 1 V-twin....
Since Harley engines don't share the oil between engine and tranny, does this oil have any special shear qualities?
Scott
Quote from: scott_araujo on January 06, 2010, 08:08:03 AM
Some of us (800's) still have wet clutches.
Yup, but he has an S2R1000, as do I. That's why I said "we"...
Since someone started another oil thread... ;D
Keep in mind that harley does not use a unit construction like Ducati
Neither does any car maker.
"Unit construction"? What's that?
Scott
Quote from: scott_araujo on January 06, 2010, 12:31:45 PM
"Unit construction"? What's that?
Scott
Now I know how old you aren't. [laugh] [laugh] [laugh]
Unit construction refers to an engine and gearbox in the same cases.
It was a selling point of the 60s and 70s Triumphs and BSAs over Norton that used a separate gearbox.
It definitely poses different lube requirements.
Yes, knew that but didn't know what it was called. Yes, different when they're together in the same case. Does Harley have the clutch in the engine case or is that out back in the tranny?
Scott
Quote from: scott_araujo on January 06, 2010, 01:44:16 PM
Yes, knew that but didn't know what it was called. Yes, different when they're together in the same case. Does Harley have the clutch in the engine case or is that out back in the tranny?
Scott
Harley clutches run in a separate primary case.
Now that's three cases. I'm back to confused :P
Scott
Quote from: scott_araujo on January 06, 2010, 02:06:52 PM
Now that's three cases. I'm back to confused :P
Scott
Not as black and white as it seems eh?
I prefer Shell Rotella T synthetic 5-40, it's an excellent oil and is rated for transmissions. It's also very inexpensive and is available at walmart and autozone.
Quote from: cduarte on January 06, 2010, 03:02:05 PM
I prefer Shell Rotella T synthetic 5-40, it's an excellent oil and is rated for transmissions. It's also very inexpensive and is available at walmart and autozone.
Back in the day
we worried about our 2 smoker trannys.
At the time the hot set up was Spectro Golden gear.
Keep in mind it was tranny/clutch only.
We ran 2T in the motors.
Quote from: arai_speed on January 05, 2010, 08:25:08 PM
El Centro? There are some nice roads going up towards the mountains...
That's right! El Centro. Going up to Julian is a nice ride. Lately we've been riding on highway 94 towards Tecate. At this time of year, I'm a bit weary of ice patches on the way to Julian. [moto]
Quote from: scott_araujo on January 06, 2010, 08:31:03 AM
No! Nooooo!!!! Not another oil thread!!!!!
[laugh]
I do admit that part of the reason I use Mobil 1 is that it is more convenient and cheaper to get than synthetic moto oil. Not much though on either count. I also think that regular oil changes with anything decent are way more important than the specific brand/type/weight oil you use. Just how I live my life. You're free to do whatever you want.
How did I let myself get sucked into another oil thread [bang]
Just a side question if anyone knows on the Mobil 1 V-twin....
Since Harley engines don't share the oil between engine and tranny, does this oil have any special shear qualities?
Scott
According to the declaration on the Mobil 1 container, the V-twin oil is designed for air-cooled engines, transmissions, and wet clutch primaries. Should we believe them ??? I do agree, though, regular oil changes are a must. [bow_down]
i use old bacon grease. makes me make the beast with two backsing hungry though [evil]
Quote from: Desert Dust on January 06, 2010, 04:52:40 PM
According to the declaration on the Mobil 1 container, the V-twin oil is designed for air-cooled engines, transmissions, and wet clutch primaries. Should we believe them ??? I do agree, though, regular oil changes are a must. [bow_down]
Well if it's not designed for Harley's at least it's being marketed to them. ;)
Quote from: deepak8612 on January 06, 2010, 05:30:14 PM
i use old bacon grease. makes me make the beast with two backsing hungry though [evil]
I used to use leather knee pucks...they would smoke up during use and they smelled like bacon afterward. [thumbsup]
A word of caution about using modern, non moto specific car oils. The wet clutch issue is just one issue. In the last few years, the EPA has mandated lower content of zinc and phosphorus in automotive oil needed for extreme pressure, like transmission gears and camshafts. They have also reduced standards on temperature. This means the oil designed for your car may not offer the same protection as moto specific oils. Most of the tests on the interwebs were done before these changes took place.
Good to know Howie. Those compounds are really important in moto engines. Guess I'll ahve to drive those few extra miles for moto oil next change.
Scott
i use sperm whale oil mixed with gunbutter.
We need to save the whales. [bacon]
Quote from: Desert Dust on January 07, 2010, 02:56:11 PM
We need to save the whales. [bacon]
so that we always have them for good sea steaks
If I remember correctly, after 50+ pages on the old site, http://avlube.com/mob1mx104cyc1.html (http://avlube.com/mob1mx104cyc1.html) this was the oil to use.
I use the 4t and Klotz. Both are more than acceptable.
Quote from DP
QuoteUnit construction refers to an engine and gearbox in the same cases.
It was a selling point of the 60s and 70s Triumphs and BSAs over Norton that used a separate gearbox.
It definitely poses different lube requirements.
For the sake of historical accuracy I think the plot thickens even more since the unit construction Triumphs and BSA's still used separate compartments within the unit case for engine oil and gearbox oil - unlike our Duc's the two lubes did not intermix. The main selling point for the unit construction was getting rid of the external chain between the motor and the gearbox.
I know this is an oil thread, and should not be encouraged...but I've always wondered just how much difference there actually is between all of these different specialty oil products you see on the shelves these days. Does the additive package used to turn regular Mobil 1 into "V-twin" oil (for instance) really justify the extra cost? Especially if you change your oil well before the stated service life is up, as almost everybody here seems to do?
Quote from: AndrewNS on January 08, 2010, 02:17:08 AM
I know this is an oil thread, and should not be encouraged...but I've always wondered just how much difference there actually is between all of these different specialty oil products you see on the shelves these days. Does the additive package used to turn regular Mobil 1 into "V-twin" oil (for instance) really justify the extra cost? Especially if you change your oil well before the stated service life is up, as almost everybody here seems to do?
dig around on the web, there are a few engineers who have taken off-the-shelf oils and compared them chemically
yes, there is a difference is the upshod, but hte differences may be minimal.
howver, recent changes to oil to meet EPA requirements may have affected the difference and it may be greater.
My Honda Civic has 193k miles on it. I've used every kind of oil in it: Jiffy Lube, good name brand dino, expensive synthetics, high mileage varieties, generic cheap store brand recycled. Compression is great and it runs just fine. For this reason I think regular oil and filter changes are more important to engine life than the specific oil.
Now there are some oils you should definitely not use with a wet clutch. Beyond that, some oils are probably a little better for motos than others. Does anyone know of anyone who had a moto engine or transmission failure in any bike related directly to the choice of oil? If not, it's probably less important than all the oil thread make it out to be.
Scott
Quote from: scott_araujo on January 08, 2010, 06:27:30 AM
Does anyone know of anyone who had a moto engine or transmission failure in any bike related directly to the choice of oil? If not, it's probably less important than all the oil thread make it out to be.
Scott
I don't think failure is the main problem. I bought a honda CB350 years ago that had a slippy clutch and the gears wouldn't shift right. It just felt effed up -- the guy sold it to me for 200 bucks thinking it was a bad gearbox. He had changed the clutch plates several times and it was still slipping.
I did what I always do when I can't figure out what's wrong: Change the oil. I don't know what he had in the box, but I put in a moto oil, I think it was Valvoline 4T, I don't remember.
Long story short, the problems disappeared completely after about 20 miles. it was like night and day. I never bothered asking what oil he put in, but something tells me he bought his 10w40 car oil by the gallon and just threw that in. Many car oils are "energy conserving" and will make your wet clutch slip like an old whore.
Quote from: AndrewNS on January 08, 2010, 02:17:08 AM
I know this is an oil thread, and should not be encouraged...but I've always wondered just how much difference there actually is between all of these different specialty oil products you see on the shelves these days. Does the additive package used to turn regular Mobil 1 into "V-twin" oil (for instance) really justify the extra cost? Especially if you change your oil well before the stated service life is up, as almost everybody here seems to do?
See here:
http://motorcycleinfo.calsci.com/Oils1.html (http://motorcycleinfo.calsci.com/Oils1.html)
Absolutely! That's one of the cases where a non-moto compatible oil was put in. That's bad. And some bikes/clutches are more sensitive to it and should be treated accordingly. Even two bikes of the same year and model may behave differently.
For me, I felt no difference at all between Motul moto oil and Mobil 1 car oil. I had tried Motul specifically to see if the tranny and clutch would feel any different, they didn't. In a case like that, I don't know that it makes any significant difference.
Scott
Quote from: ducatiz on January 08, 2010, 06:39:51 AM
I don't think failure is the main problem. I bought a honda CB350 years ago that had a slippy clutch and the gears wouldn't shift right. It just felt effed up -- the guy sold it to me for 200 bucks thinking it was a bad gearbox. He had changed the clutch plates several times and it was still slipping.
I did what I always do when I can't figure out what's wrong: Change the oil. I don't know what he had in the box, but I put in a moto oil, I think it was Valvoline 4T, I don't remember.
Long story short, the problems disappeared completely after about 20 miles. it was like night and day. I never bothered asking what oil he put in, but something tells me he bought his 10w40 car oil by the gallon and just threw that in. Many car oils are "energy conserving" and will make your wet clutch slip like an old whore.
Quote from: ducpainter on January 06, 2010, 03:52:45 PM
Back in the day
we worried about our 2 smoker trannys.
At the time the hot set up was Spectro Golden gear.
Keep in mind it was tranny/clutch only.
We ran 2T in the motors.
Spectro is good stuff. The only oil I ran in my 2 stroke saabs (besides genuine saab oil) was spectro golden
i picked up some oil down at AMS recently. Marty sold it to me because its the "double ester" blend. I asked "what's that mean?". "It has more ester." hahaha, right. whatever, dump it in and worry about something else more important.
Quote from: ato memphis on January 08, 2010, 09:20:27 AM
i picked up some oil down at AMS recently. Marty sold it to me because its the "double ester" blend. I asked "what's that mean?". "It has more ester." hahaha, right. whatever, dump it in and worry about something else more important.
Esther. It's the woman who pisses in the oil.
well i got extra.
Esther....
Classic Battles: Fred Sanford vs Aunt Esther (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sv-_eoi4W3M&feature=related#normal)
sorry about the jack.... ;D
A few ythemselves recommended using Pennzoil Gold for Diesel pickups as it was readily available and it was excellent ,my old HD went 134,000 miles with no damage .Even now when HD oil which is expensive is available i recommend the Pennzoil Gold instead as its much cheaper.
in my Ducati S4 here I use Motul 10-40w Synthetic and in UK I use Putoline 10-40w Semisynthetic in the 750ss and M750.
Quote from: ducpainter on January 08, 2010, 01:35:39 PM
sorry about the jack.... ;D
it's refreshing to have something new to add to an oil thread. maybe someone should add Ethel to the next fuel thread?
Quote from: ducpainter on January 08, 2010, 01:35:39 PM
Esther....
Classic Battles: Fred Sanford vs Aunt Esther (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sv-_eoi4W3M&feature=related#normal)
sorry about the jack.... ;D
make the beast with two backs you nate, i am laughing so hard i am crying!
i used to watch Sanford & Son when I was little with my pop, God rest his soul, that was his favorite show on TV-- that and the honeymooners.. oh man..
"Fred you miserable old snaggle tooth jackass!"
"Old?!"
QuoteFred Sanford you look like a messy fool....
Esther....
you look like a cessy pool. ;D
Couldn't find it on youtube...
the all time best Sanford and Son 'Fred and Esther' bit. [thumbsup]
Can we make this thread a Sticky???
Motul 300V 15w-50 full ester class IV synthetic. [thumbsup]
Quote from: 10/10ths on January 13, 2010, 02:09:26 PM
Motul 300V 15w-50 full ester class IV synthetic. [thumbsup]
At $14.00 per quart? ???
Quote from: Desert Dust on January 13, 2010, 05:06:38 PM
At $14.00 per quart? ???
no kidding, I'll take Shell Rotella T synthetic 5-40 at $19/gallon... [moto]
Quote from: Desert Dust on January 13, 2010, 05:06:38 PM
At $14.00 per quart? ???
that's cheap , overhere that stuff is 15â,¬
Just spoken to a major Ducati repairer and tuner in UK and he says he only uses and recommends ... MOBIL 1 for autos so long as its the 5-50w or 15-50w dont bother with 10-40w as it breaks down much faster.
Oh and my brother who is a PHD engine designer for Ricardos the worlds main consultancy for all the big auto makers agrees ...so i am convinced and the S4 will get Mobil1 from now on .
I miss George CLS
Quote from: lwszabo on January 14, 2010, 11:44:38 AM
I miss George CLS
Yes. I'll always remember George although I only knew him through his forum posts. It's very much a shame that the knowledge and experience that he so patiently shared with us is being forgotten.
Bob
Quote from: Langanobob on January 14, 2010, 12:56:54 PM
Yes. I'll always remember George although I only knew him through his forum posts. It's very much a shame that the knowledge and experience that he so patiently shared with us is being forgotten.
Bob
Most of us only knew him through this medium.
Not everyone has forgotten. [thumbsup]
Here is a link to a thread that Zarn02 put together by judicious editing of the old oil thread.
http://ducatimonsterforum.org/index.php?PHPSESSID=scpjj6fd6ebu19ubtndjjhblu5&topic=1912.msg21766#msg21766 (http://ducatimonsterforum.org/index.php?PHPSESSID=scpjj6fd6ebu19ubtndjjhblu5&topic=1912.msg21766#msg21766)
Last time I posted this link DP said he had to edit the link, maybe he can do it again if needed? I think a lot of Georgecls's posts are in there but I haven't re-read it for a long time.
Quote from: Langanobob on January 14, 2010, 01:03:07 PM
Here is a link to a thread that Zarn02 put together by judicious editing of the old oil thread.
http://ducatimonsterforum.org/index.php?PHPSESSID=scpjj6fd6ebu19ubtndjjhblu5&topic=1912.msg21766#msg21766 (http://ducatimonsterforum.org/index.php?PHPSESSID=scpjj6fd6ebu19ubtndjjhblu5&topic=1912.msg21766#msg21766)
Last time I posted this link DP said he had to edit the link, maybe he can do it again if needed? I think a lot of Georgecls's posts are in there but I haven't re-read it for a long time.
Should we sticky that link?
Quote from: The Architect on January 14, 2010, 03:25:34 PM
yes
11ty billion. Best oil thread by far. Much higher signal to noise ratio than the rest.
Scott
Before everyone gets all excited.
The contents of that thread are borrowed from another forum.
There may be things we need to be wary of before posting it in that form as a sticky.
I'll let you know.
The contents of that thread are largely produced by members here. The 'other' board doesn't have a greater right to it than we do.
That thread is the best thing I have ever found on the internet.
Quote from: Dan on January 15, 2010, 01:46:23 AM
The contents of that thread are largely produced by members here. The 'other' board doesn't have a greater right to it than we do.
Maybe you'll get assigned to the trial your honor... ;D
Nate if you want a legal opinion on the matter, I can write one.
But no copyright was asserted by the owners of the board at the time the thread was created/updated. I don't know if the current owners assert a copyright or not, but one cannot go back in time and change the sign-up agreement that all those users agreed to originally and insert a copyright.
besides, it would be a really difficult road for them to try to assert the rights to the writings of others without that express original agreement, and they'd have to get registration before suit anyhow.
Quote from: ato memphis on January 15, 2010, 05:45:38 AM
besides, it would be a really difficult road for them to try to assert the rights to the writings of others without that express original agreement, and they'd have to get registration before suit anyhow.
not with copyright, they are automatic under Berne. merely by asserting it.
If the thread does become a sticky, I think maybe it should be locked to prevent it turning to garbage like other oil threads do without the stewardship of Georgecls.
But locking it also prevents new discussion of new oils, new motors and other pertinent questions. So in my mind at least we have a bit of a dilemma.
Bob
Quote from: Langanobob on January 15, 2010, 06:50:09 AM
If the thread does become a sticky, I think maybe it should be locked to prevent it turning to garbage like other oil threads do without the stewardship of Georgecls.
But locking it also prevents new discussion of new oils, new motors and other pertinent questions. So in my mind at least we have a bit of a dilemma.
Bob
I agree it should be locked...we'll never keep it clean.
New threads can discuss new brands, technologies, and opinion.
BTW it's stickied. I modified the title a little in Georges honor. If you guys don't like it I'll change it back...just let me know.
Sticky and locked [thumbsup]
Thanks DP.
Good title [thumbsup]
Good work. I like the title and also that we can see that Zarn02 is responsible for compiling it. Without Zarn02's work the thread would have indeed been lost.
Bob
on my last oil change I used the mobil 1 instead of the recommended motul oil and I have noticed some "clutch slip" on my 695. wondering if the "non recommended" oil has anything to do with it??? anyone with similar prblm?
Quote from: ridingrabbit on April 05, 2010, 08:37:43 PM
on my last oil change I used the mobil 1 instead of the recommended motul oil and I have noticed some "clutch slip" on my 695. wondering if the "non recommended" oil has anything to do with it??? anyone with similar prblm?
Which Mobil1 did you use?
Quote from: ducatiz on April 06, 2010, 01:42:57 AM
Which Mobil1 did you use?
Mobil 1 full synthetic, 20/50 for air-coled V-twins
Mobil 1 full synthetic, 20/50 for air-cooled V-twins
Quote from: ridingrabbit on April 06, 2010, 07:03:01 AM
Mobil 1 full synthetic, 20/50 for air-cooled V-twins
That's not the same as the MX4T.
The V twin oil is intended and was developed for Harleys that have a separate trans and primary drive.
I don't
think the same oil is recommended for the primary case which houses the clutch...I could be wrong.
Quote from: ducpainter on April 06, 2010, 03:01:02 PM
That's not the same as the MX4T.
The V twin oil is intended and was developed for Harleys that have a separate trans and primary drive.
I don't think the same oil is recommended for the primary case which houses the clutch...I could be wrong.
http://www.mobil.com/USA-English/Lubes/PDS/NAUSENPVLMOMobil1_Motorcycle_Oils.asp (http://www.mobil.com/USA-English/Lubes/PDS/NAUSENPVLMOMobil1_Motorcycle_Oils.asp)
both are JASO MA rated, basically the same oils except for the viscosity rating.
"Optimized wet clutch performance."
I don't know why you'd be having clutch slip with Mobil1 VTwin, but of course the clutch could be worn...