Is there a special trick to that allen bolt underneath the seat that hold the gas tank?
I am trying to remove the tank to get to the battery and that bolt under the seat wont loosen.
Mine came right out on my 1100. It had loctite on it, so it took a little muscle to snap it loose the first time. [thumbsup]
actually the bolt just kinds of spins as if it were stripped ( I- per se- didn't strip it) but it rotates with tension and then kind releases tension then tensions again in the same spot.
uh not good
that bolt is seated in the fuel tank, so sounds like you striped plastic of the fuel tank around the nut.
Quote from: Raux on November 29, 2010, 01:31:00 PM
uh not good
that bolt is seated in the fuel tank, so sounds like you striped plastic of the fuel tank around the nut.
+1
it's cross threaded. An old trick is to get a flat head under the screwdriver and press down on the handle, to sort of "pull" the bolt away, and then turn it with a ratchet.
I'm trying to help, so forgive me if this seems like an idiotic question.....
When you're attempting to loosen the allen bolt from underneath.... you're not just using the one allen key on the underneath side are you? You're also holding its corresponding mate on the above side with another allen key to prevent it from spinning in the plastic, right?
Sorry. I had to ask.
@ 671M90- yea, tried that. Shoved a flat head in between the bolt head and the washer and 'pried' the bolt away from the washer to see if it would catch the thread.
@ungeheuer = *hopeful* there is a another allen bolt? on the other side (topside where the tool bag and small storage space is) because all i see is the part of the tank that the bolt underneath is attached to.
Ungeheuer... no nut... it's molded into the bottom of the fuel tank at the tail.
or can you stick an allen wrench through the top... damn now i have to go look...
I'm assuming you mean this bolt. My exhaust bracket is removed so yours will look a little different.
(http://i885.photobucket.com/albums/ac51/rllout/tankscrew/tankscrew001.jpg)
Raux is correct it's molded into the tank with nothing on top to hold back with.
Top of tank
(http://i885.photobucket.com/albums/ac51/rllout/tankscrew/tankscrew005.jpg)
Bottom of tank
(http://i885.photobucket.com/albums/ac51/rllout/tankscrew/tankscrew004.jpg)
Screw put back in after tank removal
(http://i885.photobucket.com/albums/ac51/rllout/tankscrew/tankscrew002.jpg)
(http://i885.photobucket.com/albums/ac51/rllout/tankscrew/tankscrew003.jpg)
So I still agree with Raux that the plastic has stripped away when you intially tried to remove it.
Other than that it should pull right out.
hmmm if you really need you could remove the subframe brace that the tank is attached to.
Quote from: Raux on November 30, 2010, 11:28:38 AM
hmmm if you really need you could remove the subframe brace that the tank is attached to.
That is a possibility. He'd have to remove the exhaust bracket then there are 4 bolts that attach to the subframe and 2 screws that go into the tool carrier thingy.
So it looks like the bolt and/or tank thread is stripped. suggestions on how to back it out [bang]
well this is how I would do it.
first... make sure I'm turning the correct way (sorry had to say it)
take the exhausts and brackets off
drain tank
remove the bolts from the crossmember
unhook the tank (fuel and wiring)
pull the whole part with crossmember out.
then get a better look at your issue.
Quote from: Vinzer_Uno on November 30, 2010, 09:23:53 AM
@ungeheuer = *hopeful* there is a another allen bolt? on the other side (topside where the tool bag and small storage space is).
Yes. There is on my M1100 and there definitely also was on my M696.
Damn I'll go take a bloody photo of it....
Here.... No nut, but the allen bolt which is moulded into the tank has an accessible allen head... see?
(http://farm6.static.flickr.com/5122/5223325522_90527db098_b.jpg)
into which you can insert an allen key to prevent it from spinning in the pastic.... thus..
(https://farm5.static.flickr.com/4106/5223325524_8cc1924539_b.jpg)
Whilst this cant be seen ??? ??? ??? in
DN's pic below...
(http://farm6.static.flickr.com/5287/5222916435_caff1bd799_b.jpg)
...I cant believe they made 2 different designs, I'm guessing in the moulding process
DN's and perhaps yours too got a thin layer of plastic over the top of the allen head hiding it? Maybe have a gentle scratch around that area to see if you can reveal it?
I see found the same place to put your frame stickers.
Quote from: ungeheuer on December 01, 2010, 12:53:11 AM
Yes. There is on my M1100 and there definitely also was on my M696.
Damn I'll go take a bloody photo of it....
Here.... No nut, but the allen bolt which is moulded into the tank has an accessible allen head... see?
(http://farm6.static.flickr.com/5122/5223325522_90527db098_b.jpg)
into which you can insert an allen key to prevent it from spinning in the pastic.... thus..
(https://farm5.static.flickr.com/4106/5223325524_8cc1924539_b.jpg)
Whilst this cant be seen ??? ??? ??? in DN's pic below...
(http://farm6.static.flickr.com/5287/5222916435_caff1bd799_b.jpg)
...I cant believe they made 2 different designs, I'm guessing in the moulding process DN's and perhaps yours too got a thin layer of plastic over the top of the allen head hiding it? Maybe have a gentle scratch around that area to see if you can reveal it?
Hey Ungeheuer, what is the part number listed on your tank.
Only p/n for the fuel tank I have is from the M1100 service CD: 586.3.171.1A
Its the same p/n as quoted for M696.
Quote from: ungeheuer on December 01, 2010, 02:51:31 PM
Only p/n for the fuel tank I have is from the M1100 service CD: 586.3.171.1A
Its the same p/n as quoted for M696.
Mines 586.3.171.1B ??? and it has USA stamped into it.
(http://i885.photobucket.com/albums/ac51/rllout/skins/skins006.jpg)
aha.... so your p/n is the actual real thing.... whereas the number I just quoted is only that listed in my 09 parts CD.... I gotta go find that p/n moulded into my tank then, eh. (Where abouts on the tank is the p/n located DN?).
Interesting that your is marked "USA".... I'm guessing that mine wont be. Must be a different tank for gallons and litres ;).
Or maybe they make em of a differently comprised plastic given the predominance of ethanol in the USA??
Quote from: ungeheuer on December 01, 2010, 03:09:31 PM
aha.... so your p/n is the actual real thing.... whereas the number I just quoted is only that listed in my 09 parts CD.... I gotta go find that p/n moulded into my tank then, eh. (Where abouts on the tank is the p/n located DN?).
Interesting that your is marked "USA".... I'm guessing that mine wont be. Must be a different tank for gallons and litres ;).
Or maybe they make em of a differently comprised plastic given the predominance of ethanol in the USA??
From memory it's on the bottom of the tank up near the ecu. [thumbsup]
Both are valid part #'s.
Vinzer Uno probably has the new 'improved' version, while Ungeheuer has the 'discontinued' version. [roll]
Quote from: Speeddog on December 01, 2010, 03:27:35 PM
Both are valid part #'s.
Vinzer Uno probably has the new 'improved' version, while Ungeheuer has the 'discontinued' version. [roll]
I believe both ung and I have 2009 m1100s so the difference is I probably have the us version.
Yup - my M1100 is a late (Nov or Dec I forget which) 09 build. My M696 had exactly the same tank design and was an early 09 build. I'll check its actual p/n and report back.
So I removed my tank just to check the p/n for y'all. You're welcome 8).
Part number marked on mine is: 586.3.171.1A the same as listed in the parts CD. No destination marking tho (I half expected it to have EU). Its interesting that Ducati seems to have at least 2 tank types one for USA and another for..... everywhere else? Now why would that be?
So I just revisited the parts CD. I always choose the "English" version (but I just checked the German too) and here the fuel tank is listed as 586.3.171.1A. But when you open the parts manual via the US icon.... tank p/n is listed as..... 586.3.171.1B.
Why is it so?
Some of the EU tanks have different vent configurations, for emissions. The plastics on those tanks are the same, trust me. Also sometimes part numbers are made different for when a change in mfg comes in to play. The 1098 has actually 3 different part numbers for the radiator with only one physical change on one of the parts.
As far as your problem with the tank, if the nut is stripped and you cant get it out, take it to your dealer and have the tank replaced under warranty. If they won't do it bring it to me, I will.
USA tanks are designed to comply with the ARB of California. the difference is a blow line for the vent canister.
USA EPA also has SHED testing which tests vapor emissions from the tank. There may be slight variations in the construction, but as far as I have seen, they are all polyamide (nylon).
Quote from: ducatiz on December 03, 2010, 04:54:45 AM...as far as I have seen, they are all polyamide (nylon).
Hmm... so what do you make of this? Here's a pic of my 09 M1100 fuel tank (non-US market)...
(http://farm6.static.flickr.com/5164/5231282174_54859a792e_b.jpg)
...which as I'd suspected, is made of a different material; XLPE = cross-linked polyethylene.
And here again is
DN's 09 M1100 fuel tank (USA type)..
(http://farm6.static.flickr.com/5004/5231285374_c230a82dcd_b.jpg)
.. made from PA = polyamide (nylon) just as
ducatiz has already said.
So why the difference?
What market is the xlpe tank from?
I have pics of UK tanks showing nylon (pa) composition.
The XLPE is from my Australian delivered M1100 (I beleive that in Australia we get Euro-spec bikes, but I'm by no means certain of that).
Quote from: ungeheuer on December 04, 2010, 03:51:14 AM
The XLPE is from my Australian delivered M1100 (I beleive that in Australia we get Euro-spec bikes, but I'm by no means certain of that).
interesting.
i have pics of euro spec bikes with PA tanks
but i think there is a huge difference in what is possible on the old-style tank (i.e. with no panels). xlpe is not as easily finished/painted as nylon.
maybe you should be collecting the production date on the bikes being pictured as well.
maybe the newer bikes already have a better plastic being used
Quote from: Raux on December 04, 2010, 07:08:19 AM
maybe you should be collecting the production date on the bikes being pictured as well.
maybe the newer bikes already have a better plastic being used
the plaintiff in the lawsuit has a 2009 1098 with a nylon tank..
I mean the actual production date.
Like mine is an 09 696 that I bought in mid 08, but for certain there are differences with other 09 696's produced after a certain date. like i had the greyish swingarm.
just saying, they might have changed materials mid year.
Quote from: Raux on December 04, 2010, 11:46:34 AM
I mean the actual production date.
Like mine is an 09 696 that I bought in mid 08, but for certain there are differences with other 09 696's produced after a certain date. like i had the greyish swingarm.
just saying, they might have changed materials mid year.
ah
the date the tank is made is actually cast into the surface near the material mark
see the round clock-like mark here? it has an "08" in the center and 12 pips for the months. 2 pips are missing, so I assume this was made in February 08
pretty much all plastic casting uses this date method.
(http://farm6.static.flickr.com/5004/5231285374_c230a82dcd_b.jpg)