I grew up in West Michigan on beaches and in small towns. I have always been a redwings and tigers fan, but sadly always considered the east side of the state, mainly Detroit, crap. And unfortunately, supposedly so does the rest of the country. And partly its true. Detroit has has seen really hard times.
But because good news doesn't make the news, people aren't aware of the small Renaissance downtown, with new food spots, movies being filmed and a number of (like the rest of Michigan) microbreweries popping down near the ballparks.
Unfortunately many of the old art deco buildings of Detroits great days are still standing empty. An artist took photos of some of these spots in amazing detail. Here are a few. Follow the link at the bottom for the rest. And, if you're ever in the area, honestly, visit Detroit, its an amazing town.
(http://denverpost.slideshowpro.com/albums/001/496/album-192636/cache/detroit08.sJPG_950_2000_0_75_0_50_50.sJPG?1298737671)
(http://denverpost.slideshowpro.com/albums/001/496/album-192636/cache/detroit07.sJPG_950_2000_0_75_0_50_50.sJPG?1298737671)
(http://denverpost.slideshowpro.com/albums/001/496/album-192636/cache/detroit02.sJPG_950_2000_0_75_0_50_50.sJPG?1298737671)
http://blogs.denverpost.com/captured/2011/02/07/captured-the-ruins-of-detroit/2672/ (http://blogs.denverpost.com/captured/2011/02/07/captured-the-ruins-of-detroit/2672/)
I just saw another book on the same subject called "Detroit Dissasembled".
Interestingly, some of the same buildings are featured in both, like the melting clock photo.
http://www.akronartmuseum.org/exhibitions/details.php?unid=1499 (http://www.akronartmuseum.org/exhibitions/details.php?unid=1499)
Having grown up in a 'burb of the Big D, these photos hit home...
I remember looking at buildings for sale downtown before I left in '99. Almost pulled the trigger on a 5-story just 1 block from the river...
I follow a lot of Urban Exploration and LOVE pictures like these.
JM
Reminds me of some the great buildings we have deterorating in Buffalo. :'(
Too bad we lost one of the greatest in the 50's to a parking lot...
RIP...Larkin Building.
Quote from: DesmoDiva on February 26, 2011, 02:33:57 PM
Reminds me of some the great buildings we have deterorating in Buffalo. :'(
Too bad we lost on of the greatest in the 50's to a parking lot...
RIP...Larkin Building.
Similar thing happened here in Denver in the 60's. Started tearing down all the old brick buildings (1850ish time period) to build a new modern space-age city. Thankfully they ran out of money after 20% of them came down.
Quote from: Randimus Maximus on February 26, 2011, 02:40:21 PM
Similar thing happened here in Denver in the 60's. Started tearing down all the old brick buildings (1850ish time period) to build a new modern space-age city. Thankfully they ran out of money after 20% of them came down.
'70's, into the very early '80's were the worst - the era of Big Oil in Denver.
I still remember a lot of the old mansions in Cap Hill that were torn down to build condos.
Quote from: Jerry Attrick on February 26, 2011, 02:51:55 PM
'70's, into the very early '80's were the worst - the era of Big Oil in Denver.
I still remember a lot of the old mansions in Cap Hill that were torn down to build condos.
You would remember "way back then", wouldn't you! ;)
Quote from: Randimus Maximus on February 26, 2011, 02:56:40 PM
You would remember "way back then", wouldn't you! ;)
Good days, those were, sonny boy. ;D
Cool stuff, reminds me of this site: http://www.opacity.us/locations/ (http://www.opacity.us/locations/)
There's another one I can't recall the name of at the moment....
Great pics. You would think they would bring those old buildings back to life. They have been redoing old buildings here in Richmond VA for a while now really bringing the city back to life.
Quote from: Speedbag on February 26, 2011, 03:17:54 PM
Cool stuff, reminds me of this site: http://www.opacity.us/locations/ (http://www.opacity.us/locations/)
There's another one I can't recall the name of at the moment....
Great site, I'm a member over there. So many great pics like the ones in this thread ~
JM
My brother lives in Cleavland and I told him to move into the city since the Coast Guard station is across from the Browns stadium. A lot of city revitalization going on and is a GREAT investment opportunity....Since it's a great idea, he decided to move to the burbs [bang]
What is our fascination with living in the 'burbs [bang]
I have seen many old and wonderful buildings in my life in various states of disrepair. It is a dreadful shame that humanityplaces little or no architectural value on them. Some ,are truly works of art. My advice is if this topic interests you see as much as you can and photogragh it for one day it will be gone. And that will be a shame. Man is his own worst enemy.
Thank you for the links, Detroit looks like it was a wonderful place once upon a time.
who is the mysterious "they" people keep talking about who should save the buildings?
you know...
they
Quote from: badgalbetty on February 27, 2011, 07:31:22 AM
I have seen many old and wonderful buildings in my life in various states of disrepair. It is a dreadful shame that humanityplaces little or no architectural value on them. Some ,are truly works of art. My advice is if this topic interests you see as much as you can and photogragh it for one day it will be gone. And that will be a shame. Man is his own worst enemy.
Thank you for the links, Detroit looks like it was a wonderful place once upon a time.
The fact that these buildings were photographed establishes that they have architectural value. They serve no social and economic value and this is why they are in their current state. If anything, these buildings are eyesores that remind people of what once was, and how crappy things currently are.
Knock the buildings down and salvage any material of value. Sell the land for pennies on the dollar to recoup costs of knocking the building down. Rinse and repeat.
(http://scrapetv.com/News/News%20Pages/Business/images-2/1988-cadillac-cimarron.jpg)
(http://www.businessweek.com/the_thread/brandnewday/Pontiac-Aztek-2002.jpg)
(http://www.chevrolet-carz.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/06/Chevrolet-Vega-Photo.jpg)
i don't think old cars fall into the same category of art deco and so on. but thanks.
I think he's saying those are ruins because the designers ruined them ~
JM
Thats a little harsh I would say. They have had an importance in the past and may still do in the future. I know that owning a building is very expensive and it can fall into disrepair quickly without being used and upkept.
The pyramids serve no purpose really other than millions of people flock to them annually. Should they be knocked down as well? I am guessing the answer is no. At some point I hope these building find a new lease on life.
BGB
I love to see old buildings with interesting architecture salvaged. My wife and I wanted to by the old Theater on Main St here in town and make a brew & view. They wanted $500,000 for the building, but it would take at least that much more to make it usable.
Beautiful place though.
JM
Quote from: DucatiTorrey on February 27, 2011, 01:44:43 PM
i don't think old cars fall into the same category of art deco and so on. but thanks.
Those are the true ruins of Detroit.
Looks like Europe after ww2...... when did the nazis bomb Michigan ?
Quote from: bobspapa on February 27, 2011, 02:00:28 PM
Looks like Europe after ww2...... when did the nazis bomb Michigan ?
Right after they bombed Pearl Harbor.
I was in the Detroit area last year, my wife is from there and still has family in Royal Oak. My favorite comment from my wife was "It's not nearly as crappy as it used to be."
honestly, i think thats true. there is a revival going on. the city is moving the last few families from empty neighborhoods, buying land and tearing down the old stuff.
these example are the really old and amazing buildings, they are still standing for a reason, people want to revive them i think
Where is the money going to come from?
I don't think 'they' are going to come up with it.
Quote from: ducpainter on February 27, 2011, 04:16:11 PM
Where is the money going to come from?
I don't think 'they' are going to come up with it.
I know the answer to that, however board policy prevents me from posting it. ;D
(law abiding citizen that I am, and all.)
Quote from: Jerry Attrick on February 27, 2011, 04:32:50 PM
I know the answer to that, however board policy prevents me from posting it. ;D
(law abiding citizen that I am, and all.)
I appreciate that.
My point is the money doesn't exist for saving those structures. The money does exist for demolition and then...
development.
Quote from: ducpainter on February 27, 2011, 04:34:53 PM
I appreciate that.
My point is the money doesn't exist for saving those structures. The money does exist for demolition and then...
development.
Not sure the money even exists for demolition & redevelopment right now.
Quote from: Jerry Attrick on February 27, 2011, 04:43:26 PM
Not sure the money even exists for demolition & redevelopment right now.
There's some greedy developer that's waiting to buy the land for pennies on the dollar...
no shortage of greed in our society.
unless they can find a developer to renovate/rehabilitate/remodel the structure into a useful facility again, which is what happened with the Book-Cadillac Hotel in Detroit: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Book_Cadillac_Hotel (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Book_Cadillac_Hotel)
There have been efforts to do the same with the Michigan Central Station building, although money and a use remain an issue.
in some cases, the owners of the buildings aren't able to be found.
as such, legal battles ensue over use/demolition rights which is the case with the Packard Plant:
http://www.autoblog.com/2010/07/10/detroit-still-hunting-for-packard-plant-owner/ (http://www.autoblog.com/2010/07/10/detroit-still-hunting-for-packard-plant-owner/)
Quote from: ducpainter on February 27, 2011, 04:47:04 PM
There's some greedy developer that's waiting to buy the land for pennies on the dollar...
no shortage of greed in our society.
Gordon Gekko "Greed is Good" o/ (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vscG3k91s58&feature=related#normal)
the money will come will come from the private sector...... pennies on the dollar is not greed.... thats just selling high and buy'n low.
is there not a deal kings thread?
Quote from: bobspapa on February 27, 2011, 06:03:29 PM
thats just selling high and buy'n low.
Sounds like Bakersfield.
Quote from: MrIncredible on February 27, 2011, 06:21:01 PM
Sounds like Bakersfield.
*I was going to sell my bike...... but I got high
Afroman "Because i Got High" [With Lyrics] (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X-j-gtQArvc#normal)
Quote from: badgalbetty on February 27, 2011, 01:48:01 PM
The pyramids serve no purpose really other than millions of people flock to them annually. Should they be knocked down as well? I am guessing the answer is no. At some point I hope these building find a new lease on life.
BGB
To draw a parallel between he pyramids and any of these buildings is quite a stretch. The pyramids 4500 years old, and you would be hard pressed to find anyone in the world to deny their cultural and architectural significance. These buildings look like ruins after at most, 50 years of neglect. They are not constructed to last 4500 years nor are they really that architecturally significant. I guess that is something we will have to disagree apon.
They make for cool photographs, but the nostalgia escapes me when thinking about renovtions in a pragmatic way. Detroit obviously feels the same way... cash money talks
I just want a creepy old sanatorium.
I haven't visited but I'm fascinated by the truly amazing Gilded Age architecture and yet just how far Detroit has fallen. I'd be surprised if it truly redevelops though, there's no demand. Half the population is gone, and almost 30% of residential lots are vacant. IIRC Detroit has gone from the second highest median income (in major cities) in the US in the early 1900s to dead last.
Looks exactly like that documentary "Life After People". :-\
when I first came to America in 1981 I went to Camden NJ on a ship. That was a reasonably scary place, however I was fascinated by it. I had never seen anything like it and one perception of America we had was that of everyone working,life is good and the complete oppulence. Then I went to Camden. I grew up in a very nice middle class part of London in a small area that has a thousand year history..... Seeing Camden and then going into Philly shocked the hell out of me. However I can appreciate old buildings and find that they are architecturally important.. They are a part of OUR nations history and they did serve a purpose. I prefer to restore no matter the cost as it is part of our heritage.That is of course my own view and seeing as America for the most part is a young country with very few old buildings, I believe to preserve buildings for future generations is culturally important. At the end of the day though, money is money and he who has the gold makes the rules.
If I won the lottery I would completely waste it doing things like restoring these buildings and putting men to work.
Anyone remember Montgomary Ward Dept store that was?
Their old corporate office was in Portland Oregon and was due to be demo'd. It was saved and converted and fixed up. It is know housing several firms and hundreds of people have their work there. It was a good choice to save that building. It is now called Montgomery Park Corporate Center.
I see a value in old things, maybe becuase of my age or experience in life I am not sure, but to lose the past is a sure way for the future to fail.
Just my 02
BGB
Every time I look at the first pic in this thread, I expect to see zombies in Nazi uniforms! Maybe turn the building into a theme park/laser tag arena ;D
BGB, if you're interested in Camden, there's a website where this guy has been shooting photos from the same locations for years to document how they change. He's got Richmond, CA and Harlem in there too but Camden's is by far the best.
http://invinciblecities.camden.rutgers.edu/intro.html (http://invinciblecities.camden.rutgers.edu/intro.html)
Fascinating stuff.
Quote from: MrIncredible on February 27, 2011, 01:27:53 PM
(http://www.businessweek.com/the_thread/brandnewday/Pontiac-Aztek-2002.jpg)
People, can we just have at least one thread that doesn't turn into an Aztek bashing-fest. >:(
Well, the Aztek wasn't the ruin of Detroit as a whole, but Pontiac for sure. [cheeky]
Quote from: pennyrobber on March 04, 2011, 12:55:12 PM
People, can we just have at least one thread that doesn't turn into an Aztek bashing-fest. >:(
Would you prefer be bash the Mayans?
JM
I thought this thread was going to be about a new, first person shooter video game. :-\
Quote from: Grappa on March 04, 2011, 02:02:31 PM
I thought this thread was going to be about a new, first person shooter video game. :-\
Ooh, we should pitch that to a developer. All the maps are old, abandoned buildings and you have to fight off bums, scrappers and meth-heads all while not attracting the police!!!!
JM
wow! I spent quite a bit of time looking at both the Camden NJ and and the Richmond CA pictures having been to both. It seems that when you work on ships the places that are ports of call in some states are truly a nightmare. When I visited these places 30 years ago they looked like they do now for the most part, except in some cases some things have improved. When I went to Richmond CA there was a ghost fleet anchored does anyone know if its still there?30 years ago the ships appeared ready for the breakers.......and the area was pretty rough as well.
Throughout my travels around the world(to about 40 or 50 countries or so) I have taken many pictures and there is one underlying thing in common.....after the greatness comes decay.I have seen it many times. Ship yards,ports and heavy industrial areas are like giant skeletons these days,the meat picked clean and the steel hulks left to fend for themselves against the elements.
In Portland 25 years ago the northwest industrial area was full of hookers ,the down and outs and junkies.........railroad tracks intertwinned various disused warehouses,that were once part of a great economy.....weeds grew in the sidings, roofs caved in on buildings and every now and then a body was found either murdered or with a needle in her or his arm. The property developers moved in... They have revitalized the area and completely transformed it. It is now called the pearl district because at night the lights from the new condos and fancy high rise buildings shine like pearls....light rail, swanky shops and a really nice community has sprung up. Some of the old warehouses have been converted into lofts and they are expensive($400,000+) because of the location. You could be a 10 minute walk from downtown and the business district if you lived there.
Some of the older buildings have remained and I am glad for that. What lies in their future I dont know but these older buildings have an importance. They tell the story of the pacific northwest. Seeing a hundred and fifty year old warehouse support beam that is 18 inches square made from a single piece of wood 75 feet long is beauty to me. Wood like that is not found in second or third generation timber, so yes, these old buildings are worth saving, every time that you can.
BGB
I used to be in commercial real estate and can tell you that saving old buildings, while nostalgic & architecturally eye-pleasing, very often boils down to the costs of retrofitting in order to comply with today's building codes. They may have been built passing the codes of their time, but to meet ADA requirements (especially the requirements to widen load-bearing doorways, which can be tricky), earthquake codes and numerous others, it becomes economically unfeasible to restore. The numbers say it's better to tear them down.
We almost bought a turn-of-the-(20th) century building in downtown Seattle that is very much a architectural gem but before there could be any sale, the city required an immediate, complete top-to-bottom retrofit to meet earthquake codes. No thanks.
Quote from: badgalbetty on March 06, 2011, 06:15:38 AM
When I visited these places 30 years ago they looked like they do now for the most part, except in some cases some things have improved. When I went to Richmond CA there was a ghost fleet anchored does anyone know if its still there?30 years ago the ships appeared ready for the breakers.......and the area was pretty rough as well.
There still is a ghost fleet at Richmond but I believe they are starting to break those up http://sanfrancisco.cbslocal.com/2011/02/03/mare-island-receives-first-vessel-from-mothball-fleet/ (http://sanfrancisco.cbslocal.com/2011/02/03/mare-island-receives-first-vessel-from-mothball-fleet/)
Richmond is slightly better, but it's still one of the most dangerous neighborhoods in the bay. http://richmondconfidential.org/tag/homicide/ (http://richmondconfidential.org/tag/homicide/)
The ghost fleet is in the Suisun Bay, they just starting breaking those things down in Vallejo, at the remnants of Mare Island. Other than the Iowa, which will be saved. [thumbsup]
Richmond is still weird. At least they're trying and making some headway. Vallejo is the other example nearby which it seems is attempting to make itself as screwed up as possible.
If you're interested in awesome old stuff that's saved in Richmond, check these out. They're awesome.
http://www.richmondplunge.org/ (http://www.richmondplunge.org/)
http://www.craneway.com/ (http://www.craneway.com/) (part of the old Ford plant - other parts are sectioned off for industrial use again after 50 years)
The Craneway...awesome pictures!
What an awesome space to have available on the water to boot as well. [thumbsup]
coming from the land of nothing-older-than-1990, it'd be nice to have some older commercial/light industrial buildings around for those of us who'd like to open a small shop, but can't afford the rent a brand new strip mall costs.
Seems that's what we do around here: tear down old buildings and build a mall that sits half vacant. used to be auto dealerships but then yeah, that happened.
I'd love to have an off-site man cave/workshop to share with some buddies but i can't afford it, even split 10 ways. we tried.
That said, it's my understanding the residents of Detroit are getting a little fed up with the decay-journalism.