Ducati Monster Forum

So with Bacon Junkie's help I started tearing apart the wife's '71 CB350 today.

Her seat finally came in from www.dimecitycycles.com (http://) (http://) (http://) (and I can't recommend them highly enough for cafe parts) so we started tearing her down in hopes of getting it in shape in time for DIMBY.

DucStew found this bike in Albuquerque for us. He negotiated the deal and made the purchase. Melissa is only 5'2" and the size of this bike makes her extremely happy. She loves it. Plus its a kick start which makes her just giddy every time she kicks it over. THANKS STEW!

what we are doing is 1) getting it ridable 'cause Polpetta has the moto itch in the worst way and 2) playing around with the look and ergos for a total tear down when we will cafe the thing out totally. Some of the basic overall design ideas are already decided. First I want the bike to look recognizable as a cb 350. There were a few things Honda got right (to my eye, like the tank) and I want to preserve those. It may start veering in the toward the bad ass rat-like feel and not the highly stylized cafe racers you see people building. Less will be more when it comes not only to style and lines, but of course the functional bits as well per the cafe racer ethos. The straight simple exhaust (oppose to the up swept mega phones you see a lot of) is the first step in this direction. For now I will just be bolting new bits on and seeing what I like and don't like.

Here she is coming back to Cali with Bacon Junkie's 999 (did you hear he got one? 'Cause he did.)

(http://a1.sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc4/156381_1723585697772_1482243195_1838284_2081945_n.jpg)

The Seat:

(http://a4.sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-ash4/206223_1672063522885_1276294830_31494348_355262_n.jpg)


Fritzy Pants The Good Time Party Dog is thanking Bacon Junkie for doing such a good job with the removing the old pipes from the header:

(http://a6.sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc6/207278_1674582705863_1276294830_31497832_2005267_n.jpg)

(http://a6.sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-ash4/217713_1672607376481_1276294830_31495021_1788126_n.jpg)

Honda decided this as the best way to hide the wiring   [roll]

(http://a1.sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc6/217628_1970307785670_1482243195_2266577_6417878_n.jpg)

Clubman Bars:

(http://a6.sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc6/216133_1674590186050_1276294830_31497839_1815091_n.jpg)

Today we removed the signals and fenders and got the wheels removed and prepped to have the new tires and tubes mounted. we fit the new pipes and mounted the club man bars. Gotta cut almost 2" off of the bars, but they look great.

Ordered a tail light, brake pads, a throttle tube and a dry cell battery today.

Found some fork gaiters and turn signals that we like, so those will get ordered soon.

This is fun! And a great way to learn a bit more about wrenching on these things. A few years down the road (after I have more money and more knowledge about motorcycles!) I really look forward to tearing this thing apart and making exactly how my wife wants it. This is really the perfect bike for me to do this with. There are a zillion of these things around so parts are cheap and I don't have to worry about make the beast with two backsing up a classic. And it is in good working order so I have to do very little actual mechanical improvement. Replace some gaskets and a some disposable bits (brake pads, spark plugs, etc.) and she'll run like a top. Maybe some carb work but I shouldn't have to crack the engine! Yay!

If you've built a cafe bike feel free to post up pictures. I need ideas to steal inspiration!

Thanks again to DuckStew and Bacon Junkie! You make my wife very happy. And of course happy wife = happy life.   ;D

Cheers.

sac

How old is that front tire?

The tires are . . . drum roll . . . original stock!!   :o   40 years old!!

I've done some stupid stuff on motorcycles but I think doing 50mph on 40 year old tires ranks right up there. Sure was fun though!
 
sac

What a great find. I am so envious. I look forward to seeing the progress. Please update often.  [beer]


You Sir, have way bigger balls than me, thats for sure. ???

Looks like a blast from the past !

Those old Hondas were a lot of fun.

Even as wild as I ride I would never, ever try riding on a 40 year old front tire.   :P

Especially at 50 mph, you could kill somebody. What were you thinking ?   [roll]

You should be ashamed of yourself endangering others .

Dolph

We've got video of us (Duck-Stew, Sac, and me) taking turns riding it before loading it on the truck to bring back to Cali.  I don't have it, but somebody should post it.  It's so stupid it's fun!  [moto]

First gear... all good.  

Second gear...  front end wobble.  
Third gear... no more wobble, but carbs started bucking and spitting.  What fun!  [evil] [moto] ;D


Actually, we were on an access road to Stew's storage shed after hours on a Saturday.  The only thing we were endangering was the fence on one side, and the pristine paint on the concrete wall on the other.  And our reputations as fine, upstanding, contributing members to society.   ;)




[bacon]


Oh, I forgot...  The rear tire was in even worse shape!  [thumbsup]

 [thumbsup]

i like the paint color... as is  [thumbsup]
can't wait to see it with the rest of the bits you ordered

+1

Nothing says '70s like funky metallic gold.  [thumbsup]

If I decide on a different color I'm gonna try to find a used tank to do it on.

sac

 [clap] I am so excited!!! She is going to be so much fun!!!  ;D

I will be back  [moto] on my own bike!

I think Carl and Ryan are looking forward to taking her out too  [thumbsup]

I'm pretty sure my dad still has an old Fulmer that would match that paint perfectly from his KZ days, but that would be yet another blast from the past that I wouldn't call "road worthy". :)

I had a 69cl and put the clubmans on it, tiny. traded it for a bicycle and the guy i traded it too put a cb750 front end on it with some sick racing wheels and rear shocks.  also they run great with flatside carbs on them.  I got it back on a trade for another bicycle then sold it back to dude.  lol I think i owned the bike 4 times.  I wish I still had it..... [bacon]

Yeah, it was stoopid to run a bike w/40 yr old tires at 50mph, but what a HOOT!

Anywho...  Polpetta / SacDuc...  The bike needs a valve adjustment in case you had forgotten... 

That is all, please continue to mod safely.  ;D

Valve adjustment and gaskets are tops on the list. I'm trying to just get her running for now so I can get her to the DMV to get registered. Then the tweaking and tuning starts. Blow some cleaner through the carbs and what not.

sac

Lookin' good!  My first bike that was in similar condition and I learned to work on bikes was a Yamaha XS650.  Fun bike, still regret selling it.

As far as a new tank, I would recommend finding a Benelli tank on ebay.  They have the side "cut outs"/knee dents and look great, plus Italian style!

(http://www.astronomy-pictures.net/telescopes/telescope-image-large/nos-benelli-ducati-cafe-racer-gas-tank-450-mojave_320657571157.jpg)

As far as carburetors, if the gaskets/rubber seem to be in pretty good shape, I would recommend pulling the bowls apart and boiling in a mix of water and Yamaha Carburetor Cleaner Dip.  Use a hot plate in the back yard because it stinks to high hell, but it will remove varnish, goop, and dirt plus won't deteriorate rubbers and gaskets in good nick.

Good luck man, keep posting.  Old bikes are FUN!

Thanks for the suggestions on the carbs.   [thumbsup]

As for the tank, I'm going to keep it a cb350 tank. I ant to keep this bike instantly recognizable as a cb350. That benelli is a pretty though, and there seem to be a lot of them around.

sac

Be careful with the carbs.  There are a few parts that ought not see carb dip for an extended period of time.  In particular, the vacuum chamber covers (I'd say "diaphragm covers, but there are no diaphragms) have plastic tops that don't like harsh chemicals.  The boiling method mentioned below should be OK, though.

The needles and seats are brass, so no troubles there as long as they'll hold back fuel.  Likewise the jets.  These are CV carbs, but they don't use diaphragms.  Rather, they have closely machined clearances with a designed leakage rate to lift the needles/slides, so you don't have to worry about leaky diaphragms.

Carb kits are still available from Honda and are reasonalby priced. Float bowl gaskets are rubber and are almost certainly ruined by now.  There are a couple of fiber gaskets that will be in poor shape when you pull them apart on gallery screws.  There is a rubber o-ring around the mixture screw that should also be replaced.  The vacuum chamber gasket is also fiber and should be replaced after 40 years in service.  All of those things are included in Honda's kit.

Pay careful attention to carbon build-up around the butterfly plates (the ones that move with the throttle cable, not the choke butterflies).  There are bleed holes on the bottoms of the throttle bores that can plug with crap that will cause poor off-idle throttle response if you don't clean them out.

If you don't have a manometer to balance the carbs, you can get close with them off the bike by setting the throttle butterflies to similar openings within their bores via a small "gauge" like a small wire or piece of thin card stock.  Once set, if you need to idle the bike up or down just change both by the same number of turns on the idle screws and you should maintain "balance" near enough.  A manometer works best, though.

Have you considered an electronic ignition for your CB?  In the long term, it's a real reliability enhancer.

The centrifugal oil filter may need a good cleanout, easy job.

I have a 1972 CB350, great little sickle, but with stock forks and rear shocks the handling at speed is atrocious.

 

Ive been working on a my second CB400F for some time now.  This was a true barn find in Westchester, NY.  
Below, I had posted some pics of bikes that inspired me to build cafe bikes or the like.  The red Honda was the one that got me really motivated to do this and is what I modeled(copied) my last CB project from.   I'm looking for the USB drive with the pics of my last CB project so when I find it I'll post.

(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v315/speedknot/cb400street.jpg)
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v315/speedknot/andrewmanx.jpg)

These are just some pics of my current project.  I got the seat from Roccitycafe.  Its just a mock up now.  I'll cut it back a bit.

(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v315/speedknot/P1040249.jpg)
 (http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v315/speedknot/CB400F/P1000290.jpg)
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v315/speedknot/CB400F/P1000286.jpg)

Here is a list of people I've dealt with and had very positive reviews for.  I have a ton of resources and connections for parts and such.  Just PM me and I'll get the list off to you.  BTW, the Dimecity guys are great.

http://z1parts.net/ (http://z1parts.net/)
http://www.caferace.com/Merchant2/merchant.mvc?Screen=CTGY&Store_Code=C&Category_Code=RRBT (http://www.caferace.com/Merchant2/merchant.mvc?Screen=CTGY&Store_Code=C&Category_Code=RRBT)
http://www.sudco.com/Jvintage.html (http://www.sudco.com/Jvintage.html)
http://www.speedmotoco.com/default.asp (http://www.speedmotoco.com/default.asp)
http://www.roccitycafe.com/store.php (http://www.roccitycafe.com/store.php)
http://www.ttr400.com/index.html (http://www.ttr400.com/index.html)
http://www.cb750cafe.com/ (http://www.cb750cafe.com/)

amazing

I LOVE this bike! Good job! I particularly like the front end? where are the forks from? I had been going back and forth as to whether I as going to put a front fender on her. This settles it. No fender.


And thanks for the links to the great sites! That's a huge help!   [beer]

sac

Those look to be standard 400/4 forks spiffed up a bit with an aftermarket fork brace.

Sac, you know I will salute any fool who elects to take this awful path less traveled

Keep the pictures coming!!

After I wrap up the damn G15CSR I think I am buying a Sachs Madass

and tuning it to crack 100 mph if possible

this may help exorcise the demons that I hatched while bringing the Matchless dead back to life

Those Cafe CB's look absolutely stellar!!!! esp the red one

Thanks Rat.

Right now I just want to get her rolling. Call it "Phase 1." But over the months I'll start collecting bits here and there and start working out the design details. Then, one day, one rainy winter day, the insanity will hit me and I'm gonna park that little make the beast with two backser right in my living room and rip her to pieces. Hopefully I won't regret it too much. And hopefully if I collect the bits for her here and there over many months I can convince myself that I really didn't spend a stupid amount of money on her.

Since DuckStew will likely see this bike in person one day I'm going to take my time on the design work though. Simply out of fear of being rebuked too harshly by the master.  ;)  I know he'll go easy on the noob.

sac

More inspiration:

(http://www.motofiaccone.com/images/stories/cb350_cafe_racer/SaltFlats/motofiaccone5.jpg)

(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v92/2-Skinny/DSC_5188.jpg)

(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v92/2-Skinny/cb450caferacer.jpg)

(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v92/2-Skinny/scott_pommier_7.jpg)



These are DIY race-replicas using CBR250RR motors... 14.5K RPM....

(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v92/2-Skinny/4430899620_e0a3ef8835_b.jpg)

(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v92/2-Skinny/4430899400_62d6e5985f_b.jpg)

(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v92/2-Skinny/4430130941_c994312d0d_b.jpg)

you guys are farking killing me.  The benilli tank just arrived today, I guess the RD350 is going to be built alongside the 2vsbk....

damn... looking at these threads really makes me wish i had some kind of space to try to mess around and make one of these...

sigh... apt living and bikes just sucks sometimes

its not apartment lving its you, unless there is a wife in the apt, whats stopping you?

me its the money, everyone and their grandmother is wanting 3k for an old cb 350 or kx 400 in Colorado, they ALL know what you want to do to it.

shame.

no garage to store a disassembled bike/parts... and not being able to take a bike up 21 flights of stairs?  or a management dpt that would allow me to use the elevator even if the bike fit in there?

oooooooooooh highrise living

yeah, basically nixes any ideas about doing anything like this.  i get more jealous looking at everyone garage's most of the time rather than their bikes.  haha

Want.

1) Buy bike and park in the front of your assigned parking spot (covered)
2) Start collecting parts and getting your design together
3) take the engine only into your apartment and make it perfect
4) Engine done, rent a nice storage space for two months and assemble bike.
5) Curse the moto gods because that to month build actually took six months.

sac

i do love the look on the 2 cylidner cb's, but gotta remove the panels, naked as possible baby!  [thumbsup] [thumbsup]

Just saw this thread.......   :'(

I had that same bike (diff color) Sr year in HS and all thru college....brings back fond memories

I believe they were the stock units with aftermarket springs.  I had done the same with polished lowers and Progressive Suspension springs.  I ran the stock springs for a while and switched to the Progressives which made a huge difference in handling.  I also used a similar type of fork brace for mine.  It came off an older HD 1200 Sportster.  Same tube diameter and spacing. 

The gentleman who built the red honda was nice enough to send me some decent picks so if anyone is interested, send me a PM with your email and I'll get them to you.  I've been researching and making connections in this cafe genre for the past 6 years now so if anyone has any questions or needs some info, feel free to ask.  Guys in this field are really cool and more than willing to share info so its only right to do the same. 

Damn, I gotta find these pics of my last build.  The more I look for them and cant find them the more I get nervous that they are lost and just a memory. :'(

Ahhh yes very familiar with this phase....I call it the "Pulling-On-The-Sweater's-Loose-Thread" stage....

It is also known as the "Holy Mothermake the beast with two backs! What The Hell Was That make the beast with two backsing Moron Thinking" stage.....

This is the Discovery/Due Diligence period in which you fully comprehend that the bike was apparently pre-owned in series by a squadron of Village Idiots

Dolts who were equipped with crescent wrenches and 3 bent chewed-up screwdrivers and a few rocks to employ for blunt-force on delicate apparatus

Determined VI's subconsciously bent on Darwinning themselves off the face of the planet (no such luck usually)

Oh and the Bank Account...that comes into play in.....



Phase 2...."The-Point-of-No-Return-Phase"

on this part of the journey you realize that you cannot back-out by re-assembling the project as-is and recoup anything remotely resembling your original investment

you are going to need to spend money to get it back to some viable measure of re-assembly

and you realize that the original purchase price coupled with the cost to reassemble

are far more than what ANYONE would pay you for the bike

You have become the proverbial man in the old joke

who now finds himself too far out in the desert with the crazy camel to abandon the beast

and walk alone back to safety and water....

the camel is no longer satisfied with a hand-job every three miles to keep going....

it wants Oral now in order to continue the journey to the destination


Then there are the parts issues...which may not be as bad with Hondas as they are with certain other bikes

The cottage industry of Repro Parts will have you realizing where the Village Idiots went for employment

after they gave up being motorcycle mechanics

Do not look for In-Spec repro parts....what you will get are 80-90% approximations of the real things...

parts that are pumped and pounded out by exhausted Chinese, Taiwanese and Malaysian sweat-laborers

in factories overseen by QA departments staffed with the Village Idiots



Phase 3 is called the "Bataan Death March" phase....you realize you are captive....you have expended all your resources

and are now on the dull plodding exhausted stagger toward your (now dubious) goal....you revile yourself with every bloody footstep, skinned knuckle or new discovery

of more to be fixed/repaired


Phase 3.5 accompanies Phase 3 it is known as the "There is no Geneva Convention In Marriage" Phase....there is now the spouse...the tender and affectionate lass you knew, loved and married.... who now, has transformed herself into a shrieking WWII Japanese soldier hurling curses at you.....jabbing at you with Bank Statement bayonets as you make your tortured journey

Well I think you get the picture.....

restoration/rehabilitation work is not for the faint of heart...

but if you make the journey yourself...you will never look at someone else's restored machine

with the same eyes you had before you made your own personal Hajj

you alone will see and appreciate the dreadful price that was paid in every unstripped, un-rounded nut and bolt, every shiny rust-free surface

in this innocent-looking finished product

I just love reading RAT's posts...  [clap]


Write a book or something.  I'll buy it!  [thumbsup]







[bacon]

 ;)   I ran out of time...originally was planning to do the full 12 Steps to the abyss

[laugh]

The first step is admitting that you are powerless over the resto, and that your life has become unmanageable.

Came To Believe That Only A Bank Account Greater Than Ours Could Restore Us To Solvency

Made a decision to turn our bike and our checkbook over to the care of a Competent Mechanic as we understood Him.

Made a Lurching and Blameless Inventory of Ourselves

rat's post made me feel better about not having the space to do a project like this.  haha

well, I have a few things going for me. I assume Undue Optimism is a symptom of Phase 1 that will inevitably sink slowly into Phase 2: Resignation and finally into Phase 3: Abject Rage. Oh how like a failing relationship this sounds!

But nonetheless here is what buoys my optimism at the moment:

1) The bike runs! I've ridden the damn thing. I'm not trying to resurrect the dead.
2) Money isn't much of a concern. Not because I have any, I don't. But because I am willing to buy parts bit by bit over time as I can afford them.
3) This isn't an investment. while I'll be keeping receipts I am going to actively try not to keep an accounting of them or to keep track of my hours. This is my wife's bike. It is not intended for sale. She wants to keep it for a long long time.
4) I am completely naive and really have no idea what I am getting myself into. Ignorance is bliss!

sac

Good attitude, Sac.  Now if we could just get the "Cafe Racer" builder wannabes to quit spending entirely too much money on this stuff so that mere mortals could still afford to buy decent iron we'd have it licked!

Keep posting pretty pictures along the way!

Anyone have strong opinions either ay about flat number plate side panels like the ones in this picture:


(http://motorbike-search-engine.co.uk/classic_bikes/1975-cb550.jpg)

sac

I like 'em, but they'd look better with numbers.

I like them but they may serve as some sort of a beacon for the PoPo

as you would otherwise go sailing by at 20 over the limit unhindered

they may just see a track bike with an old license plate thrown on it

Full side view:

(http://a3.sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-ash2/155813_1475098478882_1276294830_31146755_4063225_n.jpg)

....nice!!

very alluring...attractive....wholesome even

hopefully not too deceptive about her past

Regards the side covers:

Either eliminate them for that cool open-frame look, or .09 thick aluminum plates with machine turned finish held on with SS button head cap screws or Dzus fastners.  Yum.

^^^  I'm surprised you didn't suggest mounting cupholders there instead!   [laugh]


Personally, I like the open look with just the air cleaner cones in there.   [thumbsup]




[bacon]

Her past included a lot of stripped bolts and a make the beast with two backsed up, cobbled together, wreck of a hack job on the exhaust. Basically a lot of this:



Judging by the wear on the bolts it looks like the engine may have been cracked open at some point. I'm choosing to ignore that fact for the time being.

sac

Were you talking about that big white thing on the blue bike?  [thumbsdown]

I loved when you just took all the parts off!  [thumbsup]

I even just like the filter is has on it (they may be 40 year old filters, we might have to change)

 :)

I am grinning so wide the corners of my mouth are bumping against my ears.....

Congratulations my good fellow, I believe you have met your "dromedary"   [thumbsup]

good luck on your journey into the desert!!!

Cafe 'racers' didn't have no stinkin' number plates  ;D

IMO, if you want to keep the horizontal sweep created by the linear frame, extended exhausts, and two-pax seat then the number plate will ruin the look/style....and the side covers have to stay  [thumbsup]

Except that the woman said she liked it nekkid.

You aren't the only perv here that had that thought....

great project man, kepe us posted, your bringing back old dreams of my own, may have to start one myself.


anyone have more pictures of this bike? pm link to me please?

im having the same experience trying to find an XS650 that's not $3k.


looks good sac.  I love how they 'hid' the wiring.

I sold my XS650 for $950 a year ago.  Was a barn find, over $1k spent making it road worthy, another $500 in cosmetics would have been choice.  Immediately regretted selling and have been trying to find one since.  NOPE.  Good luck finding one that isn't a full restoration or some hacked-up piece of shit bobber.

(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v92/2-Skinny/xs65035.jpg)

(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v92/2-Skinny/IMG_3595.jpg)

Middle:
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v92/2-Skinny/IMG_3311.jpg)

In the end it is always cheaper to hold on to them

than to buy another....

holds true for bikes, cars, guns, girlfriends and wives

Subscribed - I can't see the pics at work (overanxious firewall here), so I can't wait to check this out.  I love CB's - the 350's are amazing, I have a 550 in the planning stages too.

Anyone looking for a cheap way to get started?

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/1970-Honda-CB350-Engine-Frame-/370481249897?pt=Motorcycles_Parts_Accessories&hash=item5642673e69 (http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/1970-Honda-CB350-Engine-Frame-/370481249897?pt=Motorcycles_Parts_Accessories&hash=item5642673e69)


 [evil]


sac

Complete bike only $750!   :o


http://cgi.ebay.com/1971-Honda-cb-350-7230-miles-runs-/370498910640?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item564374b9b0 (http://cgi.ebay.com/1971-Honda-cb-350-7230-miles-runs-/370498910640?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item564374b9b0)

Anyone near that ^^^^ mind checking it out in person for me???

wow. not a huge fan of the 350 frame, its not tubular is it?

its partially tubular. The down tubes are but not the upper rail (pressed and spot welded sheet metal) and the tube ends are mated together with sheet metal. I am taking mine to a welder to get all the spot welded seams re-welded (one weld bead across).

You might want to leave the engine mounted during the re-weld

thats probably a really great idea.


yep

Great thread.  Man, I really want to do something like this.

And I quote......

"You Sir, have way bigger balls than me, thats for sure. "

me too!  [cheeky]

[laugh]

Guy at the bike shop mounted the rear tire backwards.   [roll]

And of course I only noticed AFTER I got the new brake pads and wheel re-installed.   [bang]

Took the forks off. They will get a good cleaning. what little oil as left in them looked like rusty water. Going to get some Progressive Springs. Gaiters are on the way.

sac

Happened to me with a Pilot Road 2 front tire at a Ducati dealership.

It happens. Pretty sure if you give them the chance they'll make it right.

I have no worries. The guys at that shop are great. Not a big deal I'm just pissed at myself for not taking the 30 seconds to check while I was still in their parking lot. They probably would have fixed it immediately. Lesson learned.

sac

11pm local time. I just spent 3 hours obsessively cleaning 40 years of dirt, grime, grease and rust from every square millimeter of the forks. Now would be a really good time for someone to tell me that polishing the rims would be a really stupid idea.

sac

[clap] [clap] [clap] [laugh] [laugh] [laugh]

Riding the camel at a furious pace into the desert...slapping its flank and shouting "hut hut hut!"

I spent hours on spokes...not long ago....crocus paper cut into strips and gently used as strops on each little spoke...massaging off the oxidation, tar grease and whatever else 40 plus years managed to put on them.

Then Gunk engine bright foamy on the hub centers scrubbed with little angled (bronze bristle) brushes reaching in between the spokes

Cleaning the rims is a make the beast with two backsing cakewalk go for it!!  you will sleep eventually

Do you have a Dremel?...yes?  OK good....buy a back-up one...Dremel has all manner of buffing, cleaning polishing cutting and sanding wheels....when I hit Home Depot I wipe out their polishing and cleaning assortments

...when you could have been at the most EPIC Prince concert ever, getting down with Chaka Khan, Sheila E, Prince, and an assortment cameos from the heavies of soul and funk!

Then been backstage afterwards dancing with the Ladies of the NPG. 


Just say'n... :-*

[bacon]


Oh, and did I mention he came out for no less than 5 encores?!!

Okay, I'm done.  We still riding today?  8)

Here's my latest cafe bike:

(http://farm6.static.flickr.com/5291/5502170689_558203bbed_d.jpg)

Here is the cb400f that I cut my teeth on:

http://home.comcast.net/~eyhonda/home.htm (http://home.comcast.net/~eyhonda/home.htm)

Is that a 305?

Yes it is.  It's a 64 cb77 SuperHawk 305.   Too many mods. So it is far from stock.  Stock frame, motor, forks and tank though.  CL305 scramblers high pipes, clip-ons, alloy rims, cafe bump seat.  Kickstart only.  I love the CB Hondas.  The 350 is the Chevy equivalent.  Easy to mod, lots of aftermarket parts and lots of used parts.   They made a lot of them and many parts are compatible from other models.   Let me know if you have any questions.  I have a few years time with these bikes.

Here is my website where I documented most of my past work:
www.eyhonda.com/ (http://www.eyhonda.com/)

If you're really game, take them apart.  Clean them up with beadblast, polish the chrome (if its in good shape) and re-assemble the whole monstrosity.   Like anything else motorcycle related, it's the experience that you get that's priceless.   Very rewarding too.   Having the skill to build spoked wheels is pretty cool and not that hard to do.  The other benefit is to be able to polish the hubs! 

My first bike was a 66 CB77 I bought in 1968 for $300 used - I am going to try to find some photos (I was in the Navy at the time and didn't take many pictures of the bike) I rebuilt the motor and bored it out to 337cc and remember doing something to the transmission to change the first to second gear spread. The bike would lift the front wheel on the first to second shift. That bike was my only means of transportation for a number of years

I believe mod is to swap the 2nd and 3rd gear cogs.  It moves the small jump from the 3-4 to 1-2 shift.   The other cool features are the 3 position adjustable rearsets, forward facing kickstarter (to clear the rearsets), motor stressed hanging frame (easy to drop motor) and the right side chain drive (as opposed to the common left side).  These bikes were modified by factory for racing (CR77).

Got a few bits in the mail today. Extremely happy with the tail light. Looks great, good quality. I will order new fork springs tomorrow (yay payday!) and assemble the front end when they come in.



(http://a4.sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc6/230350_1997461304491_1482243195_2309535_3526688_n.jpg)


Spoke with a guy who does a lot of structural welding for me. He rides and is interested in my little project. we always have to bullshit about bikes for 20 minutes before we actually discuss work. Turns out he recently rented a small space next to his shop that he uses for his toy room. Has a hydraulic bike lift in it and everything. when I asked if he'd do some frame modification for me he said, "Sure! Just bring the bike and the beer." I was just going to ask him for a quote. This is a bad thing. This means after I get the bike together and running (already found some side work so I can get new carbs  [evil] ) that I will tear the thing apart and mod the frame for basically free. which means I'll be able to get it powder coated. which means I'll have to get a new tank with custom paint which to compliment the frame, which means . . . help . . .

sac


/fork in picture is assembled for display purposes only, not actual fork assembly

You. Are. Soooooooooo. make the beast with two backsed.

[laugh]


Yeah, guess who else he's enlisted to help....?  8)
 

Difference is, I work for [bacon] not [drink]!   ;D



[bacon]

Yes, I know the slippery slope you're on SD...

It's how I've owned my beloved (occursed?!?) CR now for 11 years and it's been apart for over 1/2 that time and I've put more $ into it than I care to reveal...

Fix what's busted.

Cafe it out a bit.

Let Polpetta ride it.

All will be well...

Hi Stew...   ;D

You should have seen what was inside the forks when I slid them outta the triples!  :o

Not much oil, but a few spiders and loads of cobwebs!  [laugh]  Lots of goop too...  :P

Do you have the video of us doing 50mph on the 40 y.o. tires, or was that Dusty?




[bacon]

I've got it...  I think.

That was the dumb.  :P

Hut! Hut! Hut!

Down to the short strokes now....(I used to think that was a golf term, but I know better now Ollie)


Sac remember this number 11991.97


Keep a running spreadsheet to use in place of a suicide note after you auto-sum column H


(http://i230.photobucket.com/albums/ee91/visigoth9/G15CSRBackstretch005.jpg)

I love living vicariously through other folks' money pits projects.  :)

(as I slowly figure out what's next for me)

Well my particular torment really amounts to little more than the modern equivalent of WW 1 Trench Art  or Prison Art.....

a way of passing the days while sequestered in NY serving time/telecommuting until retirement....28 months from now

actually I will be back in Asheville in June and will be working from there now that my daughter has found a house for herself

so I get to continue the house restoration....

which in the world of "Trench Art" is a restoration project I am happiest doing

Sigh......sometimes I miss being a bachelor, or at least without kids running around :D

Looking good Rat!! And by the way, I refuse to keep a running total of the money. I don't do it for my home repairs and sure as hell ain't gonna do it for this motorcycle. I don't care about the money. Or the time. It may get to that point one day. But not now.

For now I am doing exactly what Stew said: fix what needs fixing, get the general cafe type shape I want out of the thing and have the wife back on two wheels.

Today I ordered fork springs and seals. Just a new break cable and I'll be ready to rebuild the front end. Eventually I'll have to settle on a new headlight bucket and a tach/speedo (hopefully tucked into the bucket) but that will be later.

After that it will be new sprockets and chain. Then a valve adjustment and some new gaskets and (he says overly optimistically) it should be road worthy.

THEN I will start getting the final design together, gathering parts, fabricating some custom bits and planning my own demise. I suspect I will be found huddled in a corner, sobbing loudly while beating myself in the head with a crescent wrench.

Had another offer for free welding work from a guy who is doing a lot of decorative iron work for me at the moment. Also a moto enthusiast ho just bought himself an early sixties bmw. For those who catch the reference I offer this:

(http://images.blu-ray.com/reviews/490_3.jpg)


sac

It as you, me, Ryan, a kick start motorcycle and no adult supervision. I'm trying to think of a smart idea that could arise in that situation. Couldn't come up with one then and I can't come up with one now.

 ;D


sac

Only $50? OKAY!

(http://www.dimecitycycles.com/media/catalog/product/cache/1//5e06319eda06f020e43594a9c230972d/v/i/vintage-cafe-racer-bobber-brat-chopper-custom-motorcycle-parts-hawk-technologies-honda-mini-gauge-aluminum-dash-dual-mini-kit-4_1.jpg)


sac

All I can say is ;D

Very dumb, but a whole lotta fun!  ;D


  Two words...



Snuggle Bee!!!   [laugh] ;D :-\ :P [puke]


Yeah,  the three of us together with no adult supervision is a recipe for hilarity...


Or disaster!




[bacon]

where did you find that? ebay? that is slick!

http://www.dimecitycycles.com/ (http://www.dimecitycycles.com/)

These guys are great. Cool products. Your can probably hunt around and find better pricing, but their customer service has made me a pretty loyal customer already.


sac

GOOOOOOOD DAMMMMMN IIIIIIITTTTTTT!!

I just found a set of 1998 GSXR forks with the god damn triples for $199 make the beast with two backsing dollars!!

The problem is that all you have to do to make these work is press the gsxr stem out and press the cb stem in. And there's your new forks. Mothermake the beast with two backsing progressive springs are going to cost $200!!! Arrrrrrrrrgggggg!!!!

Please. I'm begging you. Talk me out of this. I should just find oem springs for $40 and be happy, right?

sac

UMMM NO

we alllllllllllllllllll KNOW you'r reaching in your pocket for your credit card as i type.. & the cash register goes KACHING! :)

What does wifey want?

Chances are, the hours you spend on cleaning the spokes/nipples and other hard to reach spots, would be better spent disassembling and relacing them.  On my XS650 project, the aluminum rims just needed some polishing but the spokes were real snotty.  I got beautiful nickel plated spokes w/nipples for one of my projects off ebay for $50/F&R.  I found an online tutorial on lacing that made it a breeze.  Disassembling the rims/hubs gave the opportunity to really get in there and clean/resurface anything that needed it.  I was glad I did in the end.

Hey Eric, nice to see you found this site.  We spoke a few times on sohc4.net   Thanks for your help with my cafe projects.  Your CB400F was one of the bikes that got me motivated. [thumbsup]

I thought I just said this same thing earlier??   Another idea for improvement in the chassis is to press out the plastic swingarm bushings and press in bronze bushings.   For the rear shocks, check out Progressive or Ikon (formally Koni) for fully adjustable units.   

Oh god, get the good forks.  No amount of springs and fresh oil (or even some Gold Valve emulators) is going to make that stock CB front end worth a tenth of those GSX-R forks.  It's not just a performance issue, good suspension is a comfort and safety issue.

This was my thought. I'm currently looking into what my front wheel options are.

God help me.


sac

Dude, get the gsxr front.   After all, we are talking about the comfort and safety of your wife here...   :-*


I'll see ya tomorrow.  I'll bring the quick connectors.   ;)




[bacon]

Not finding any good info on my front wheel options. Hate the thought of using the gsxr front wheel or having to cobble something together with bushings and spacers. Am now thinking I'll just get oem springs and start looking into the gsxr fork conversion later. I can really only find one guy that did it and the details are minimal. Might be too much to bite off at the moment. New seals and springs for the stock forks. Yeah. That is definitely the right thing to do at the moment. The responsible thing. I'M NOT GOOD AT BEING RESPONSIBLE!!!



Quiet you!  >:(


sac

Actually, this post:


...makes a lot of sense.

Wifey won't know she has a crap front end until she rides someone else's bike, or someone else rides hers. Regardless, better suspension technology has become commonplace in the last 40 years.

Upgrade.

Okay, I just ordered the oem springs ($70 shipped). I missed a note about the gixxer forks that one of them is leaking. Don't want to deal with that on top of everything else. I'm sure my wife would like to ride this decade. And this thing ain't for racing.

Man, I should have tried harder to make buying fork springs just a little more dramatic.  [roll]  My apologies, I'm a little excited about my first go at this type thing. what fun! So much to learn!

Thanks all, for your input and your interest.   [beer]

sac



/hates doing the rational thing
//but anything for the wifey   :-*

Nuts! (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3w4B7QxL_n4&feature=related#normal)

The trouble with such a dramatic upgrade is that it would expose ALL other weaknesses in the chassis, bearings, bushings, stamped steel frame members, and on and on...

You did the right thing.  If you mod it too much, it loses the old-bike feel and character that she's so enamored with...

You learned a valuable lesson:

Just because you can, doesn't mean you should.

Stop making so much sense, will ya?!  Sheesh!  [roll]


;D

I really really wish someone had said this to me a few decades ago....

not that I would have listened

but excellent advice in any pursuit

thank you

Word.

stretch the swingarm, chrome it, and put a 230 tire on it...


don't forget the neon lights and fake turbo/fake flame


(waiting for polpetta to reach through the screen and smack me upside the head)
 ;D



[bacon]

camel Laughing (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sZr3_Ac_nB4&feature=related#normal)

Having experience with putting newer USD forks with radial tires on a bike that doesn't use radial tires... It's not good. I did it with my suzuki GS and didn't change out the rear for a radial, and it was disastrous. WOBBLE LIKE CRAZY!!! It didn't like the rear bias ply.

I sold it to a friend who I helped monoshock it to fit a radial tire.

If you decide to do the swap in the future, then have a look at sohc4.net - there are plenty of guys on there swapping R6 and other new RSU (and even some USD) forks onto vintage Honda's.

Congrats on keeping your cool.

Does RaceTech make emulators for this bike?

Answering my own question in case someone else is interested:

It really isn't that difficult of an endeavor; I put a gxr750 forks on my '76 CB550.  As far as physically bolting them up was concerned it just took some mixing & matching of roller bearings & races; didn't need to swap stems or anything crazy like that.

(http://i264.photobucket.com/albums/ii181/Staggerlee101/Moto/photo-1.jpg)

that looks great! the colors actually really work well too

brembo brakes?

Thanks man.

Brakes are just off the shelf radial Tokicos.  They get the job done though; she'll out brake my monster any day.

Must be because on the CB the frame flex softens the bite of those radical brakes. ;)

USD forks and ohlins piggyback shocks.

http://i175.photobucket.com/albums/w149/Mindless000/Foto0091.jpg (http://i175.photobucket.com/albums/w149/Mindless000/Foto0091.jpg)

USD front end (GSXR1100) and MONOSHOCKED!
http://www.classic-japanese-bikes.com/images/suzukiGs100Streetfightwhite.jpg (http://www.classic-japanese-bikes.com/images/suzukiGs100Streetfightwhite.jpg)

Great ideas here, but I guess you could always fab a way to keep the original wheel on there.

You'll find a good deal on them eventually, hell, you might find a decent set of USD forks and triples right here on the DMF!

All this talk about Gixxer forks and dual rotor front brakes is all well and good, but in reality, having the the stock set up performing to spec is really all you need for a CB350 being used for normal use.  If your lady not planing on doing the TT Isle of Man, the stock config should do just fine.  :)

"Just because you can, doesn't mean you should." - So true!

I was thinking this was impressive.  I mean, we all know the bad rep ducati has, and how easy they can break.  But a honda, even an older one that can break more?  [laugh] [laugh]

I keeed...I keed...

Seriously, this CB thread has all kinds of awesomeness built it.  Threads like this end up costing me money  [drink]

Shit, I don't believe it took two people to point that before I figured out WTF you were getting at.

How embarrassing.

LOL, I was just poking at you, don't sweat it.  [thumbsup]


I just finished dusting off all the RD350 stuff I've got, in preperation to make a vintage cafe bike.  Now I'm trying to figure if I should monoshock this thing or not.....

im loving the look of it when u got it! rough old bikes that simply work are so much fun to ride around on a lazy sunday. ESPECIALLY when they are kick start! man do u get some looks of admiration when you kick start a rough looking old bike on the first kick!

ill find a better pic when i get home but this is me picking up my xs 650 when i got it a few years back.
has spoke steel wheels and a factory twin disc front with metalic black paint and chrome front and rear fenders. stiffer springs in forks with valves, shorter stiffer rear shock/springs, open filters and pipes, upside down 2inch rise bars and a shortened seat. we tried to rejet it and its runs great if your constantly up it but sit in a little traffic and its fouled plugs.. :( ill order some new jets soon as in a silly move we drilled the old ones when rejetting as i didnt have any that fit this models mikunis.

(http://img805.imageshack.us/img805/4945/15605425.png) (http://img805.imageshack.us/i/15605425.png/)

Uploaded with ImageShack.us (http://imageshack.us)

Nice XS650!  Nice Ute!  And is that an FJ in the background!?

thanx man, and yeah thats dads fj40. we lifted it and put a 350 chev on lpg in that with a pto winch and deisel diffs it goes nearly anywhere!  its a rough bush basher that got a bit too scratched up and rusty so it got blasted and painted matte black haha. had some crazy times in that thing.

aaaaaaah! el camino! ha ha ha
i know its a ute, just never seen one but for their website [thumbsup]

 >:(

Okay, I've been told by THREE different suspension vendors AFTER I ordered from them that they didn't actually carry the product they said they did. I'm now desperately looking for a place to buy new fork springs. orks, progressive and Honda orld were all a no go. RaceTech also said no.

I'm ready to reassemble the front end. Improving the suspension is a very important part of getting this bike ready for my wife, so used springs off of ebay aren't going to cut it. Some retard adjusted the rear suspension on her m620 to a scary/unsafe level of soft (before we were married). She kept complaining that the wind was blowing her around too much. I finally road it and turns out that the suspension adjustment was so frickin' terrible that the back end would start walking around after the smallest bump in the road. I think I cranked the preload down about four or five full rotations. In short, she wants primo suspension on her bikes after that little experience. It will make me feel better as well.

HELP!!!

sac

I've never seen progressive or any other aftermarket springs for your application.  I believe the 71 CB350 has the external springs.  Tough find.  Try some vintage jap bike forums or start looking over in europe, austrailia, places like that.  I got a lot of parts overseas for my projects.

They're internal.  I disassembled the front end of the bike...

After sliding the forks outta the triples, we got a surprise...  more cobwebs than fork oil!  [laugh]




[bacon]

I checked all my usual cafe/vintage bike restoration places, no go on the front suspension... ??? ???

z1enterprises.com (The CA-cycleworks for UJM's)
crc2onlinecatalog.com (Cycle recycle, new parts though, great resource for carbs and all sorts of stuff)

I hope those will help though.

Mmmm?  The springs were inside the fork pistonl?  The OEM forks for the 70,71 CB's had springs that went over(outside) the piston and sat on top of the fork lower, covered by a shroud.  Looking at the pic, it appears that those are period correct forks.  Being that the springs were external they were prone to rusting and breaking.  
External, meaning not inside the sealed portion of the fork.

There weren't many upgrades for this type of fork.

im not sure on the dimensions of springs you need, but i brought mine from www.mikesxs.com (http://)
obviously because mines an xs! but if you can get dimensions of yours you might be lucky. otherwise mike is a very informative guy, he may be able to advise where he gets his springs from.

The piston was inside the springs, but everything was inside a sealed tube.  At least they were until we unscrewed the top of the forks to get them out of the triples. 

I'm just lending a helping hand.  I'm no mechanic.  When I read external, I was thinking you meant like the springs on the outside of the rear shocks.

So... What you said.  ;D


[bacon]

Willy Wonka and the Chocolate factory - Wrong Sir! (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kw4S36Uipi4#normal)



Dr Cox - Wrong Wrong Wrong Wrong (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WrjwaqZfjIY&feature=related#normal)



Thanks for helping with the dis-assembly though.


 ;D



sac

Thanks. I didn't find the springs I'm looking for, but I think I found the sprockets I want at z1.   [thumbsup]


sac

Hey Sac,

There's a place in Santa Clarita on Railroad Ave that deals with vintage Triumphs,  I went in there and the guy was extremely helpful.  I forgot the name of it but tomorrow when I drive by it I'll get you his number.  When I was talking to him about my boss' 50's Harley he said he can get parts for almost any vintage bike so it may be worth a shot.

Cool! Thanks!  [thumbsup]


sac

Sonic Springs (http://www.sonicsprings.com/catalog/product_info.php?cPath=74&products_id=174&osCsid=e0e51e1a4b938272291de9c6e5125562) will custom wind you a set.

Thanks!   [thumbsup]

Just sent them a message to see if they have an off the shelf product that ill work for me.


sac

BTW - straight-rate springs generally work better than progressives.  I don't even understand why progressives were even invented.  A physics 100 lecture on a damped oscillator shows that it's a bad idea.

That's interesting. And after a reading after articles it makes sense to me.

Here's a little blurb that doesn't get technical:

http://www.sonicsprings.com/catalog/straight_vs_prog_tech_article.php (http://www.sonicsprings.com/catalog/straight_vs_prog_tech_article.php)


sac

Ha ha, funny that I pointed you to Sonic and towards straight-rate springs without realizing that there's a perfect explanation on the Sonic website. :)

I don't think these guys retail parts, but they might be able to point you in the right direction

http://www.garagecompany.com/ (http://www.garagecompany.com/)

After many hours of research I have come to a definite conclusion on the front end. I am going to reassemble it more or less as stock for the time being. And I'm going to build a whole new front based on 550 or 750 forks as time and money allow. Stiffer USD forks (35mm instead of 33mm) disk brakes and an easier time finding parts were the determining factors. hen the new front end is done the swap should be easy.

Thanks for your help everyone.


sac

I think you mean RSU.

And RaceTech does have emulators for the 550 and 750 forks which will make a world of difference.

Check out sohc4.net for plenty of info on rebuilding those forks (and maybe to score a pair cheap off someone doing an upgrade).