I walked out to the dumb of a grage i keep my baby in. Looked down and noticed a small yellow puddle. Followed the yellow stain up the side of my frame to the bottom of tank. Noticed that it looked like the gas was coming out of the "low Fuel" light sensor. So i got a wrench and started to tighten it. Well i thought i had the problem solved, but was riding the bike and noticed that it had leaked down my pant leg... I cant tell for sure if its leaking at that spot.. But it does look like it. I remember reading on the old site about people haveing leaking tanks. But didnt see anything on here. Anyone ever have this happen before.
Thanks [moto]
Quote from: Dustin1231 on June 18, 2008, 10:05:25 AM
I walked out to the dumb of a grage i keep my baby in. Looked down and noticed a small yellow puddle. Followed the yellow stain up the side of my frame to the bottom of tank. Noticed that it looked like the gas was coming out of the "low Fuel" light sensor. So i got a wrench and started to tighten it. Well i thought i had the problem solved, but was riding the bike and noticed that it had leaked down my pant leg... I cant tell for sure if its leaking at that spot.. But it does look like it. I remember reading on the old site about people haveing leaking tanks. But didnt see anything on here. Anyone ever have this happen before.
Thanks [moto]
My experience has been they leak from the hinge not the sender.
The repair require brazing the hinge plate and coating the tank with a sealer. I use POR-15 and haven't had one fail yet.
Quote from: ducpainter on June 18, 2008, 11:23:35 AM
My experience has been they leak from the hinge not the sender.
The repair require brazing the hinge plate and coating the tank with a sealer. I use POR-15 and haven't had one fail yet.
+1 ..... The
exact same thing happened to my S4 last year and it's a common problem. Turns out that it is usually caused by lifting the tank up too far when accessing the battery/airbox/etc.. The hinge is only spot welded IIRC & cannot take much strain, so be careful. I had mine internally coated using POR-15 and it's been fine ever since. Do NOT try and band-aid it (JB Weld or Bondo both come to mind), as you're just masking the true problem...
This made mine stop leaking gas. :(
http://ducatimonsterforum.org/index.php?topic=5204.0
Also, riding with the latch loose or unhooked doesn't help the hinge bracket either.
Don't ask Rameses...
once i get the POR-15. what do i need to do?
do i put it on the inside of the tank?? ???
Quote from: Dustin1231 on June 24, 2008, 05:04:06 AM
do i put it on the inside of the tank?? ???
Yes, and I don't know if I'd try to do it myself to be honest w/you. :-\
-You have to detach the entire filling hatch assembly and let the tank fumigate for at least 24 hours before you seal it (at least that is how my dealer did it). I don't think it's as easy of a process as just pouring the stuff in + swirling it around. You may want to get someone who's done it before take care of it.
If you don't reinforce the hinge it will leak again.
I fixed mine successfully (after trying unsuccessfully to have it brazed by Speedymoto which is just down the street...) by putting a expoxy compound on the OUTSIDE of the tank. It is a 2 part epoxy that it like putty and hardens enough to sand, drill, whatever... I built up the hinge, did the seam at the edge, pretty much went berzerk on the over kill (knowing none would be visible due to the seat covering it...)
So, it worked. Has held for 6k miles (3 months) so far.
The product is from BBS coatings...
Oh yeah; this is my second leaky tank! First one was welded successfully (again by speedymoto).
This is the shit:
(http://www.kbs-coatings.com/assets/images/nm-300.jpg)
KBS NuMetal :: Epoxy Putty
KBS NuMetal Epoxy Putty is a easy-to-use, two part putty you simply mix and mold like clay â€" no complicated weighing or measuring required. Available in one pound box in BLACK, TAN, & WHITE!
NuMetal Epoxy Putty is an easy-to-use, two-part putty that mixes like clay but hardens like steel! NuMetal bonds, seals, fills, insulates, anchors, caulks and waterproofs. It cures without shrinking or sagging and can be drilled, tapped, sanded, primed and painted. NuMetal will not only stick to damp surfaces, but it will cure underwater!
Our Black NuMetal is ideal for automotive applications…if the surface coating sustains damage, the black epoxy putty beneath remains unseen! Use White NuMetal for marine applications and boat repairs. Satisfaction guaranteed!
www.kbs-coatings.com
^^
Yeah, my dealer told me that this is nothing more than a "band-aid", and you're just masking the problem, but hey.. If it works, than it works!! [thumbsup]
The main thing is to keep the gas IN the tank, so I suppose anything you use is fine as long as it holds.. Hell, I almost use JB Weld which probably would've been a bad idea..
...ask ducvet how well epoxies on the outside of the tank work. ;)
Quote from: johnster on June 24, 2008, 06:43:29 AM
^^
Yeah, my dealer told me that this is nothing more than a "band-aid", and you're just masking the problem, but hey.. If it works, than it works!! [thumbsup]
I gave up a long time ago listening to my dealer... :-\
Quote from: scooby on June 24, 2008, 07:14:54 AM
I gave up a long time ago listening to my dealer... :-\
I hear ya!! I've gotten questionable advice from mine in the past.
Quote from: ducpainter on June 24, 2008, 07:13:00 AM
...ask ducvet how well epoxies on the outside of the tank work. ;)
If you don't want to believe your dealer, fine. Do believe our resident tank hinge expert [thumbsup] The epoxy is an excellent emergency repair, but, with time, it will fail.
Same damn thing happened on my S4. Leak from the tank hinge. Got her all fixed up for under $300 including the bottom being repainted. Good as new [thumbsup]
Quote from: Pancake81 on June 24, 2008, 09:14:07 AM
Same damn thing happened on my S4. Leak from the tank hinge. Got her all fixed up for under $300 including the bottom being repainted. Good as new [thumbsup]
Was it your dealer that fixed it?
What was the fix, and how long has it been good?
Well I was going to send my tank to DucPainter originally. His prices are fair and I have heard nothing but good things. However, Shipping would have hit me in the ASS with a whopping $400 each way. I mean I know I own a Duc but that is outrageous.
So I decided to take matters in my own hands. The tank of course was already of because I had it ready to ship, so the next step was to tank the "inards" out so I could take it somewhere to be welded/brazed/soldered. Well... I was unable to get the "inards" out because I have big Swede hands and that hole is just too small (no coments please [laugh] ). So I dropped it of at the local Duc shop to take the inards out. They did so, however they also took the liberty of taking it too the rad shop without my permission to be fixed. This chapped my ass a bit becasue I knew they would mark the sale up so they could make there 10% or whatever. I pregnant doged them out a bit, then said screw it, lets just get this thing on the road.
Well... I got lucky, because the rad shop took the liberty of taking to the autobody shop without my permission or the Duc shops permission to get the bottom re-painted after the solder. So, in the end I got the tank fixed by the radiater shop, re-painted at the autobody shop, and a new fuel filter for arond $300-$350 (cant remember exactly). I am now at around 900 or so miles with no problems. knock on wood there wont be any.
Heath
Quote from: Pancake81 on June 24, 2008, 02:59:08 PM
----------------snip--------------
However, Shipping would have hit me in the ASS with a whopping $400 each way. I mean I know I own a Duc but that is outrageous.
----------------snip--------------
Heath
WTF! ???
Quote from: Speeddog on June 24, 2008, 03:13:28 PM
WTF! ???
I never did understand that price for shipping.....
maybe he was trying to send the whole bike?
Quote from: ducpainter on June 24, 2008, 06:17:34 PM
I never did understand that price for shipping.....
Maybe the shipper thought you were in Holland.
Quote from: Speeddog on June 24, 2008, 06:32:49 PM
Maybe the shipper thought you were in Holland.
Who told you where I lived? ;D
YEah that shipping was outrageous [laugh] . That was what Canada Post qouted me. Then I did some shopping around and found that FedEx would ship it for $290 :-X . Still a kick in the pants. I mean that $600 in hsipping, plus $300 for the repair; I am sure I could find a nice tank on Fleabay for $900.
Oh well. Got her done cheap and it is good as new. So I am happy for now. Well, at least I am still smilling like a fox eating sh!t out of a gumboot ;D
Quote from: Pancake81 on June 25, 2008, 08:54:17 AM
YEah that shipping was outrageous [laugh] . That was what Canada Post qouted me. Then I did some shopping around and found that FedEx would ship it for $290 :-X . Still a kick in the pants. I mean that $600 in hsipping, plus $300 for the repair; I am sure I could find a nice tank on Fleabay for $900.
Oh well. Got her done cheap and it is good as new. So I am happy for now. Well, at least I am still smilling like a fox eating sh!t out of a gumboot ;D
Still outrageous...
You should have seen my face when the lady turned the screen at me. She wouldnt even say the price, jus turned the monitor in disgust.
I've got to revive this thread because I think I screwed up my tank. I bought some POR-15, drained out the tank, allowed it to air dry, ran some rubbing alcohol through it and allowed that to dry with the aid of a hair drier. I then sealed up the bottom of the tank with duct tape, poured in the POR-15, sloshed it around a bit as per the instructions on the can, drained, applied a fan to the fill hole and allowed it to cure for 96+ hours. I did not bother to take out the innards, I just did not see how the hell anyone but a dwarf could do that. So I put the whole thing back together and am getting no gas out of the line. I fished a wire up the gas lines to see if there was any obvious blockage. No-go.
What to do?
Quote from: Blackout on July 05, 2008, 01:46:15 PM
I've got to revive this thread because I think I screwed up my tank. I bought some POR-15, drained out the tank, allowed it to air dry, ran some rubbing alcohol through it and allowed that to dry with the aid of a hair drier. I then sealed up the bottom of the tank with duct tape, poured in the POR-15, sloshed it around a bit as per the instructions on the can, drained, applied a fan to the fill hole and allowed it to cure for 96+ hours. I did not bother to take out the innards, I just did not see how the hell anyone but a dwarf could do that. So I put the whole thing back together and am getting no gas out of the line. I fished a wire up the gas lines to see if there was any obvious blockage. No-go.
What to do?
Dude....
you make the beast with two backsed up.
Quote from: ducpainter on July 05, 2008, 04:28:56 PM
Dude....
you make the beast with two backsed up.
eh? ???
Quote from: Blackout on July 05, 2008, 09:05:08 PM
eh? ???
Filters, pumps and low fuel senders don't like sealers. Hopefully you didn't kill all three.
YUP... had a leaky S4 tank myself. Brazzed her up and she is good as new. $350 later :P
Quote from: Blackout on July 05, 2008, 09:05:08 PM
eh? ???
If you left the internals in there the pump screen is most certainly clogged.
I hope that's all.
The pump
needs to come out.
Good luck with that.
So I brought my bike (2002 S4) to a reputable dealer in my area to have my base gasket replaced ($802, 5 hours labor a few bucks in parts.) They did a great job and even cleaned up a few things on the bike. I drove it home last night topped off the gas at the local station and put it in the garage. I went to go drive to work this am and instantly I could smell gasoline in the garage and sure enough there on the ground was a small spot where gas had leaked. I traced back the drips and it seems to be coming from behind the hinge. (I have ALWAYS been careful to not lift the tank up too high based on this and other threads.)
I didn't have this problem BEFORE I brought it to have this work done, so I feel as though the mechanic is at least partially responsible(?) In the last month I spent $250 on a custom map and another $800 on a rear base gasket replacement. (ouch) If you were in my shoes what would you ask from the dealer... request a braze? Thanks in advance.
Wouldn't hurt to ask.
If it gets brazed make sure you have them coat it.
Don't let them use Kreem.
Quote from: ducpainter on July 05, 2008, 04:28:56 PM
Dude....
you make the beast with two backsed up.
WTF does this mean?
Quote from: Monstermash on August 15, 2008, 07:36:42 AM
WTF does this mean?
i think it means that shakespeare had sex with his tank...
Quote from: ducpainter on July 25, 2008, 05:28:47 AM
Don't let them use Kreem.
I'm glad I saw this thread! I have a complete Kreem kit that I bought on ebay ready to do my tank with. I guess I'll look for the POR-15 Tank Sealer. Anyone know how much it will take? I saw it on the manufacturers site and see that it comes in different sized cans.
Anyhow, the reason I'm doing my tank is that there were these little puffy white growths on the inside of my tank several years ago that turned into rusty spots. I removed the tank, stripped out all of the internals, and was just getting ready to Kreem it when I started looking around for advice. The rust was pretty bad at the bottom near the fuel pump based on the amount of it that was on my arm as I fished around inside to remove the pump! The filter screen on the pump was pretty rusty, too.
Will I need to plug the tubing ends inside the tank? Should I tape the openings while I flow the sealer around on the inside?
Quote from: xtophr on March 08, 2009, 06:55:54 PM
I'm glad I saw this thread! I have a complete Kreem kit that I bought on ebay ready to do my tank with. I guess I'll look for the POR-15 Tank Sealer. Anyone know how much it will take? I saw it on the manufacturers site and see that it comes in different sized cans.
Anyhow, the reason I'm doing my tank is that there were these little puffy white growths on the inside of my tank several years ago that turned into rusty spots. I removed the tank, stripped out all of the internals, and was just getting ready to Kreem it when I started looking around for advice. The rust was pretty bad at the bottom near the fuel pump based on the amount of it that was on my arm as I fished around inside to remove the pump! The filter screen on the pump was pretty rusty, too.
Will I need to plug the tubing ends inside the tank? Should I tape the openings while I flow the sealer around on the inside?
This is probably what you want for a single job.
http://www.por15.com/CYCLE-TANK-REPAIR-KIT/productinfo/CTRK/ (http://www.por15.com/CYCLE-TANK-REPAIR-KIT/productinfo/CTRK/)
Quote from: xtophr on March 08, 2009, 06:55:54 PM
I'm glad I saw this thread! I have a complete Kreem kit that I bought on ebay ready to do my tank with. I guess I'll look for the POR-15 Tank Sealer. Anyone know how much it will take? I saw it on the manufacturers site and see that it comes in different sized cans.
Anyhow, the reason I'm doing my tank is that there were these little puffy white growths on the inside of my tank several years ago that turned into rusty spots. I removed the tank, stripped out all of the internals, and was just getting ready to Kreem it when I started looking around for advice. The rust was pretty bad at the bottom near the fuel pump based on the amount of it that was on my arm as I fished around inside to remove the pump! The filter screen on the pump was pretty rusty, too.
Will I need to plug the tubing ends inside the tank? Should I tape the openings while I flow the sealer around on the inside?
Plug the tubes on the outside.
You can use short lengths of vacuum tubing available at any auto parts store. You'll need some 5/16" and some 1/4". Remove them each time you rinse.
The fuel sender hole needs to be blocked off too as does the filler opening for both the wash and the etch.
Tape will not work well on the large openings.
You don't need to block off the filler opening for the sealing process if you're careful.
If you follow the directions
exactly the POR kit works great.
Quote from: ducpainter on March 08, 2009, 09:34:25 PM
Plug the tubes on the outside.
You can use short lengths of vacuum tubing available at any auto parts store. You'll need some 5/16" and some 1/4". Remove them each time you rinse.
The fuel sender hole needs to be blocked off too as does the filler opening for both the wash and the etch.
Tape will not work well on the large openings.
You don't need to block off the filler opening for the sealing process if you're careful.
If you follow the directions exactly the POR kit works great.
ducpainter i just got my tank back, its been welded and painted. They suggested i coat the inside. heres my question:
A: There are two tubes inside the tank a longer and shorter one, do i need to block off the openings inside the tank (wont that coating go inside those tubes and clog them up?)
B: How important is it to keep all that stuff off a brand new paint job? Should i wait a few weeks before doing the POR 15, i think it was just clear coated a day or two ago.
Quote from: SaltLick on March 08, 2009, 10:00:12 PM
ducpainter i just got my tank back, its been welded and painted. They suggested i coat the inside. heres my question:
A: There are two tubes inside the tank a longer and shorter one, do i need to block off the openings inside the tank (wont that coating go inside those tubes and clog them up?)
B: How important is it to keep all that stuff off a brand new paint job? Should i wait a few weeks before doing the POR 15, i think it was just clear coated a day or two ago.
The POR won't enter the tubes...but there are 4 in total on a FI tank.
You really really really should have done it before it was painted.
The soap, the acid, and the POR itself will mess up a fresh finish. It will take 60 days at 70 deg F to cure.
Quote from: SaltLick on March 08, 2009, 10:30:07 PM
crapsticks....Oh well. Dammit, i know this is a ridiculous question but what are the chances that there is a leak? The welds werent by any seams, just at the top where the handlebars hit. Welded in about 4 places total. My dad said he pressure tested the tank after every weld he did. Thats how he found all the leaks in the first place. In the end he said it held the pressure in there. I am not sure how you pressure test a tank for leaks, how good of a trouble shooting tool that is i guess i should say. Crappy thing is, here in oregon it wont get to 70 degrees on a daily basis until July. Then im suppore to wait 2 months after that? Man there would go the summer. Sigh...dammit.
What is your experience? Is there usually always a small leak after welding? Would i be insane to just skip the POR 15 part, or should i just fill it up ride it then during the summer once the pait is cured take everything out and coat it?
There isn't always a leak...but there will be rust that will develop and it won't take long.
You didn't braze the hinge while you were at it? ???
If that's the case, that was a serious mistake.
I would say yes you'd be nuts to skip the POR.
If it does leak you'll ruin your new paint job...it's your choice.
Quote from: ducpainter on March 08, 2009, 10:35:34 PM
You didn't braze the hinge while you were at it? ???
Where exactly should the hinge be brazed? Mine wasn't yet a problem, but an ounce of prevention...
Thanks for all of the tips, guys. So if I'm getting this right, plug the
outside tubes and let the POR-15 do its stuff. No POR will enter and plug the tubes because of the sealed outside ends? Any suggestions as for what to use to plug the filler and sender holes?
I didn't realize that there was a 60 day wait for curing! Good thing it's only March!
Quote from: xtophr on March 09, 2009, 02:01:13 PM
Where exactly should the hinge be brazed? Mine wasn't yet a problem, but an ounce of prevention...
Thanks for all of the tips, guys. So if I'm getting this right, plug the outside tubes and let the POR-15 do its stuff. No POR will enter and plug the tubes because of the sealed outside ends? Any suggestions as for what to use to plug the filler and sender holes?
I didn't realize that there was a 60 day wait for curing! Good thing it's only March!
Quote from: ducpainter on March 08, 2009, 09:34:25 PM
Plug the tubes on the outside.
You can use short lengths of vacuum tubing (edit)and some screws(edit) available at any auto parts store. You'll need some 5/16" and some 1/4". Remove them each time you rinse.
The fuel sender hole needs to be blocked off too as does the filler opening for both the wash and the etch.
Tape will not work well on the large openings.
You don't need to block off the filler opening (edit) or the tubes(edit) for the sealing process if you're careful. (edit) The sender opening should be taped, as well as the drain if the tank is equipped with one.(edit)
If you follow the directions exactly the POR kit works great. (edit)It's a 3 step process and requires some plugs/caps for the tubes and ingenuity to block off the large openings.(edit)
I modified my post here to try and clarify. If you have any other questions ask away.
The POR does not need to cure for 60 days. Sixty days is a general time frame for fresh urethane to reach full cure. It can be affected by many factors. You also don't need to wait for the finish to reach full cure to use it. Just be aware you can't wax it until full cure is reached.
The hinge need to be brazed around the plate that is spot welded to the tank
Quote from: ducpainter on March 09, 2009, 02:39:42 PM
I modified my post here to try and clarify. If you have any other questions ask away.
The POR does not need to cure for 60 days. Sixty days is a general time frame for fresh urethane to reach full cure. It can be affected by many factors. You also don't need to wait for the finish to reach full cure to use it. Just be aware you can't wax it until full cure is reached.
The hinge need to be brazed around the plate that is spot welded to the tank
ducpainter im going to listen to you and am going to wait and use the POR 15 kit once the paint job is dry enough. Above you said this "You also don't need to wait for the finish to reach full cure to use it. Just be aware you can't wax it until full cure is reached. Were you talking about the POR 15? Does that mean i dont have to wait the full 60 days before using the POR 15 kit? The tank will be sitting in my room, its about 70 degrees in there with the heater on all day. If not 60 days, how long til i could use the kit and not destroy the finish?
Quote from: SaltLick on March 09, 2009, 03:49:55 PM
ducpainter im going to listen to you and am going to wait and use the POR 15 kit once the paint job is dry enough. Above you said this "You also don't need to wait for the finish to reach full cure to use it. Just be aware you can't wax it until full cure is reached. Were you talking about the POR 15? Does that mean i dont have to wait the full 60 days before using the POR 15 kit? The tank will be sitting in my room, its about 70 degrees in there with the heater on all day. If not 60 days, how long til i could use the kit and not destroy the finish?
I really can't answer your question.
You are trying to do things backwards and I have no idea what your painter did.
There are only two ways to remove POR sealer from the finish...solvents or sanding.
The acid and soap will also mark finishes.
If you have a gloss finish it's easier than a matte finish...you can't do anything to those.
If you get the soap or acid on a gloss finish those marks will polish out.
If you get the sealer itself on it you have 2 options...solvent while the POR is wet, or sanding and polishing if the POR has dried.
A fresh finish doesn't like solvents.
I'd suggest you buy the kit and read the instructions. It may help you decide the best options.
Thats the story of my life...doing things backwards. :-\Thanks for your help ducpainter.
Quote from: xtophr on March 09, 2009, 02:01:13 PM
Where exactly should the hinge be brazed? Mine wasn't yet a problem, but an ounce of prevention...
Hi Guys,
Sorry for the slight threadjack, but I'm getting a new tank soon, and would like to know how to prepare it to prevent all that leakage (that's one of the reasons why I'm gettin' a new one :)). How can I reinforce the hinge? Are there any pictures to illustrate this? And I guess I should be using the POR sealer after reinforcing, and before painting, right?
Thanks a bunch!
Quote from: Bizzarrini on March 10, 2009, 08:16:25 AM
Hi Guys,
Sorry for the slight threadjack, but I'm getting a new tank soon, and would like to know how to prepare it to prevent all that leakage (that's one of the reasons why I'm gettin' a new one :)). How can I reinforce the hinge? Are there any pictures to illustrate this? And I guess I should be using the POR sealer after reinforcing, and before painting, right?
Thanks a bunch!
(http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3414/3345929019_5339f64f98.jpg?v=0)
(http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3414/3345929019_5339f64f98.jpg?v=0)
That's a fantastic shot. Shows the plugging of the two tubes and the sensor hole as well as the brazing of the hinge. Now if we could see one of the filler hole plugging... :-X
Quote from: xtophr on March 11, 2009, 10:41:32 AM
(http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3414/3345929019_5339f64f98.jpg?v=0)
That's a fantastic shot. Shows the plugging of the two tubes and the sensor hole as well as the brazing of the hinge. Now if we could see one of the filler hole plugging... :-X
Do you want me to come over and do it for you too? ;D
That's a carbie tank.
I just use an appropriate size rubber stopper.
Quote from: ducpainter on March 11, 2009, 12:11:26 PM
Do you want me to come over and do it for you too? ;D
snip
That's
very generous of you - sure, c'mon down ;D ;)
Quote from: ducpainter on March 11, 2009, 12:11:26 PM
Do you want me to come over and do it for you too? ;D
I'd be really impressed if you came up to Alaska for this! [moto] [roll]
Quote from: ducpainter on March 11, 2009, 12:11:26 PM
I just use an appropriate size rubber stopper.
These things are new to me. While I can usually grasp new concepts easily, the importance of "doing it right" is underscored by my feelings for the bike. This is not the first time that my Ducati has let me down. The flaky rockers, bad fuel sender and now a rusty tank. All from a 2004 model year "Premium Product". I'm living with it for now because of the fore-mentioned feelings, but really; Come on... this kind of thing over and over gives me a new perspective on the emotional attachment I and many others feel for these bikes. So really, I appreciate all of the excellent advice that I'm receiving from those that have been there. I'm just trying to retain the excellent care that I give this bike. I'm going to "do it right". [thumbsup]
Quote from: xtophr on March 12, 2009, 10:00:42 AM
I'd be really impressed if you came up to Alaska for this! [moto] [roll]
These things are new to me. While I can usually grasp new concepts easily, the importance of "doing it right" is underscored by my feelings for the bike. This is not the first time that my Ducati has let me down. The flaky rockers, bad fuel sender and now a rusty tank. All from a 2004 model year "Premium Product". I'm living with it for now because of the fore-mentioned feelings, but really; Come on... this kind of thing over and over gives me a new perspective on the emotional attachment I and many others feel for these bikes. So really, I appreciate all of the excellent advice that I'm receiving from those that have been there. I'm just trying to retain the excellent care that I give this bike. I'm going to "do it right". [thumbsup]
It would be cheaper for you to ship me your tank. ;D
I'm sorry you've had some bad experiences with your bike...
but It's not rocket science.
If you can braze and figure out how to plug the holes in the tank, and read the directions on the POR kit...
it's been done right. [thumbsup]