Ducati Monster Forum

Decided to examine my valve clearances today. All the openers were so tight I could barely get the 0015 in there. The closers were all about 005-006 (loaded gap). This can be mended I'm sure.

BUT the scary question: Is there supposed to be oil under the covers?? I suspect not. Horizontal cover unleashed a stunning 1 Tbsp of oil on the exhaust side. The vertical cover let loose about 1/4 tsp on the exhaust side.

Are my valves on the exhaust sides so loose that they are letting tons of oil by? Or are my valves cooked and I need new ones?
Plugs were a bit oily on the top ring as well. Ceramic looked perfect though.
 :'(

The oil is normal.

Adjust them and be happy.

tis the season of premature speculation it seems.

Im new to desmo valves and even valve adjustments period.

Has there been a rash of premature speculation lately?

Thanks fellas.

oil in the heads is better than oil in the cylinders ;)

P'raps some sort of instructional manual would be helpful   ;)

Right, but there was some on the plugs. But could this be resolved with a properly adjusted set of valves?

Oil or fuel?

It seems to bear repeating.  [beer]

Black n shiny on the top ring. Maybe down one thread aswell.

Top ring?

Black and shiny could be either.

I suppose it could also be gas soaked carbon...
Wiped off pretty easy with a cloth.
I guess I will assess the valve clearance issue first, then move on.

So about my clearance issue, I gotta order four larger shims for the closers and sand down the four openers, yes?

Stop trying to diagnose a problem...if there even is one...with valves that are way out of adjustment.

Start with the basics. Until you have a baseline all the speculation and worry is wasted energy.

Agreed.
I found this shop: http://www.emsduc.com/products.html (http://www.emsduc.com/products.html)
I can't afford the full shim kit. Glad to see they sell individual shims.

But what size do I need for my 99 750?

Keep in mind you need to use his measuring adapter to get closing shims that will work. You also might want to order a size on either side of the ones you think you need to account for differences in measuring equipment. Be prepared to sand shims.

You have 8mm stems.

Ok. Why not use a micrometer? will the end not fit inside the shim?

Apparently so. The closer measurement tool from EMS will also work for openers. I just adjusted my valves for the first time recently and everything worked as it should. If you don't want to buy new shims, a dealer should let you trade in the old ones. That's what I did and it cost me nothing.

It will on openers, but the inside of the closer is slightly rounded to match the shape of the half ring.

The tool is somewhat mandatory to get what you need.

I'm sure with experience you could make the adjustment without it, but how often does the average DIY'er adjust valves and take the measurements?

 [thumbsup]

Just one other question: I am reading that all closers should be close to .000. I have also read that they should just be able to turn with your finger(s). Is that turning done loaded or unloaded?

With respect to oil in the valve heads. The valve train should get some oil ya know moving metal parts and all. There is a small oil galley hole as the Synder manual says don't drop stuff in there.
As far as I know the preferred specs for 2 valvers are.

Ducati:
-Openers .05-.12mm (.0019"-.0047")
-Closers   .03-.20mm (.001"-.0078")

Synder or similar manuals:
-Openers 0.1mm (.004")
-Closers  0.05mm (.002")

I also would worry about buying the whole shim kit either. I spent the cash and very rarely use any of the shims once the bike gets settled, which I'm sure your is by now, big adjustments are rare. Get the tool and order a shim or two. The shim measuring tool and a few shims can't be more than $50 so then what to do with all the money you saved you could  [drink] or  [wine] and admire your handy work or act like a boss and [coffee] then do this  [Dolph].
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v30/Batman50/79B59F6F-27EA-4658-AAED-5079DB5E24B9-3549-0000027C70EAC724_zps33f9fef5.jpg)

Closer unloaded.

A better way to get it close to zero is to remove the belt and turn the cam slightly. You'll be able to feel if the closing rocker arm is dragging on the lobe. You don't want that.

You want to set your closers first. It will change the opening clearance.

You know... that picture (without the arrow of course) would look really good blown up and framed. Kind of like art for those that appreciate things like that.

Got it. About shims, no I did not plan for a whole kit considering the service intervals. And its damn expensive.

So then for example if my loaded closer is .007 and the opener is .0015, that means that my closer in this example is too loose by .0055. I would then have to remove the closer shim, measure its thickness and add .0055 to it. Then order its nearest shim size, erring on the larger side of things if theres not a perfect fit and I need to sand. Right?

Couldnt i just use a bolt thin enough to fitin the shim and do the math?
And about that pic...if you would like a painting of a shot like that I can do it. See the link in my tagline.

You can do it that way...

and end up with a bunch of wrong shims.

Tell you what.
I've got an EMS 8mm shim measuring tool that I've used so much that it's worn out.
I'll sell it to you for $5.
It'll look the part, and be close, but still be wrong.
 [laugh]

Seriously, just buy the tool.

 Most of the time paying for a tool is the cheapest way to do things!

My reasoning for the idea is this: I need the tool to measure my shims. I wont know which sizes to order unless I measure them. So im left with either ordering a bunch of shims and only using what I need and having leftovers, or ordering the tool and then order whatever shims I need, or make my own tool and order only what I need.
I mean its only a 10mm length of steel with a top. Basically a bolt, a dremmel, sand paper and calipers could do the job, no?

NO ;D

The tool fits very precisely in the rounded shape of the shim. If you use someone else tool to measure and then order his shims you'll get the wrong shim.

We're trying to make this easy for you and you're insisting on making it difficult.

Not insisting on being difficult. Honestly, had I remembered that you said that the shims are slightly domed I would not have even considered making my own tool. Shame on me. But seriously, thanks for putting up w my nonsense. 

It seems like either I get the tool, measure and then order what shims I need (hate ordering and waiting twice) or shoot in the dark at sizes and hope I get a hit.
Am I missing something?

Unless someone could help me ballpark what shims to get if my closers all measure around .005-.006 (unloaded).

There's no way to tell what's in there.

I realize you don't want to wait...make believe this is 1960...there is no internet...and you have 3 tv stations.

You go to Sears, or the local bike shop to get what you need...and you wait.

It's really very peaceful. ;D

Like I said before, if there's a Ducati dealer in your area, go there and trade in your old shims for new ones. I had to go back 3 times before I got it right, but I did it all in the same day. Faster than ordering and waiting, and it's FREE. [thumbsup]

Thanks fellas. I suppose I could call Ducati in SOHO but I have always steered away from dealers as a rule. But its just for shims so we'll see if I get in touch with somebody cool or a duche. Heard bad stuff about that place...

No one in NYMMC that has the tool that can help you out?

Meh, I will just peacefully order the tool I guess. Easier than multiple trips to Manhattan. Sorry to waste the bandwidth on such silliness.

Have you considered the ducatitoolrental.com kit?

BK

Have you asked over in NYMMC about borrowing an EMS tool?

nah I just ordered one. Most headache free choice. Irony would have it that Mike is out of town til Friday.  [laugh]

this.

for your first check, i suggest this as the best option... after it's all said and done then you'll know what exactly you'll need to buy for the second time.

If you really don't want to leave home, http://www.ducatitoolrental.com (http://www.ducatitoolrental.com) also has complete sets of shims for rent for $50. You pay $9 for each shim you use and send the rest back.

Just gonna take my time. The tool is on its way and then I will order whatever shims I need from EMS. Thanks fellas.

Your patience will pay off...BE PATIENT with the whole procedure and enjoy it   [thumbsup]

Yep. I got the shim tool and a v caliper. Now to find an extra hour.... :)