Ducati Monster Forum

So I took my S2R800 to a local Mid-Atlantic dealer for a reflash, belts, valves and a new tank. They have done a fair amount of work for me in the past, including tank warranty number one about 2 years ago. I am picky, usually do all my own work and have a hard time trusting shops. I trusted these guys before and was not let down. They talked me into Caswell coating the new tank because it is the last one I will get. I dropped the bike off on April 5th. I picked the bike up today. They have had the bike for 12 weeks, but for 4 of the last 12 weeks, I have been out of town. They called at about week 9 to tell me it was done. They knew in advance that I would be away on work travel for the month of June. They have called and bugged me multiple times over the last three weeks to pay them and pick up the bike. They did waive any storage costs.

I get there today and they didn't install the new tank filler I picked out with the parts manager. That didn't end up on the repair order I signed, so I'm willing to chalk that my fault for not reading the 2 page repair order. Still highly annoying (and a missed opportunity to sell me more parts and service). I know I can get the filler cheaper and install is no big deal so whatever. But upon inspection of the tank coating, there are visible bubbles and pits on the portion of the tank that is visible through the filler neck. Is that normal?

While they are searching for the new key they cut for me (yeah they couldn't find it), the tech lets it slip that he knows for a fact that they made the key because he took the chip out of the new one and the old one and stuffed the old one into the ignition switch. WHAT?!?! I asked for a DP reflash and to have the immobilizer function completely removed. Good thing this was actually on the repair order. I could have hidden the chip years ago myself. And the new key doesn't work real well, but I'll hit with a wire brush and take the burs off it and hopefully that will help (strangely, if I had that key cut at my local hardware store, they would work on it until it worked perfectly every time).

Next, as we are loading the bike on the truck, I notice that the the oil cooler line clamp is just swinging free from the bottom of the oil line. Hmmm. Upon closer inspection the hose is routed wrong. The service manager gets defensive because they are the "wrong" oil lines. Interesting as the owner talked me into the multistrada (or is it hypermotard) oil line swap when I had my last tank swapped out because he had a take-off lying around. The same tech put those take-offs on there that was now under the bike complaining that it was non-stock. I don't care where it came from or who did it, a bike should be put back together the way it came in. We all have cell cameras.......

On top of all this, the service manager comes to me with a list of other service items that I need to have done. WHAT!?!?! The bike was there for 12 weeks? Why didn't he call me with these items and have them done while the bike was in the shop? They went ahead an replaced a belt idler that had frozen without authorization, so now I'm really confused. I'm not hard to get in touch with at all. But he already knew that because he called me so many times trying to get me to pick up my bike.

I'm so livid right now I can hardly see straight. I like those guys. I trusted those guys. I tried not to come unglued on their staff, but I'm afraid I got a little unprofessional when their service manager had the audacity to raise his voice to me defending the undefendable. All of his apologies we un-apologies. I wanted to talk to the owner, but he had left for lunch and I had no more patience.

To their credit they tried to resolve it. They are going to send me a new ECU reflashed with the DP flash and with the immobilizer completely removed. Trouble is, my round trip drive time to Winchester is 4 hours and I will need a TPS reset and adjustment once it is installed. They also tried to re-attach the oil line holder while it was tied down in my truck and I told him to give up because the line was obviously routed incorrectly and rubbing on the cooling fins of the forward jug.

How pissed should I be? Really the only thing they did right, that I can tell, is mount the new tires. I'm out $2k and I feel like I've been robbed. I figured I would do a gut check here before I go cuckoo bananas on the dealer on the interwebs.

I think you should try to resolve your issues before you burn them publicly. Sounds like they haven't had a chance to resolve anything yet. Maybe delete this thread and reepost later if they fail.

Fair enough. I removed the names. Post stays.

As far as resolution, perhaps I wasn't clear. They have offered all that they are going to offer. They are going to send me a reflashed ECU without the immobilizer. They will install and reset TPS for free. Trouble is, it is a 4 hour trip for me. That is a lot of time and diesel, and I'm not inclined to let them work on the bike anymore. They don't care about the tank (it could be fine). They don't care about the oil line (they blamed me for that). They don't care that it took them 9 weeks to fix it, they dropped the ball on some add-on parts, or that they didn't properly inspect the bike and service other items.

+1

and I figured which shop you are talking about....and due to the growth they have experienced, it seems finding good staff to keep up with it is hard to do...but I was try and address it with Donnie as well...

#FAIL. I'd be PISSED!  I know the shop you are talking about, the staff you are referring to and the owner in question. I went down that road with the about errors in service after purchasing a bike from them.  So not small dollars here.  Their staff doesn't admit to fault easily and in my experience will blame it on you (as you have seen).  The owner is no better in my opinion. You may come away feeling justified and the wrongs righted but they're gonna make you do all the work( i.e.: dont even ask them about picking it up). I and others I know have come away feeling more angry and enraged at their level of customer disrespect and the tone they take.   

Good shops are hard to find but despite their reputation for being one of the best on the EC, myself and other owners I know are no longer taking our bikes there for service or parts purchase. 

No, you weren't clear. That's why I said what I said. I can see why you would be upset with some of the stuff but not with all of it. For instance, the time frame they had the bike. I dismissed thinking you have an argument there when you left it for a month after they were finished. And they didn't even charge you storage. Must not have been that big of a deal to you to get the bike back in a timely manner.

That is why I posted this - a gut check.

I've gotten over being pissed about the delay, long before I even left town. I knew they were a man down and I knew I should have brought it in earlier in the winter. They estimated 6 weeks. I said fine, I should have brought it in before April.  

Did you read the part of my post where I said I couldn't pick the bike up because I was on business travel for the whole month of June? Not really a question of how bad I wanted the bike back.  I really wanted the bike back BEFORE I left on my business trip and made that clear BEFORE I dropped the bike off and again at the time of drop off.

My point in bringing up the time frame is why didn't they take that extra time to provide better service and and make more money. I would have gladly paid them for the other things they found. I was also a little miffed that he hounded me to pick it up and asked me to pay the bill sight unseen when I couldn't pick it up until today. Each time he called I told him I would be in this week. Each time he called me he acted like he had no recollection of our previous call.

Get ducatidiag, that way you can reset your own tps.

Brilliant. I wish I had known about this back in April, I'd have flashed the damn thing myself and saved $350 and a bunch of aggravation. Now I can just wait for the new ECU and never have to go back there again.

Typical BS from Ducpond, now Ducati Winchester.  Donnie and his crew outright lied to me on multiple occasions, dealing with both of the bikes that I took out to him.  I understand the "increased business" and "good help is hard to find", but this shit has been happening out there since I moved into the area in 2010.  It's been brought to his attention many times, and he has had plenty an opportunity to straighten his shit out.  At the end of the day, he still goes to great lengths to take care of LONG TIME customers (thinking Gene here), but unless you've been dealing with him since he opened; you just can't trust him.  I will never be able to recommend his business in good faith, and will go out of my way to make sure other people know how he runs his shop.

I don't have enough knowledge of the current sutuation to have any comment. I'm not sure I get any special treatment, but I expect respect for me and my bikes and I give it in return. And part of that is I don't say much but when they work on one of my bikes I expect it to be done right and I have told them so. The few times, maybe 2 or 3 since 2004, there has been a minor issue I've gone straight to them and expressed not only my displeasure but expected immediate corrections. I'm a happy customer and I am of the opinion they are the best shop in this area and for that reason I want to see them succeed, telling them when they do things right and telling them when they do things wrong is part of ensuring their success. I also admit I go out of my way to try and devlelop a relationship with the shops I do business with, that has worked for me for 40+ years now. Just my $.02 - Gene

To me, the only way to get these dealers to service our bikes correctly and to treat us right is to get DNA involved. Eventually the dealer will either straighten out or DNA will take the franchise and give it to a dealer that desires it.

Really? That has not worked with one dealer in our area since the 80's, they are still in business, still a superstore that sells cheap but still has the same crappy approach to service and warranty. On a personal level they have some great people working there but success is measured in how much product they came move in all departments. But DNA did a bang up job on our plastic tanks didn't they? Left the dealers and owners holding the bag. - Gene

there is at least one DNA personnel on the board.

Something definitely off here, possibly communication or chemistry or both with a touch of carelessness thrown in. The dealer principal can't know everything unless we tell him.

Only had four interactions with this establishment and the owner and I are on the same wave length. He's a master tech and engineer by trade, not always a "people person". I'd rather have someone who cuts to the chase having had to deal with the hoards myself for 40+ years. My requests have not been easy to accommodate and this dealer has done backflips for me to make my life easier. Having been in biz myself, I never wanted anyone "voting with their feet", so I'm sure Gene will clue him.

"Sales" has not exactly impressed me there but the Parts Manager who IS a true "people person" is above average attentive and knowledgeable. Just MY $0.02...

Assume you've never worked in retail? "These dealers"?  ;D Running to "mommy" before you give the dealer a chance to rectify the situation is great way to make yourself persona non grata. Business is a two-way street. Dealers make $$$ and survive by reputation and repeat business. There is never enough "new" business to keep the doors open.

How about when Donnie goes well out of his way to tell you, both over the telephone and in person, that he will personally be doing the work on your bike, only to find out that he sluffs it off to the new kid when I go and pick it up.  The statement of who would be doing the work was not solicited in any way, and completely brought on by Donnie.  He specifically told me that he would be the only person touching my BSTs as he knew he would have to pay for them if they got damaged, and if he had to pay for them it would be because "he" messed them up.  

The second time was with my KTM.  I know that is not their cup of tea, so I asked them whether they were interested in working on it before I took it out to them.  They said "sure, bring it out", so I did.  I was only looking at getting a new set of tires at first, so it really wasn't that big of a deal.  Left the bike with them and asked them to give me a call when it was done.  I called them a couple of days later to ask if they'd be able/willing to balance the throttle bodies while it was there, they said yes, and if the bike would be ready to pick up in a week's time, to which they again said yes.  I went out to pick it up ten days after the stated week, only to find that the bike was in pieces all over one of the work benches, and was reportedly only running on one cylinder.  Needless to say, I was a bit surprised to hear that, as it was running just fine when I dropped it off.  I went into the shop with...  Chad I believe... to take a look at it, and noticed that the new tires that were on it weren't even what I had asked for.  I questioned that and was told "we weren't able to get the ones you asked for", so they just decided to slap something else on without bothering to call me.  At this point I went to go find Donnie.  He wasn't there at that specific moment which in hindsight was good, as it gave me a chance to take a few breaths and get some of the "pissed" out of my system.  He got back a few minutes later and I asked him if we could chat.  He immediately laid into me for bringing him a bike that wasn't what he specialized in, and was barely running.  Here's where it is good that I had that chance to cool down a touch, because if he would have acted like that when I first went to find him I would have likely crushed his face in with my helmet.  Anyhow, he said that he didn't have time to get my bike back together that day (remember, this was three days after I said I would pick it up) and that I'd have to come back.  He changed his mind after I dialed my attorney buddy and handed him the phone.  

The really sad part is, I am a firm believer in establishing a good relationship with the shops/techs that I have work on my stuff.  I had been out there to chat/BS with them several times, and had already been talking to him about tearing open the SC's motor over the winter and doing major work to it.  He knew I intended to be that several visit, multiple purchase, repeat customer, but he blew it.  

That's what I was thinking exactly. Jeez, you could buy a fair amount of tools for 2 grand.
[hint hint]

of course not everytime or immediately
but once the dealer has made their final offer for restitution and its no where near right then yes dna is exactly the right place.
Add to the fact you can only make a persona non grata call a few times before word gets around and you have no customers
this is how and why independents pop up for service

Angler - You're going to get a mixed bag of responses about this shop.  While some are passionate about the work they have done for them others are not so.  I am unfortunately in this camp.  If DucPond can make it right by your standards, and you can trust their work, you'll be a happy repeat customer.  However, based on my dealings with their owner and sales guy, DucPond is the last place I would trust my bike to. You paid good money to have them complete the work.  I dont think there's a worse feeling than not having a sound piece of mind when you pick your bike up from a shop.

Sorry to the DucPond faithful, but I can't support their shop, nor their owners attitude. Like DW said, unless you're one of Donnie's favorites, his attitude based on my encounters was I don't give a shit about you.  I just want your money and I'll survive with a pissed off customer here and there because the name DucPond is known for being top notch and that will continue to bring us business. I wrote a note to DNA regarding my experience since I knew DucPond was becoming Ducati Winchester and told them to strongly consider who is representing their brand.  Thats just how mistreated I felt and still feel. 

Why is it that people think they can solve any problem like this by posting on the net?

For me is cathartic.  I think the OP was trying to determine if his feeling were grounded or if he was overreacting.  And well the topic went from there.....

Just my personal thinking, but if I'm pissed off about a situation, I really don't care if others think I'm justified or not.

I'm still pissed. ;D

name and shame is the only way forward ,, stealers like all businesses dont like bad publicity

I'm a relative newcomer to motorcycles and after a few bad experiences with my local dealer I stopped using them.

This thread dredged up some of the same thoughts and feelings I had in the past and one that really bewilders me is the whole "bring it on in" followed by "yeah it'll be ready in X weeks."

This is bewildering to me because at a former employer I had minute-to-minute contact with car dealers and service bays.  With a car dealer, generally, you call ahead, get an appointment, drop the car off, they order parts, and a few days later (generally) it's done.  My wife's old car needed a top end rebuild and even then the dealer finished it in a week.

Why does it take 2 weeks for a ducati valve adjust?  You'd think at a ducati shop they'd have all the parts, right?  When Flight was still in Reseda, I made an appointment with with Stu, rode it up there, he did the full 12k while I stood there and watched and tried to learn everything I could.  It took, I dunno, 4 hours?  5 hours?  Why does it take my dealer 2 weeks to do the same job?

I understand shops are busy, and that's a good problem for them to have.  But this whole 'drop it off and we'll work on it when we can' just blows my mind.  I mean you know roughly how long a job will take, why not forecast out how busy you'll be and schedule jobs according to that forecast?

This is a legitimate question because I really don't know and I'm hoping someone can enlighten me: 

Other than how quickly auto dealers can get parts, is there some functional difference that keeps moto dealers from emulating their process? 

You probably don't have to Tweet when you take a sh*t or fondle your iToy 24/7 or walk into walls or water fountains either.  ;)

Most under 30 can't tell you who the VP is or much else which is not on their social network feeds/blogs. Bunch of lemmings?  :'(

You are fortunate to be a private contractor and hopefully can make a living as that course is not without risks either. I'd wager that many here have no clue about the costs, inventory, restrictions and investment which are all required to be a franchised dealer. Sadly in this day of J.D. Powers IQS and CSI, you can't pick and choose your clientele either. It worked a lot better for everybody when you could. Before I retired, 80% of my business was repeat and referral..., but I royally p*ssed off the 10% I turned away.  ;D

Without writing a book...?  ;D Motorcycle shops are a very seasonal business if they are not in CA or FL. Very hard to keep skilled staff occupied 6+ months out of the year.

Car manufacturers also have an economy of scale when it comes to parts and support which motorcycle manufacturers could never hope to duplicate. Same goes for your service adviser experience at a better car dealership. Car dealers also live on warranty work and reimbursed scheduled maintenance which you are paying for with your initial purchase. As I said, it'd be a thick book if I explained it all..., and you will NOT find it on the Internet!  8)

Try being a boat owner if you think motorcycle shops are bad. Like having a brand new boat , <5 hours on it, sitting at your dock at your lake house, your on vacation, but the boat has a problem, the dealer won't have time to look at it because all of his techs are too busy getting boats in the water for the season, he finally looks at your boat in 3 days and the repair takes 1/2 hour. You have 1 day left on your 5 day vacation. Funny when I think back on it but at the time I was almost in cardiac arrest. - Gene

I've considered opening a bike shop before.

I don't know if I hate myself enough yet.

Do it with a friend  [evil] You'll hate each other instead...

lol

For warranty work I go to Ducati Newport Beach, for all else it's goes to Motoservicio. Never had an issue with cost, time, lies, or any other BS at either shop. In fact DNB sends a guy to pick up the bike up at my house and drops it off when it's done. So, it's not a motorcycle shop issue, it's a poorly run motorcycle shop issue.

As far as airing this stuff out on the net. I think it's the right thing to do AFTER you have given the vendor the opportunity to do the right thing or after they cross the line of professionalism. Then, especially in a community such as this, it's our duty to alert our fellow riders/friends so they don't suffer the same treatment.

The business environment is the States is not all that easy.  I have a great balloon business that was five star (now 4) rated on Yelp.  I took some Groupons and ran into some of the worst humans I have ever tried to do business with.  As such I tell a percentage of them to go get their money back as I won't take them flying.  They then go one star me.  Those we decide to take flying love the experience we deliver and we usually get five stars reviews from those we fly.

However, if someone is rude or pushy they will not like me.  I have had people demand to fly on a day that is outside the limitations of their coupon and they will threaten me with a bad review if they don't get it.  Needless to say I tell them I am done with them and I won't take them flying under any circumstances.  They one star me.........

I imagine that is not dissimilar to a motorcycle shop.  Riders by nature are AA personalities, some of these personalities will clash without even knowing why, it is simply nature.  When the owners get involved with the customers the chances of a beef with the business actually increase..... 

I like to know when a business is pissing off a disproportionate number of people.  No matter how hard you try you can't make everyone happy....... 

This. 

+1

you work hard for your money........they should work hard for your money also.

I think the key is how easy motorbikes are to work on yourself. My bike has never been to a dealer. I bought it, they said "see ya in 1000km" and I thought (but didn't say) "yeah right". A thousand km later I changed my own oil.

My car is different. Recently (actually in January) the clutch throwout bearing discombobulated. I knew it was the throwout bearing and figured I'd just fix it. So I dove in, over a period of about four weekends. I skinned knuckles, swore, cut perfectly good spanners up to get them to fit in ridiculously cramped places, and eventually gave up when I realised that if I ever did get the gearbox free, there's just no way on earth I could lift it. So I put it back together, and next week (once my tax return comes in) will arrange for a mechanic to collect it.

See on my bike everything's easy. It's right there in front of me. And because its easy for me, it's easy for others too, which means places like this exist where we share knowledge and help one another out. Which only makes it easier.

Then of course there are lots of really smart independent guys (many of whom are here) that pick up the harder work for knowledgeable people. For those in the know.

So the dealers end up with the shit work and the dumb customers. Boring oil changes and servicing, prepping new bikes, diagnosing "my bike won't start" issues on badly neglected bikes. How are you going to keep a decent mechanic motivated with that? Of course the standard of work is gonna be low. How could it not be?

Why do you think I chose not to Izaak? 

I thought I was doing well using that word in the office yesterday.

But to use it on the Monster forum to relate a busted Peugeot in Western Australia to a thread about a bad dealer experience in the US ... that takes some talent. Well done young lady.

Chicken.

And I found a great space in NE.

Fixed it for you ;D

Nice place in SE?  No such thing.

I've been lucky enough to be able to find some awesome dealers. Only 2 were disappointments, both North GA. The dealer I bought my Monster from folded within a few months of me buying it. The other place bought out the original dealer's stock, but they mostly sold rice burners. They had to hire someone that could service the Ducs. The guy was always too busy and his work suffered for it. I trust 5 places total in the SE to even look at Ducs. Depending on whether it's performance work or more warranty related, but I've felt very lucky to have that level of service so close. Now, if they would only be cheaper.

Wow. I go away for a weekend and look at all this......

Thanks everybody.

I just want to reiterate this was a gut check. I've used them before and been happy. This time, not so much. To those who think I should wait until this is resolved before venting, I also want to reiterate that it is resolved as far as it can be. They can't do anything else for me. Or rather my bike will never spend another minute in their shop again. They offered to send me an ECU flashed the way they promised and, regarding the other items, there really isn't anything they can do regarding the dropped balls and crappy service.

Well I'm here to report that a new ECU arrived yesterday with the DP tune and the immobilizer disabled (or so their note says).......

Their note also says I'll need to come in and have the TPS reset and the trim fiddled with before it will run right. Since I didn't get Ducatidiag set up before it got shut down, I'm not sure how I'm going to get this done as I'm not going back out there for anything.

I am still finding things they should have caught. I have BoomTubes, which they don't like, and on the first couple of rides I found it to backfire like mad when decelerating in gear. Like shoot flames bad. While trying to reroute the oil lines they routed funny and to reattach brackets they left dangling, I discovered both exhaust pipes so loose at the head I could wiggle them. Now I'm not blaming them for loosening them, but shouldn't that be the first thing they checked when it backfired like mad on their test ride? It was almost the first thing I checked. 10 minutes with a 10mm wrench later and no backfire.......

Yep.  Donnie does good work.

Yeah I'm beginning to wonder if it was even test ridden.....

I get a whiff of sarcasm in this post...

I'm generally not known for being sarcastic.

Nice thread. I'm too new to put my .02 in, but had a similar issue with a BMW dealership in Greensboro, NC.(not trying to identify them) But after being shorted my warranty by seven months, waiting for the OK of a goodwill part costing >400.00, and finally getting hooked up with a GREAT shop in Salem, VA, I filed a complaint with BMW. I moved my business elsewhere. Every chance I get, I express the service I received there. It was perpetual and unethical. The originator of this thread showed restraint, which is commendable. If that were me, I probably would have needed a bail bondsman and the owner a proctologist to remove my foot from his six.

No to jack your thread but I am pretty pissed right now as well.  A rental shop here screwed up the Multistrada trip I had planned for two weeks.  Despite knowing I had to have the top case for a backrest (GF) They showed up without, due a previous client damaging it.  Had days to tell me and did not.  Now my trip is on hold and am doing everything I can to salvage it.  If it does not happen look for a complete write-up on how it went down.   >:(