Ducati Monster Forum

With the usual WTF paint job  ;D

http://blogs.motorcyclistonline.com/spied-ducati-scrambler-41431.html (http://blogs.motorcyclistonline.com/spied-ducati-scrambler-41431.html)

That handlebar looks super tall, but I think I really like the overall direction it appears they're taking it.

doesn't look like much has changed from the last round of pictures that surfaced last fall about this pig....


the Monster 821 on the other hand ( not to dilute your thread ) looks much more fleshed out...

(http://i1.wp.com/www.asphaltandrubber.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/03/Ducati-Monster-800.jpg?resize=635%2C423)

http://www.asphaltandrubber.com/bikes/2015-ducati-monster-800-spotted/ (http://www.asphaltandrubber.com/bikes/2015-ducati-monster-800-spotted/)

WTF indeed: except for the engine, that could be anything.



And on a related note, this might be the new Diavel...  [laugh]

(http://www.dieselbike.net/Hamm03/038.jpg)

I already like it more than the old Diavel.

the Diavel, or the OLDE Diavel A.K.A. the Indiana?

(http://en.ducati-club.net/graphics/gallery/full/401_750.jpg)

Photos of that thing should be banned from this forum... [puke]

Ducati is making a Scrambler?!?!?

Agreed with again. WTH??  :)

Scrambler? Looks like sheeat.

The Analog Motorcycles one is about as good as it'll ever get..

(http://photos.ducati.net/Museum-Ducati-Photos-Brochures/Ducati-Racers-and-Specials/Analog-Ducati-Indiana-Custom/i-HPh56Mb/0/M/ducati_web_06-M.jpg)

http://photos.ducati.net/Museum-Ducati-Photos-Brochures/Ducati-Racers-and-Specials/Analog-Ducati-Indiana-Custom/35649595_Dc2xKr# (http://photos.ducati.net/Museum-Ducati-Photos-Brochures/Ducati-Racers-and-Specials/Analog-Ducati-Indiana-Custom/35649595_Dc2xKr#)!i=2994780896&k=HPh56Mb

Sorry to jack your thread with the..."Indiana", of all bikes...

 [laugh]
Somehow, in a sick and twisted way, I kinda' like it. It's so bad it's almost good. In the Belt Drive Desmodue book, there is a pic of the blacked out prototype, which looks better than many contemporary cruiser copies and a lot better than the cheesy chromed out production version. The blacked out prototype has a custom XL883/1200 look about it.

Keep waking up sweating after seeing visions of Ducaudi Scooters launched to compete with those sold by BMW (C600 Sport & C650 GT) and Aprilia (SRV 850 ABS) [puke].

Scooters make the beast with two backsing rock.  8)


ttp://youtu.be/YLUI8Whnglo

Mods on Ducatis, the Rockers won't like that. I got a feeling the Ducati marketing people don't give a shit about bums like me. [laugh]

OK I am a little confused ... admittedly it doesn't take much ... but am I getting this right:



So BMW has got it right and Ducati has got it wrong?

BMW has got it right because they will produce the R NineT  and scooters.

Ducati has got it wrong because the new Monster is not retro enough but the Scrambler raises fears of them producing a scooter. The Scrambler is their new 'retro' even though their last foray into retro was not that successful. The scooter would be just as retro as Ducati used to make scooters in the 50s and 60s. That seems to fit my idea of retro more than re-creating a retro Monster that was first produced less than 20 years ago and has only seen significant design change in the last six years ... even though it could be argued that the original Monster design was rather 'retro' itself.

At the end of the day the Monster is Ducati's volume leader and I don't think retro is big enough to support their volume seller ... the Scrambler will soon be here for that. Besides (from an aesthetic point of view) I think the new Monster is more retro than the old-new Monster.

Having said all that ... I prefer the old-old Monster styling too.

Does that make things clearer?

Now two of us are confused – you quoted posts that I replied with on two different Threads; this one and another on ‘Monster 800 at WDW 2014’.  Or maybe you just pretend to be (confused), me thinks :).

The Monster already featured ‘Retro’ Styling when it was launched in ’93 IMHO.  Minimalist and uncluttered.  Clean, lean and mean.  It ticked the three quintessential ‘Real Bike’ boxes; 1) it just looked so good, 2) it sounded like; well, like only a Ducati can sound like, and 3) it was easy to ride.  In fact; it was a Bike that Joe Soap could ride flat out, or almost flat out anyway.  And it made him feel like he was Steve McQueen or James Dean when he was on it.  A real one-ton Bike.  Not too little, not too much – just right – what Triumph, Norton and BSA tried so hard to accomplish for so long.  A couple of different sizes for different confidence levels and leg-lengths.  The rest is history – it sold like clappers.  Everybody loved it – from total noob to hardcore biker.

Ducati should NOT be building Scramblers – the Hyper and Multi are close enough, also to show that they are outside their comfort zone whenever they veer off-road.  As for Scooters; I also did a couple of silly things when I was young and foolish.  I prefer not to talk about those.  Hell, Ducati should not even have built the Diavel (an Italian Stab at the US Cruiser Market, c’mon) – but I will forgive them for that, and only because it kicks V-Max ass so real good.

Moreover; Ducati should NOT be expanding their Model Range at this point in time.  They should rather consolidate and aim to make their current top Models stand out – ranging from the 1199 Superleggera (at the Hipster end) through to the Monster 696 (and the PPLs end).  And when Ducati introduces new Models, they should do so where they can dominate, not to follow the Trends set by others.

They have just done an insane thing, killing the Air-cooled Monster Motor at this point in time.  What they have done to the Monster, should have been done to the Streetfighter – to hunt down the Brutale and the Beast.  The Monster should have been revamped to take on the forthcoming Retro Bike Wave, head-on – Ducati was already ahead of the Competition by two decades.

Only my two cents’…

My M900 is still a great bike even with 50K miles on it, the new M1200S is a better bike and the plumbing on the left side does not detract from the fact that this is a better bike. The Diavel is also a great bike, regardless of the negative comments it gets on this forum, I knew that when I put ~500 miles on one doing sweep rider duties for a Ducati Experience event in Virginia. I waited for the new M1200S to come out before I made my buying decision, the two things that sent me to a Diavel was the overall comfort for 2up riding, my lady is very slender but fits better on the Diavel, the passenger foot pegs competing with space for my foot and I have a small foot, and the icing on the cake was the great deal I got on it and the intoxicating rush from that right handgrip. As for the scrambler, I predict if they do it right they will sell a lot of them here in US, not my thing, but there is a lot of interest in my circles. - Gene

I combined the two quotes because I read them back to back and thought ... 'that is a bit contradictory isn't it?'


So I will try not to get carried away, but I am still a little confused.


I don't think Ducati are building an off-road bike with the Scrambler any more than they have built an off-road bike in the Hyper or Multi-stroodle. Sure they could be ridden off-road but Ducati probably expect this as much as I do.

The Scrambler is Ducati's way of giving you what you want ... an air-cooled, retro, fun bike. If that is what you want I encourage you to embrace it - modify it if necessary just as Ducati expect of most of the Wankeristi*. I see this as a far more plausible solution to your 'problem' than having Ducati agreeing with you that their biggest seller move backwards in design and performance when it is often viewed in the market that they are already behind the competition (as you mentioned earlier).


I didn't know they had killed the air-cooled Monster. I haven't seen anything to indicate the wee-Monster will be killed off ... but as has been discussed many times - emissions targets will continue to drive the bigger, more powerful bikes to water-cooling.

* I use this as a term of endearment, please don't take offence. The Ducatisti terminology only perpetuates the snobbish perception and confirms us (yes I include myself) as a bunch of wankers to those looking from 'outside'.

 At the risk of posting a "+1" post, I gotta agree with Betty here. The Monster started out as a stripped down version of their race bike, which the Steetfighter now does.  To me, putting the 4 valve motor into the Monster just takes it back to its original intent.
 I see the Streetfighter as a temporary model to fill in until the Monster fills that role again.

Why would you not want to be regarded to be a snob, when you are riding a Ducati*, particularly a Monster?  I was on the ‘outside’ for a long time and have personally experienced the resentment of the Deprived.  They know that they are missing something, even though only some realize that they would/could not fully appreciate whatever it is that they are missing.  But they suspect something like that anyway and it infuriates them.  Capisce?

* or any other passionate** Italian Bike, but most ostentatiously of course, a Ducati ;D.
** which is why Ride-by-Wire is simply sacrilege when fitted to a Monster!

I firmly believe, for example, that people driving Maserati Quattroportes are total snobs :-[.


I most respectfully have to completely disagree with that statement.  The success of the Monster revolves around accidentally coming up with a Bike that looked, sounded and felt tougher that it was.  It would make you feel bad-ass for being able to twist its ear all the way round, and keep it there and for being able to take it later and lower into a corner than you would ever have dreamt otherwise.  And you could look at it for hours, grinning, from any angle, any day.

To do any of that to/on/with the Streetfighter you need to be bad-ass.  And those guys buy it and fulfills its potential.

All the semantics of what you guise are debating aside, that's a very good way to sum up the Monster. It's the bike that rekindled and took my love for bikes to a higher level after having my ass handed to me by a Jap I4 several years ago.

Why would I or anyone else buy a new monster if they were the same as an old Monster?  The retro bikes didn't sell.  You can still buy an air cooled 796.  A sport touring version of the new Monster would be perfect.

Agree, I'm buiding one out of my Diavel, still have the ST3, just hope the Diavel works as well, although I have used my M900 on trips just as far as the ST3, I take the ST3 if there is any super slab involved such as getting to INDY GP, twistys thorugh VA/WV/SE Ohio then Super Slab. - Gene

Afterthought; they should probably have called it a Roadster then, rather than Scrambler.  Not so sure about the 'fun' part.  That sounds like something to be associated with a Scooter instead ;).

http://www.pistonheads.com/news/default.asp?storyId=29307 (http://www.pistonheads.com/news/default.asp?storyId=29307)
http://www.visordown.com/road-tests-first-rides/first-ride-bmw-r-ninet-review/24384.html (http://www.visordown.com/road-tests-first-rides/first-ride-bmw-r-ninet-review/24384.html)
http://www.bmwmotorcycles.com/us/en/index.html?content=http://www.bmwmotorcycles.com/us/en/bike/urban/rninet/rninet_overview.html (http://www.bmwmotorcycles.com/us/en/index.html?content=http://www.bmwmotorcycles.com/us/en/bike/urban/rninet/rninet_overview.html)

www.youtube.com/watch?v=CVRtWb8AcXg#t=71 (http://)

Isn't this the same old sh#t? 

A new bike comes out.
Some like it.
Some hate it.
Immediately it's compared to some older bike which someone likes.
Thread divulges into pics of old bikes.
Old timers come out of the wood-work claiming "They don't make 'em like they used to!"
New timers chime in claiming that new is better & defend it.
Thread is left to languish until it's finally put onto page #2 where no one has to see it.

Lather.
Rinse.
Repeat.
Every time a new bike comes out...

and someone posts something about said bike?

;D

I like turtles

That looks like a radiator rather than an oil cooler...

Great Video btw.  I can only imagine what is going through the factory guys mind when he realizes the guy behind him has a Go Pro.... 

Oh shit, gotta go! 

what I know, it's a 796 moyor

I seriously doubt that video was an accident. Ducati are masters at the tease photos, and 3 days before the EICMA show is a little suspicious.

Looked like a radiator to me as well...although could have been fake.

+1

An Italian biker coming to a complete stop, looking both ways.... SUSPICIOUS  [coffee]

 [laugh]

[laugh] [laugh] [laugh]

Soooo fake. :)

Here it is!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J7M9ibk_oyo (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J7M9ibk_oyo)

http://scramblerducati.com/en/bike/classic (http://scramblerducati.com/en/bike/classic)

"Steel gas tank"

ahem

I think i like it.

The black box to hide all the electrics and such is a little strange, but not terrible.

I like it. Super clean. They did a great job of hiding wires(those black panels must have helped a lot). Now if only they could stop shoving the hipster motif down our throats.

(http://scramblerducati.com/immagini/desktop/classic/classic-dett-1_img.jpg)

Better than expected... I'm kinda digging the urban enduro one.  I could see myself getting one as a city bike vs a hyper.

(http://i1.wp.com/www.asphaltandrubber.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/09/2015-Ducati-Scrambler-Urban-Enduro-09.jpg)

And now the questions start... will the m1100 engine drop in?  The heads? haha

Man, all the spy shots made it look way uglier.

I'm kinda digging the Full Throttle (except the name).

I'm curious if the headlight would swap onto my bike  [evil]

I have to admit that I really like them, although I didn't think I would...especially the Urban Enduro model. Nice clean and simple design from the folks at Ducati (finally).  [thumbsup]

Damn them, great looking, simple bikes.  It should be a home run, more performance than the current triumph line, I want...  [thumbsup]

I think the era of plastic tanks is gone @ Ducati.

I join the Me Likey folks  [thumbsup]
Looked much worse in the spyware pictures.

Meh, to much like one of the home made cafe bikes I see in midtown Sacramento.  Can only be ridden wearing skinny jeans.   [cheeky]

And with a bent iPhone 6 plus in your pocket...  ;D

Says the guy with a new generation Monster.  [popcorn]

 ;D ;D ;D

Pity it won't fit a new Monster..., not that I have an issue..., touch wood. Same capacity but that frame is different.

Looks good. Should sell like hot cakes. Don't like the too solid looking electrics box, but you gotta hide that stuff somewhere. A good effort I reckon.

Back in '96, Ducati sent me a pit jacket and welcome letter when I bought my new 1995 M900. Maybe they'll now send buyers a pair of skinny jeans and thick rimmed glasses! ;D

Lol.  Can't wear skinny jeans.....  At least they only made the 2013 Evo for one year and it was different from the previous years.  Kinda makes it sorta special being a one year model and the last of the big air cooled engines.

Still would not mind a first year Monster.  It was the one that made me want one.

We should probably wear flares. [laugh]

Thanking God those burned down with my house.  Some fashions should never come back  ;D

Another yard of material per leg. [laugh]

It really gets the old look with V-twin power and light weight. That will crap on a Bonneville. Now Ducati need to do this to the Monster.

I can send you a pair? I also have fat paisley ties, crimplene shirts and short sleeve safari suits if you lost those too?

I would grab the Safari suit but only if it comes with the integrated belt.  ;D

 [laugh]

Polyester shirts.

 [laugh]

I forgot about those.......sadly no integrated belt!  ;)

PRO
800 engine
clean layout
steel tank


CON
Odd looking seat
Banana swingarm
Small capacity tank, Hypermotard syndrome
41mm forks
Oddball front tire 110/80 ZR18...are there any good tires in that size?
Pegs are really far forward

But it's spokified... just send the hub to Woody's and make it 19 or 21 inch.

Trust YOU to spot the weaknesses.  ;)

It's got a more upright seating position, so the seat and pegs may work fine with those bars.

41mm could be budget KYB for sure. 5.9" is in the right direction. KYB shock could be good..., or rubish.  8)

In a quick search could only find a Distanzia front in that size but no matching rear. They don't do wider than 160. :o  Who wants to become an orphan... Rear wire rim is only 3" too?  ???

True, seat/peg/bars position may work.
Have to sit on one to see.

I suspect the suspension will be weak sauce, so that they can meet an attractive price point.
Speaking of which..... any scurrilous rumors of MSRP?

Tires are an issue, for sure.
With 899 and SF848 you're stuck.
AFAIK, you can mount any 180/60 Pirelli Diablo Rosso II you want.  :-\

I'm pretty sure that 3" rear rim is a typo, in the pictures it is clearly wider than the front, which is listed as a 3".

$8,495 for the Icon and $9,995 for the others. Yes, they give the cast rear wheels at 5.5", but 3" for the spoked rears. Maybe a typo indeed.

Ducati has info on the website
http://scramblerducati.com/ (http://scramblerducati.com/)
Close the movie and scroll down.

According to AMS Ducati:

Though I wouldn't buy it I do like it.  More designer than performance, but it does capture the essence of a scrambler.  Yep, cheap suspension, maybe good enough.  If not, lots of work for Speeddog ;D  That single disk might be better than the tiny floaters on the SR 800.

Where did that ~$1,500 go?

Spoked wheels or Termi cans?
Brown faux-distressed naugahyde seat cover?

I've not found any fundamental difference in spec.

And there was nary a beard in sight in that video.

As I  said, designer., in other words, and maybe to subsidize the price of the others.  Anyway, IMHO, better than the Bonnie Scrambler.

I like it.

I want one, with knobbies.

I wonder.... if a 19" front rim was laced up.... if there'd be sufficient clearance on full compression....   [evil]

The issues Speeddog pointed out not-with-standing, it's the first brand-new Ducati since 2008 that I've actually liked. 

Hell, I'll say it:take 2" rise out of the handlebars, put a proper black seat on it, a 17" front rim and change the tank logo to read 'Monster' and I think it'd be about perfect!  [thumbsup]

$1500 price difference between models?  WTF?

They have a winner here. Should sell out the first year or two. I can't see Ducati producing an air cooled engine much longer but this is a great starting point.

Still on the fence, mostly because I'm not currently living in a city where this bike would be a good idea.

I'm in the camp of the unexpectedly impressed.  I don't particularly love the tank side plate and the swingarm is hideous, but the rest of the issues I figure can be modded out.

I'll wait two years for the first batch to enter the secondary market.

Good work, Ducati!  [thumbsup]

I like it...

except I'd rather see wiring than those hideous plastic covers.

Side covers are likely dual purpose -- noise control for the intakes.

The part forward of the frame tubes?

I doubt it.

Shroud for oil cooler per M796? In the frame triangle looks like air box? FWIW, my 796 breathes through vents at the front of the tank covers. No idea where the intakes are hidden on these. http://gallery.leica-users.org/d/383062-1/M+796_10S_LM-Pantah_C01S+_1200x800_.jpg (http://gallery.leica-users.org/d/383062-1/M+796_10S_LM-Pantah_C01S+_1200x800_.jpg)

I guess that's my point.

Motorcycles have all these items, and I'd rather see the components than a cheesy plastic shroud.

Much much easier to work on the vertical belt too, compared to my 1100 EVO!  [coffee]

Part of the design of the 696 etc air box was to direct the intake sound forward rather than from the side.

This affects the db reading in the EPA drive by sound test.

The early Monsters had intake 'snorkels' to achieve the same effect. Nice thing was you couldn't see them.

I understand the reasoning, but they still look like ass. Some time should have been spent on coming up with an alternative.

There's always $hit ya take off your bike. Problem solved.

Then you sell it to people in Australia 20 years later.  [laugh]

[laugh] [laugh] [laugh] [laugh] [laugh] [laugh]

everybody funny

(http://img.directindustry.com/images_di/photo-g/phillips-screwdrivers-103241-6231751.jpg)


I was honestly considering a dualsport or a used bonnie for my next bike.  I mostly commute and do a day-ride once a month.  I need a light, (relatively) mechanically simple bike that I can lane-share with to/from work.  I don't need much HP.  I don't need much torque. 

The bonnie is a fat pig.  the scrambler... is a definite contender.


aaaand - it is hilarious comparing the reactions here to the reactions on non-ducati forums where it is generally universally hated (mostly because it says 'ducati' on the side).

Same setup on the 900SS.  The methods for measuring the vehicle noise have changed since the 90s. 

No reason you can't remove it.. :-)  Or is that the only sacrosanct part of the bike?

 [laugh] [laugh]

and charge them lots in shipping?

As long as it isn't also used to mount some of the items it's masking then sure...

rip it off.

Let me see garage is full, bank account is thin, my KP is almost to 100K miles and needs to be given back seat duty/rest and a New Cross Country needs to be purchased for multi-day distance touring. Then Indian comes out with a gotta have Scout, BMW the R Nine T, Ducati the Scrambler(full throttle version please). Need a bigger garage and an increase in my consultant rates. What a great time to be alive, lots of choices it's the 70s again, we even have a retro SR400! - Gene

Yeah, I like it!  way better than I thought it would be...

this was my first thought, I reckon I could make it fit.


This was my second thought. clip-ons, rearsets and a nice curvy single seat!   [thumbsup]


You looking at me!  :)
Maybe I can buy that headlight!   [beer]

(http://mybikemagazine.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/10/2015-Ducati-Scrambler-Full-Throttle.jpg)


This one is not bad.

Has my name all over it, will set nicely next to the yellow with white racing stripes V92SC, but not the Orange XR1200. - Gene

I only ask for the wire spoked wheels . . .

we had 3 customemrs yesterday and deposit $5K for one  . . . each one a different variant  . . . we wont be getting tjem until JANUARY!!!!!!

How's the riding position compared to a Monster?

+1. I cant wait to see this in person. Who wants a M796 in mint condition?  8)

Where do you live? Not for MY mission anyway. -12 BHP, -8 ft.lbs, budget suspension... If I want a leisurely cruise, I'll ride my T-100.  ;D

Yes please!!

 [Dolph] [Dolph]

Budget suspension is the bummer in my book. I think the power is plenty for the street...so long as 2-up isn't your plan.

I almost called and put a deposit down on one. I was very close...then I remembered that I'd rather get a Griso. I still like the looks of the Scramblers though. I'm going to test ride a Griso again this weekend...and if it isn't as cool as I remember, then I'll likely put a deposit down on a Scrambler (likely the Full Throttle).

im in the carolinas. looks like you have a 796 as well  [thumbsup]

I want your life, TripleJ.

I can relate---been toying with selling the Buell to make room for something else.

Gonna try and demo the Scout next week if I can.

personally I like the Classic with the Full Throttle steering bar . . .

The bar looks the same to me

OK, finally went back and read this whole thread. I have to admit that I figured we already owned our one and only Ducati. The Monster is the only Ducati that ever spoke to me other than the Sport Classics.

And I'm not generally a fan of the Scrambler genre.

But I find myself looking at the Icon and Full Throttle wondering if we should consider a second Ducati in the fleet.

I'm surprising myself even thinking about it.

Hmmm... Not bad.

Another one here pleasantly surprised with the finished product.

I will likely have to wait till spring to get a test ride.

Posted from Intermot on the RAT forum. Some more details visible.

http://repo.duckdns.org/pub/bike-stuff/intermot-2014/20141004_125745.jpg (http://repo.duckdns.org/pub/bike-stuff/intermot-2014/20141004_125745.jpg)


http://repo.duckdns.org/pub/bike-stuff/intermot-2014/20141004_125903.jpg (http://repo.duckdns.org/pub/bike-stuff/intermot-2014/20141004_125903.jpg)

FTFY

Did that on purpose so that you could expand them to full file size for more detail. ;)

Oh... if I want to do that, I right-click and open the image in a new tab ;)

yesssss my preciooousss

Figured. ;D Which one you likee?  ;)   

WTF that seat on the urban enduro is *HUGE*. :o

Split off all the OT discussion on canisters.

All of them!

Ducati announced that you will be able to see the scrambler in person at AIMExpo. I'll be down in Daytona all next week for Bike Octoberfest and riding with my sister, normally I would not go over to Orlando but I might just make an exception. - Gene

I'll be in Orlando that weekend, so I might swing by and take a look.

Exactly my thoughts.

About the same size as the Sport Classic GT.

I'll just put this right here.

http://tinyurl.com/mbmroa6 (http://tinyurl.com/mbmroa6)

Someone is up to stir some ....  ;D

Me that I was having a lot of fun with Indians making the new low $$ HDs ...  [evil]

I've heard  from a few doors down that a "high vintage style exhaust system is being design/developed". .. 

FWIW, my 2009 T-100 was assembled in Thailand and touch wood, has been more reliable than many Hinckley-assembled bikes. The important stuff was made in England anyway; engine, paintwork, etc.. The rest sourced in the Far East, as it was for the Hinckley bikes anyway. It really depends on the QC and the Brit managers were all over my bike. More blue chalk than you can possibly imagine!  8) That QC seems to have slipped a bit in the last couple of years with the dicey political situation these days...

Proof will be in the pudding.  ;)

I don't give a .........t
I'm loving this bike the more I look at it.

The fact that non union workers are assembling it bugs me, but otherwise I don't feel that the QC is going to suffer *too much* or that it's any "less of a Ducati".

do remember, Scrambler is a brand not a model . .  Scrambler models are Icon, Classic, Urban and Throttle . . .

That makes no sense.

Scrambler is the model and the other names are just 'trim' levels...like a 'Dark'.

not this time . . . ALL dealers must 're model' the showroom to be a "Scrambler" store

exit: Even the apparel and accessories will be Scrambler by Ducati branded

So it isn't a Ducati then.

Is it a Buell? ;D

It is a "by Ducati" . . .

Might as well be an Audi.

Does this remodel required to be a Scrambler store include signage?

signage as is signs?  yes internally and externally if size allows, we're only required to remodel a small corner and put a sign Scrambler sign outside . . . that 's all I know at this time . . . no new tools or anything . . .

 It is like the Japanese brand that made a new "brand" out of their v twin thing.....

Scrambler is no more of a brand than Monster is. Both are models, with sub-models.
Ditto for Panigale, MTS, Diavel, ...

It's not a Honda, it's an Acura.

It's not a Toyota, it's a Lexus.

It's not a Yamaha, it's a Star.

It's not a Chevrolet, it's a Cadillac.

It's not a Ford, it's a Lincoln.

It's not a Harley, it's a LiveWire.

IMHO it's a silly bunch of posts. It's a motorcycle designed by Ducati, with supplier parts such as brakes, suspension, siwtch gera, levers etc... It's a Ducati and it's as desirable as all the Ducati's I currently own and especially the full throttle version. Garage is full, bank account is low, but Full Throttle, an Indian Scout, and a Victory Magnum would make nice additions. - Gene

"...I can see a knee-jerk reaction of handbags at dawn, followed by more calculated comments about how one’s own motorcycle is still a real Ducati because it was assembled in Bologna"


you had me at 'handbags at dawn.'  hilarious.

I don't think the Harley/LiveWire comparison is fair.  It's not like Papa VAG bought Brammo and forced a Ducati design drone to make it sexy.

And the rest of the comparisons are going the wrong direction.  This is like BMW calling a notional sub-1-series... The 2002 by BMW: 5 models available in your choice of nostalgia trim, AC and power steering are optional extras.

There is probably a market for that, but the gimmick is a bit excessive for something that would probably sell just as well (or possibly better) without the expense for the marketing department to out-clever themselves.

Dealers are forced to market the thing The 2002^TM in some sort of corporate wonk's belief that coherence of brand is more important than letting boutique dealers cater to their customers in a local fashion...

I'm glad someone noted the 'handbags at dawn'!

I guess that's what I don't get.

These companies all are major players. It makes sense for those companies to create a brand to garner a share of the market they don't have.

Why would a boutique brand, with a relatively small market share, create another boutique brand with an even smaller market share? What market share are they expecting to gain?

MOSTLY, I think it is people in marketing departments and advertising agencies trying to justify their own existence.

I guess there's a time and a place for such reinventing of brand names to try and reach better market penetration.

I remember reading years ago that IN JAPAN Toyota = Oldsmobile in the eyes of the youth. I.E. No one wanted to drive their father's Oldsmobile.

So Toyota carried that concept over to the US and Scion was born.

Personally I think it is stupid. At least with Lexus vs. Toyota even if you were dumb enough not to realize they are the same company you were buying the luxury features (and treatment) of the Lexus dealer. But with Scion what are you buying, a gaudy showroom that's supposed to appeal to kids?

It's like Chevy and Geo back when Chevy wanted to sell imports but was afraid of diluting their own brand (and hindsight being 20/20 they had bigger things to worry about).

Yeah Yamaha did it with their "Cruisers" and came up with "Star" which I take as the dumbest, most disingenuous marketing action I've seen by an otherwise accomplished brand in the motorcycle industry. I mean shyte, Yamaha has things to be proud of, WHY try to distance themselves from it.  [roll]

Anyway, my GUESS, is that this is some sort of pandering to either the Italian sense of brand with regards to the fact that these are being assembled in Asia and/or an attempt to put some distance between the main brand of Ducati and this sub-brand JUST IN CASE that Asian assembly thing blows up in their face/is rejected long term.

Like with the Triumph classic line, it allows Ducati's customers time to get used to the concept before the Monster or some other model production is moved there. Which, lets be honest, it's always a danger in this world economy that some country with lower cost of living and more to gain/less to lose is going to supply cheaper labor and an old-world country might decide to farm out manufacturing or assembly there.

Marketing departments are not known to be in the same realm as everyone else.

I would like this bike even if it was a Harley, provided it was the same bike... :-)

wait...


Um.

Frames for Ducatis are actually made in India at the Verlicchi plant in Pune.

I believe they are "finished" in Italy, i.e. painted, but they are cut and weld in Hindustan.

Monsters have been made in Thailand since that plant opened, so far for the Eastern Market AFAIK.

HELLLLLOOOOO........ Cars and bikes have contained content from everywhere for at least two decades. It's called, "The World Market". In Thailand that assembly and local content saves a HUGE amount of duty in the Far East. Would be DUMB not to do it.

The Thai factory was not built "for" Scrambler. Obviously the economics work and Ducati has the spare capacity. QC on the line is all that matters. The line in Bologna must be building at capacity and new construction THERE would cost a bundle.

Do YOU want to pay for it?  ;D

BTW, got a news flash the other day that my last brand, Land Rover, is considering a plant in the South (USA) just as Benz and BMW and just about everybody else has. Solihull has physical space constraints, so only full chassis vehicles are built there. Unit body stuff moved to a Halewood plant near Liverpool where there was a ton of excess capacity a decade ago. J.D. Power IQS (QC) was excellent BTW. ALL the designs and engineering come from the huge Gaydon R&D facility, as they have for the past 25 years. No doubt the U.S. South was the only way to grow capacity economically although some little stuff may subsequently be assembled in China, for THAT market.

If you want to know about branding, hire Charlie Hughes.  ;)

As ducpainter said, it's a model with different trims. Signs are to attract attention.

My '96 Ducati has Japanese parts. It has German parts too. They're most likely better than what Ducati could make. It doesn't bother me, but that isn't my point.

I don't get the re-branding.

I could understand if they were building scooters again, or a product removed from motorcycles...like bottled water. :P

I don't see the point with the re-issue of a model they made in the past.

My question is what happens with some of Ducati's dealers that carry multiple brands? If they don't want to 're-model' and devote space to this do they not get the Scrambler? If I was a dealer and they made me spend more money to sell a brand I've already made a sizable investment in I wouldn't be happy. If that's the case this could end up back firing on them.

Maybe Carlos knows.

I'd like to know, as the closest dealer is too small to have participated in the most recent Monster Challenge... It's a really small store, and already has Moto Guzzi, Aprilia (bikes and scooters), MV Augusta, Piaggio, Vespa and maybe one other Italian in addition to Ducati.  They only have one or two of some of the brands.

We're dedicating about 9mts2-96sqft to the "Scrambler" brand . . . that's about the size of the room I am in right now in my house . . . and some new signs that say Scrambler . . .one clothes rack and that's it . . . factory is supporting us with a nice % of the cost since we're a "very small dealer"
 

What would happen if you said no to the dedicated space?

nothing as far as I know . . .

Keep in mind that franchise agreements and possibly even branding may be different in different countries.

The Scrambler is a cute little bike.  IMO it strays away from part of what made Ducs somewhat exclusive, price.  Perhaps a good marketing move to gt people to become brand loyal.  Personally I have never been a brand loyal kind of guy and like many different flavors of bikes. 

I look at the Scrambler and all I can think is Buell Blast. 

What will happen with Ducati over the next few years could be quite interesting.  They will most likely expand their market with bikes like the Scrambler just as they did with the Jetta, and the Boxster.

 

Your entitled to your opinion but that comment is way off the mark IMHO. - Gene

 I think the Scrambler is priced about where the entry-level 2v Monsters were priced... [roll]

I read his comment as a op on the price-point, not the styling.  The Blast was the cheapest bike in the HD/Buell range.

I'm not sure that is off the mark totally, but I doubt the Scrambler will be priced lower than the cheapest Monster.  The Monster will likely remain the "entry price" point for Ducati, but that will still be a higher point than other marques.

Well, he can clarify for us if he wants - but "Cute little bike" and "I look at the Scrambler and all I can think is Buell Blast" certainly seems more disparaging of the product than the price point.

As if to say it doesn't offer enough performance or quality to be considered an "exclusive" Ducati.

Personally I think the Buell Blast was built to be a trainer first and foremost. The ONLY similarity I see is that it was the entry level price point, but that doesn't make the Blast a Virago 250 or Honda Rebel anymore than that similarity makes the Scrambler a Blast.

Prices, at ~$8.5K - $9K, are not even down in the Bolt range. - Gene

That's about "entry level" pricing for Harley, Tripumph and Guzzi right now:

HD 883L $8250 in black / $8800 two-tone
HD 883N $8400 in flat  /  $9200 candy

Guzzi V7: Stone $8500 / Special $9300 / Racer $10,500

Triumph Bonnie: Base $8100 / T100 Black $9000 / Scrambler $9100 / T100 $9400 / Thruxton $9500

I believe that the entry-level Monsters will be phased out by the 821 and the Scrambler firmly set as the cheapest option.

I am with Duc Carlos.  Not disparaging the Scrambler other than to say it is not my cup of tea.  I do think that it will become the entry level bike for Ducati's price range.  To a new rider it will certainly be (or appear to be) easier to ride than a Monster. 

From a marketing standpoint it makes perfect sense.  From where I sit though?  Wish they built it in Italy.....

I have to admit thought that for the consumer I see a huge advantage with it being made in Taiwan.  No one working in a factory in Taiwan gets three weeks a month off.  So getting parts for it may be a bit quicker.  [thumbsup]   

The only problem I see with the comparison is the Blast was a complete POS in every regard. The Scrambler will likely be a nice bike, albeit one with cheap suspension to meet the price point.

I was not comparing reliability.  I think Buells are crap (owned one) and the Blast was the worst of them all.  There will be no comparison between the two when it comes to ride-ability and reliability.  I was simply referring to market segment.   [beer]

Where do you get Taiwan?  ??? Ducati has had a plant in Thailand for two years. The "hard parts" are STILL made in Bologna.

Where you been, Sky?  [roll]

Wow.  I didn't see that one coming.  A model 'underneath' the Monster?  I could certainly see it now...  It will be *afterall* the only air-cooled option in the entire line-up.  Air-cooled = cheaper to produce.  Thanks for the eye opener duccarlos. [thumbsup]

I'm torn between keeping my Triumph Speed3 1050 or moving it along to p/u a Scrambler in the spring.  Guess it'll be a test ride for me come April/May...

Is it confirmed then that there is NO 2015 M696? Most 2015's do not appear to have been announced as of yet..., so...???

I thought it had been confirmed that both the M696 and M796 were going away?

Confirmed as in an announcement from Ducati?

You crazy? Ducati doesn't really announce when stuff goes away. It just kinda happens. We won't really know until we see the list next year.

Doh meant Thailand.....  Lots going on lately.

M696 and M796 are gone . . . 796 now has 75hp instead of the 88hp it previously had . . .

I am.

So it's all idle internet speculation?

Original text of email sent to me when I asked about the M821;  in Spanish and translation:

nueva Monster 821 ... de un reemplazo de los modelos antinguos 696 y 796; de hecho, terminaremos la producciòn de estos dos modelos en julio, ...

new Monster 821 ... a replacement for the 696 and 796 older models ; in fact, finish the production of these two models in July, ...

From who?

factory contact I write with almost everyday . .

I think the 796 was replaced with the 821 and the M696 remains with 80HP http://www.ducatiusa.com/bikes/monster/696/index.do#/bikes/monster/monster_696/engine/power___torque_curves/index.do?&_suid=1414022358617010523407067403895 (http://www.ducatiusa.com/bikes/monster/696/index.do#/bikes/monster/monster_696/engine/power___torque_curves/index.do?&_suid=1414022358617010523407067403895) - Gene

Gene, why would you think that based on a website that hasn't necessarily been updated for 2015 model year when a dealer (I assume Last Line is a dealer from his posts in this thread)?

That said, my little bro was researching this recently and was convinced the 696 & 796 were going away enough that he bought his first ever NEW motorcycle (a leftover 796) a month ago. For the record he has about 30 bikes in the fleet, many late model, but all others were used.

No matter, even if the 696 hung on another year, the writing is obviously on the wall and it'll be gone soon enough.

you are correct. . . 

twolanefun, sadly both MX96 are gone . . . only leftovers

No doubt.

But (FWIW) I think you hit the nail on the head there DC.

So are you saying you don't believe Last is a dealer?

Or did you just miss that post?

I KNOW Carlos works for a Duc dealer  [thumbsup]

I have no idea what here is and is not fact.   But I do agree with duccarlos' assessment.

I agree with all the Carlos'  ;D

Not that it matters  ;)

I mean I'm not telling anyone to short stock on the answer, but it seems reasonable to expect that confirmation of the internet rumor in this case.

Like I said, my little bro was convinced enough he wanted to grab one of the "last" 796's before they were gone.

But it's not going to screw up his world if by chance Ducati suddenly decided to build a few more and VIN them 2015's.

And being a small Italian manufacturer FACT one day can certainly become myth the next when they change their minds.

"Oooo, never a minda, we gonna make a few more, we founda some more parts in da back room".

Kev M, no more M696 and M796 . . . M821 replaces both of those bikes, Scrambler is a Ducati, but, with a different marketing scheme . . . and it is and will be for the foreseeable future, the least expensive Ducati available . . .

Fixed it for ya!






Just to bug Gene  ;D

 [laugh] [laugh]

Blah, blah, none of this chatter dissuades me from wanting a Scrambler, if I had the garage space I would add a Full Throttle version and park it between the Indian Scout I also want to add and my XR1200. Or maybe I'd put it in line with my other Ducs between the M900 and Mr. Devil. As for Buell the new HD 750 Street appears to be a pretty nice bike, and EBR bikes seem to be doing just fine. Think I'll also sepnd some time monitoring this site http://www.scramblerforum.com (http://www.scramblerforum.com) - Gene

Nor should it.  Besides I think you will look great in a pair of skinny jeans and some horn rimmed glasses  ;D

For the record, I wasn't doubting you.  [thumbsup]

We think alike in a couple of ways.  [thumbsup]

The Scout was fun, I could own one too (and I might).

(https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-ciifExA9VKA/VDhjbcx_IbI/AAAAAAAABFs/8V3aKzj3lKY/w992-h744-no/IMG_5748.jpeg)

Part of me regrets not buying a new Denim White XR1200X, but it was either THAT or my new Guzzi V7 and I really needed to replace the 2 Guzzis I'd sold.

I think that's why I picked up the tube-frame Buell as, to me, it's sorta the grandpappy of the XR.

Still might look for an XR in the future... if I don't get distracted by ... oOOOOH look A SQUIREL...

If I could still get into skinny jeans, which was possible until I turned ~40 - awhile ago, I would gladly wear the glasses. - Gene

You know I do. I'm looking for a lawyer to send Ducati a letter about where to send my royalty checks. :lol3

My 900 is too tightly suspended for life in this city. I'm thinking one of these with a marshmallow soft suspenders might be just the ticket for life in the city. Now that my F650 is no more, I need a city bike.

I had settled on a Triumph Tiger until I saw this.

LOL!  [laugh]

Back of the line sonny....

:lol3 :thumb

Please peruse this parts pic, and say what it is that's most surprising:

http://www.cycleworld.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/12/Scramblerparts.jpg (http://www.cycleworld.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/12/Scramblerparts.jpg)

(http://www.cycleworld.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/12/Scramblerparts.jpg)

I give up.  :) The monobloc?  8)

No, but in one way you're close to what I saw.

It doesn't use ride by wire

Those wheels...

I give up, what is it?

The cast wheels, should use wire spoke ones.  [coffee]

ZeroBloc (as in none) rear brake?

No fork reflectors?

...and it uses 'wireless' technology.

The cable actuated clutch?

Full trellis frame....mmm

It's either the fact that they call it 'Scrambler' instead of 'Monster', or the rise of those handlebars....   :-X

No brake calipers, no mufflers?

Full trellis frame...I thought Ducati was done with those!

There are some things missing, like the rear brake caliper, muffler, demand sensor (if RBW).

also airbox, wiring harness and any other sensors...

Wait a minute... is that a single throttle body?

Ding Ding Ding, we have a winner!

I'm kinda shocked at a single TB, but perhaps they had to do it to make room for an airbox.

FTFY...  [evil]

 [laugh]

Was already aware of that, so no shock (no pun) but perhaps that's where the 8 BHP went...

Holy crap...  A **single** throttle body.  Perhaps a twin-bore throttle body pair would be a quick upgrade? 

Ugh...  The way prices are cut these days (and/or emissions (either tail-pipe or noise))...

Type   L-Twin, Desmodromic distribution, 2 valves per cylinder, air cooled
Displacement   803 cc
Bore x stroke   88 x 66 mm
Compression ratio   11:1
Power   55 kW (75 hp) @ 8,250 rpm
Torque   68 Nm (50 lb-ft) @ 5,750 rpm
Fuel injection   Electronic fuel injection, 50 mm throttle body
Exhaust   Exhaust system with single stainless steel muffler, aluminium silencer cover, catalytic converter and 2 lambda probes
Emissions   Euro 3

 I dunno, that should add a bunch of lower end tractability to the motor. Look at the enduro versions of the old Triumphs, TR6 and T100SC, killer off road bikes with one carb. No syncing, only one cylinder sucks at a time, should make an awesome city/dirt road bike......

The math here  (http://www.hipermath.com/engines/throttle_body_size) seems to indicate a single 37mm TB should be sufficient.

A quick S.W.A.G. makes it look like the 800 shouldn't pull more than ~120 cfm... which even the lowest flow 50mm TB I could find beats handily.

So, the math works.  I don't know if the reality works, though the claimed HP and torque numbers seem to support it.

I think that assigns attributes to those motors that they already had, regardless of the number of carbs fitted.....

I'm pretty sure they did one carb as it was cheaper and didn't hurt performance too much.

And I think the 'cheaper and didn't hurt performance too much' was exactly the reason the scrambler got one TB.

FWIW, since the change to EFI many mid-to-large output marine outboards which were once fed by multiple carburetors are now fed by single throttle bodies.

Also, though lower hp in the first place, the new Guzzi V7 makes more hp and torque than the previous dual throttle body version.

And the newer Guzzi California 1400 is also fed by a single throttle body.

I suspect for most non-racing applications, where the OEM is not trying to squeeze every last hp out of the motor, that most modern motors can do just fine with a single throttle body.

It does greatly reduce cost, as well as design and maintenance.

All of the motors that you've used as examples are quite low specific output (HP/liter).
The 4200cc V-6 Yamaha VMax SHO outboard makes a whopping 250HP, or 60 HP/liter.
The Guzzi V7 is 50HP, 744cc, 67 HP/liter.
And the California 1400 is 96 HP, 1380cc, so 70 HP/liter.

And thus, can work perfectly fine with a single throttle body.

My wheezy '98 M750 made 58 HP at the rear wheel on a dyno run I witnessed.
So it stomped out 78 HP/liter.
And the 750's are nothing to shout about, performance wise.

i can't see it being an issue.  sounds like a pretty good idea to me.  the v7 has the ecu in the throttle body too, for a very contained system.  possibly the same system.

still has a nice long inlet manifold.  and given the firing order, it's not like they're both sucking at the same time.

I did add the caveat that if you're not trying to wring out every last hp for racing.

It's not just one outboard BTW, it's pretty much every single one, 2- or 4-stroke, inline or v, 3-6 cylinder, EFI or DFI, 40-300 hp, they've all abandoned multiple carbs or throttle bodies.

You'll also note the same is true for the automotive market for decades (I'm sure there is an exception).

I personally don't think it is hp/liter per se, because if that was it someone would take the expense for the advantage.

Perhaps balance is something of an issue or there is more of an advantage on twins.

Or it is just that cycle motors are being designed to work that much harder per liter.

Regardless, if we're not talking a supersport, does it really matter?

One of the advantages of multiple throttles pre FI was even fuel distribution.  FI reduces the need since fuel is injected at the throttle body.  One throttle body?  Loose some WOT full load power, gain some fuel economy due to throttle position (the more open the throttle at a given RPM and load, remember the BMW eta engines?)  and a big bunch of money saved.

My bet is that they will try the single throttle body for a fun, tractable bike. If they get too many complaints that the bike has no power then they will add twin throttles later. Remember that this is the new, more user friendly Ducati that we are looking at now. No more rip 'n snort up and down the model line. They might even be going the way of Honda.  [puke]

Trust me, the single throttle body isn't limiting the power on this bike.

I'm waiting for Ducati to debut desmo activated direct injection.

(https://farm8.staticflickr.com/7547/16139272490_ee710b1eab_c.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/qAaZqN)

Well, after seeing it in person, sitting on it and considering the possibilities, I've decided I'm going to eventually sell / trade in my M696 for the Scrambler.  This decision is mostly based on a visceral connection with the bike, not a technical / logical / straightforward one. 

While I am considering the fact that this bike, in effect, becomes Ducati's entry level bike (no more M696  :'(), my decision is based on my preference for aesthetics.  I was trying to turn my bike into a modern cafe iteration of the Monster but, as many of you know, that's hard work.  The scrambler is almost there for me in terms of the look I'm going for.  Swap out the tall handle bars for clip ons, change the exhaust, blinkers, seat, and maybe some rearsets and she'd be exactly where I want to be with the monster.

Pending a disastrous test ride (not likely given all the rave reviews this thing is getting), I'll eventually find myself a statistic of the Ducati marketing campaign.

In other news, I went to the IMS this past weekend with my wife and daughter.  They both loved it because they could a) sit on the motorcycles (as opposed to the custom shows I've taken them to before where they can't) and b) we took some cute pictures of us.

(https://farm8.staticflickr.com/7470/16139272390_ac6191367b_c.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/qAaZp5)

(https://farm9.staticflickr.com/8683/16326833205_a25e6f1b33_c.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/qSKhGe)

Your daughter is a natural---she is already instinctively leaning into the turn!  [thumbsup]

Get that girl a bike, stat!

I would have loved to go, but I would ruined my brain

I kinda know what you're after there, even if it is a bit tongue in cheek. The build cost & the maintenance cost would be horrific though.   [cheeky]

Hahaha..thanks.  She will eventually have a bike but since she's only 1, her mom wants me to wait. Go figure

What's the consensus on just how much of the enduro aspect is purely for show, versus how much it could actually be converted into a fire road capable bike? I don't have any illusions of desert sledding in one (unlike as suggested by the promotional literature), but how would one fare with, say, Continental TKC80s fitted?

I doubt anyone knows the answer to that for sure, but there are a lot of exposed parts on that bike that might take a beating. It has the look but I'm not sure I'd want to risk taking it on any fire roads, it doesn't even have a decent skid plate and there is no perimeter frame the engine is a stressed member. Duc Parts are usually expensive I might add. - Gene

None of those reasons ever stopped these dudes.  8)

(https://farm8.staticflickr.com/7294/16325066700_2ba3aa2519_z.jpg)

Those are flat track/tt machines, no where near the same. The scrambler has the look but even back in the day a Honda 350 scrambler was good for and occasional dirt/gravel roads but nothing more serious than that. Heck even the turn signals on an old 350 are better protected than what is on the Scrambler. Of course you can take it down a dirt/gravel road but I've also done that on my M900 and ST3 when required, all I'm saying is it ain't designed for that stuff. - Gene

Point missed. Carry on.  ;)

The Ducati catalogue will probably have a bunch of accessories if people have dirt road riding in mind, or at least dirt pretentions.  Even the HM catalogue has a bash plate, hand guards, upswept 2 into 1 pipe, etc. There's a lot of money to made in pretending to go dirt riding. ;)

Look like Bonnie TT 650s  [drool]

That's what they look to be.  I have a '66 T120C "TT Special" and it's still about the most fun bike I own.  The Scrambler's got me interested because there's some similarities, but more power and (I hope) better reliability.   The Triumph is a bit lighter, but not by a whole lot.  Those TT racers back in the day had skill and balls, not sure in what order.

I'd like to find a way to pare about 50 lbs off of the Scrambler, not sure it can be done without paying $100 per lost pound or so.  The stock mufflers have to weigh 30 pounds.  Not sure where any other serious weight savings might be found.  I really like the looks of the wire spoke wheels, but unfortunately I think they're heavier than the cast versions.

What the Scrambler needs is a kick start option.  

I don't much like the looks of the high pipe Termignoni's for the Scrambler.  Kind of awkward looking visual flow to them.  The old Meriden Triumphs got it right.  Not my bike pictured below, I stole it from the interweb.

(http://i191.photobucket.com/albums/z312/Langanobob/Triumph%20Scrambler_zpsjeem6lkr.jpg) (http://s191.photobucket.com/user/Langanobob/media/Triumph%20Scrambler_zpsjeem6lkr.jpg.html)

If I had the talent of someone like Duck Stew, I'd get my hands on a Ducati Scrambler and start designing and selling parts for it and make a fortune.  

Sadly the TT bikes they use to today at Springfield for example are the same  type of bikes they use in Pro Singles, converted MX bikes. With the Lloyds Brothers Ducati team it would be cool to see them campaign a Ducati scrambler, not likely to happen though. - Gene

I read somewhere, maybe in one of the paper magazines, that some of the Scramblers will also be assembled in Brazil.   Both Brazil and Thailand, having some of the world's most beautiful women, should produce good bikes too.   I'd of course like to have all Ducati's made in Italy, but from a practical perspective, the Thai bikes might even be assembled better.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bOsLG-blzVQ (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bOsLG-blzVQ)

About the weight difference between the wire wheel and cast wheels, all the spec sheets I've seen show all four models weighing the same and I know that isn't correct.  I got an answer from one of the European members on the Scrambler Forum that the wire wheeled models run roughly 12 lbs heavier than the bikes with cast wheels.  I like the wire wheels but 12 lbs, especially at the wheels, is a relatively big penalty.

Bob

Well, I believe that like India, Brazil has prohibitively high import taxes so if they are assembling them there it may only be for the Brazil market (Harley does that as well).

The new Scrambler is no doubt a good bike and at $10,000 is a pretty good price for a new Ducati.  There are some compromises to meet that price and just making the number up but I think many new owners will spend an additional $2K or so on exhaust, suspension and other improvements.  Can't help but wonder what could be done to an older M900 to turn it into a custom version of a Scrambler.  I think you would end up with a much better Scrambler at a lot less than $10K or so.  Assuming your own time is the proverbial labor of love and donated to the cause.

Bob

I've read a couple of places (sorry, my limited Google forays just now haven't turned up the articles I remember) that the achilles heel of "scrambled" Monsters is the engine mounting within the trellis frame; apparently, the design just isn't intended for that kind of vertical stress from jumping & pounding the bike over rough terrain, and you quickly crack cases & other engine mounting points.

I have no idea if the Scrambler is better suited to this kind of riding, but I have to hope it is!

YMMV

Good point and I think the Scramble engine mount system is about the same as Monsters.  I think there are solutions for it but again, it results in the need for more aftermarket parts and expense.

no difference in engine mounting.

Thats why I decided it might not be a good idea to take the monster on too many jumps.

 I think that it is a perfect fire road bike, not a motocrosser!



edit: dam smell chucker!

(http://i191.photobucket.com/albums/z312/Langanobob/Ducati%20Scrambler_zpsuxexw3e3.jpg)

Borrowed this picture from "jehu" on the advrider board.  Just about the perfect bike. 

 [evil]  [evil]

(https://scontent-iad.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-xap1/v/t1.0-9/p600x600/10406362_10153093177993057_2214009109137184964_n.jpg?oh=32d656d019ae307795c5f61b4d2de229&oe=557F7FD1)

^^ Nice  [thumbsup]

For those of you in Northern and Central California, the Sacramento Ducati dealer is going to have at least one Scrambler there on 6 March.  Not sure if it will be available for test rides.  I haven't seen one except in pictures so I'm going to try and make it over the hill from Nevada to at least take a first hand look.

Bob

There were 3 yellow Scramblers at Ducati Newport Beach today. 
No words.  [thumbsdown]

Just very disappointed. 

Iv'e been watching. I think its a nostalgia thing. I always saw "the Scrambler" as a Pre Dirt bike. Street bikes that were converted for Moto Cross, Hare Scrambles, or Enduro Use, before manufacturers began making true purpose built dirt/race bikes.

In other words a half baked idea. Now these blasts from the past/hipster bikes are going to fill in Ducati's entry level line up the way the monster did, and it  probably makes sense as a product line. They look like easy to ride no fuss all around machines that might even be fun.

I remember owning a DT 100 as one of my first bikes which, when I look back on it is very similar to these things. It was slightly smaller and with an engine displacement of only 100cc it was certainly down on power in comparison but it also had many things in common. The layout was much the same and it could be ridden on the street as well as off road, riding position was the same and it was simple. I learned a lot on that bike but I probably wouldnt buy another one. Not for myself anyway.

I havent been super excited about these but I see where they are going with it. The Ducati video from their web site pretty well sums it up. This is meant to be a first or second bike for the most part, aimed at a newer rider.

Basic Motorcycling...
(http://i.kinja-img.com/gawker-media/image/upload/s--yCip9VpK--/c_fit,fl_progressive,q_80,w_636/i5mvha3k4njee3o0zzwh.jpg)

(http://i.kinja-img.com/gawker-media/image/upload/s--fvncXp_Z--/c_fit,fl_progressive,q_80,w_636/jcxhygwsyh2nifrb6oto.jpg)

Come on do tell us. What stood out, good and bad. [popcorn]

I just saw a Buell Blast.  I guess I have to wait to see the drab green model or some serious mods.

(http://i199.photobucket.com/albums/aa14/akido10/010429a3-1628-4dfc-83a0-1eb36982b101_zpsp6xlhiov.jpg)

(http://i199.photobucket.com/albums/aa14/akido10/image.jpg1_zpsuvrnqwqg.jpg)

^^And no..that's not me.   >:(

It's terrible.  [thumbsdown]

 [laugh] [laugh]

I get the Buell Blast comment. Difference is this will work for Ducati.

I'm sure they'll sell well. It's a fun image with the young'uns. I guess someone has to court new riders and not just old guys. Guys like me are the past (unless I get a MTS1200 ;D or M1200). It sure looks like its taking over from the air cooled Monster as has been mentioned and the Monster turned into a cruiser.

I completely don't get the Buell blast comment.

The Blast had the cheapest components and a half a Sportster motor.

The Scrambler has what would be considered by most manufacturers to be quality components (not top tier, but quality parts in the brakes and suspension area) and great 796 motor which, even detuned from the Monster for torque still represents higher output from an 800cc motor than many bikes in this segment (like the Bonnie Scrambler).

That's about as removed from the Blast in concept and execution as you can get on an "entry level bike" from a premium brand like Ducati.

I to do not get the Buell comment. I also don't get the comment about the M1200 being turned into a Cruiser. As someone who has some Cruiser creds, not to mention owning a Diavel, I can assure you there is nothing about a M1200 that says cruiser not even it's longish wheelbase. - Gene

BTW the 1M Ducati produced is a M1200S!

Looked good on the website but cheap in person. 
Just have to mod the hell out if it but I suppose that's the idea. 

On first impression the Scrambler says Blast. Put them side by side and Ducatisti will breathe a sigh of relief. I can see why that comment was made. The execution of course is different and that is why it will succeed whereas the Blast failed. Should sell like hot cakes. Ducati should be applauded for chasing new riders, all hipster jokes aside. I like the Scrambler and as a kid would have bought one and had fun.

The M1200  definately has strong cruiser styling, good thing it wont handle like most cruisers. Admit it, shades of BMW's previous attempt, but of course much better.
I have owned three Harleys and I'm glad Ducati have such good performance to go with the style.

Diavel is a true power cruiser with sports bike ambitions. I read a comparo between it and the V-Max. Wow. It has a styling that exudes power. For my taste it has much better unique  style. I like its brave styling. A power cruiser Ducati's way.

Koko,

This IS NOT meant as an insult. But I get the impression you look at these things from a very narrow perspective of a sportbike owner.

The Scrambler is to the Blast as much as it is to the Rebel 250, they just happen to be "entry" level to the brand. But having spent some time on a friend's Blast, I think the comparison ends there (maybe I'll change my mind when I finally ride a Scrambler, but I highly doubt it).

Likewise, the M1200 Monster is styled about as much like a "cruiser" as a Griso, meaning there's ALMOST nothing in common. You mention BMWs previous attempt? At a CRUISER? YOU mean the R1200C? You think there's something remotely similar in styling between an R1200C and M1200?

(http://www.totalmotorcycle.com/photos/2000models/2000-BMW-R1200Ca.jpg)

The Diavel? I MIGHT reluctantly call a "power cruiser" as that's sorta a unique niche that is hard to define. But even the Diavel doesn't have the ergos of a "cruiser" - ala V-Rod (which is one of the few bikes I guess I'd call a "power cruiser").

But you have to understand as a guy who generally prefers classic standard motorcycles, I don't even consider a Harley FLH to be a cruiser UNLESS it's lowered and futzed with. A Road King is generally a TOURING bike to me, a Sportster (without forward controls) is a classic/naked standard, for something to be called a cruiser to me the function has to be stripped, it's gotta have forward controls, a good bit of rake, and maybe lousy bars too, like apes. Basically, before I call something a "Cruiser" it's gotta SUCK...

I have no idea what you think a Cruiser is but my Monster or the M1200S have nothing in common with the cruisers in my garage. Not even the L-twin motor.

As for the Comparo with Vmax, I think the Diavel has had more comparison by the motorcycle press than any other bike, they still cannot figure out what it is. I know what it is - It is an Old Man's Superbike. Maybe a Gentleman's Superbike would be a good tag for it

- Gene

Not sure I agree with you, the ergos on the Diavel are much better than the V-Rod, I've done multiple 450+ miles days on the Diavel, the V-rod sucks after about 250 for unless you have ape arms, riding all day in that C position is just too painful. And of course you better performance on the Diavel, brakes, suspension, power. - Gene

HA ha, then you DO AGREE with me, you just misread me.

I'm saying the ergos of a "Cruiser" SUCK by definition. That a V-rod is way more "cruiserish" due to the peg/control position than the Diavel. That's why I'm reluctant still to use the term "cruiser" with the Diavel, though I'm willing...

Why people care so much about whether or not another person on the webz agrees with their taste in aesthetics is beyond me. Every single time a Harley or one of the contemporary Ducs gets criticized it's the same people. All of these opinions are exactly that, and about as subjective as possible. The Buell > Scrambler and M1200 > Cruiser comparisons can be considered both valid and not.

(http://s2.quickmeme.com/img/e8/e8673d594995d9de3f619216e6d65b25b18dc91e518dca2506084d0bf06ad34f.jpg)

Fer fuqs sake I'm pouring 5 digits into one of the least rare/valuable Ducati's in existence...thank Lucifer I give 2 shits about anyone's taste in bikes or investment practicality beyond my own or I'd be screwed.

I only offer up input on things I know first hand when I detect a lack of knowledge. Everyone is entitled to their opinion, I just try and make it an informed one. - Gene

We're just bullshitting, chatting, debating, discussing... there's no angst here.

Couldn't I equally throw your question back at ya?

Why do you care if we care? We're just talking here...

 ;D That's true, I do have that perspective. To confess, the first time I saw an M1200 up close, I remembered the R1200C. It just hit me, I'm sure owners of M1200s will want to too.. Good thing I'm hiding out way down south. [laugh]
I get it, it's all in the definitions for sure. Maybe our categories down here are a little different.

LOL, then fair enough... I guess I can take solace in the fact that I'm not the only crazy guy around here. [thumbsup]  [laugh]

Entry level bike for an entry level rider?

(https://farm9.staticflickr.com/8613/15630084903_06f64973b8_c.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/pPbgGt)IMG_1410 (https://flic.kr/p/pPbgGt) by fragile_this_side_up_retro_club (https://www.flickr.com/people/80073081@N00/), on Flickr

Although, she couldn't wait to get on the Busa...

(https://farm9.staticflickr.com/8598/16223122476_b45735bcc0_c.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/qHzK7d)IMG_02191 (https://flic.kr/p/qHzK7d) by fragile_this_side_up_retro_club (https://www.flickr.com/people/80073081@N00/), on Flickr

I reckon so. Look like a great first big bike.
You sir are cunning, using your baby as a chick magnet. [laugh]

Haha. They asked me for a photo with her.
She was the hit of the show. Sat on more motorcycles than my dad brother and I combined. The guy in the Ducati booth kept following her with the camera. Sat on every Duc there. 8)

Very cool and very cute. [thumbsup]


My first "big bike" was a 1973 Triumph Bonneville 750. It had character, was beautiful in a cobby way, was unintimidating and friendly. It was alot of fun. The Scrambler might just endear itself to a whole generation of riders.

Cute kid! I've got 2 daughters myself (and now a little boy). The girls each have learned to play the cute factor. Good thing for them, but I feel I've betrayed my own gender lol.

Couple of totally random observations.

1. Great pic, but the Corsets in the background kinda don't go with the cute kid.

2. As much as I enjoy some of the shots of scantily clad models draped over bikes (like from EICMA show in Milan each year), maybe it's the dad in me that really appreciates Ducati's class/taste in how the two cute Ducati girls are dressed at this show. Maybe it's just the presence of your daughter (and thinking about my own) that's got me feeling that way, cause again, I'm ok with a certain amount of objectification lol. Or maybe I'm finally just getting old (or mature)....  then again NAAAAAAAAHHH probably not.

Those women are wearing long pants & Shirts. They look pretty. They like to look pretty cause they're women. They have lots of practice. It's not their first day trying it out.
Don't worry about it.

Geez...way to overthink it!  [roll]

Right, I was complimenting them...AND DUCATI for showing some taste/restraint when sometimes manufacturers like to put models at their shows that just look like strippers ... not that I have anything against strippers...

This is a bike show on the East Coast in February, no?

Other than the show in Seattle, this is probably the most clothing I've seen on Ducati models.

Yessir. I'm ok with what they are wearing. Classy and sexy yet subdued. Tasteful for Ducati, I agree. Don't have any other pics of any other "booth babes". Just a lot more of my girl sitting on every single moto she could.

(https://farm9.staticflickr.com/8678/16717031455_e9ab9542a9_z.jpg)

Back on topic, anyone know when deliveries are going to begin?

Yeah,  I don't care how cold it is or how much snow's on the ground.  We all need to hop on our bikes and go for a ride!  This wintertime non-riding leads to overthinking and worse  ;D

Over on the Guzzi board (Wildguzzi) someone who is interested in the Scrambler just reported that the Portland, OR Ducati dealer claims to have already taken 40 pre-orders for Scramblers!

I'd sure like to know how that ranks against sales of other Ducati models in a typical year at that dealer.

Wh already received our first 4 Scramblers . . . All ICON . . . Delivery to customers will be during presentation event next week . . .you can check my fb page for some pics

That'd be MotoCorsa (http://motocorsa.com/). They frequently get the best multi-line dealer award from DNA.

They're a good shop to deal with. [thumbsup]

Even the Medford Oregon dealer cant keep them in stock

Hi from Daytona, escaped Northern Virginia O' Dark thirty yesterday morning, unloaded the bikes down here at 4PM, it was 86 degress. I washed up the XR quickly, then my Sister(on her XL1200C) and I went for a ride, got bugs all over my new face shield, coming back to her house the Mooon was out and the temps were perfect.

I wish I had room for a Scrambler, Full Throttle, it would look good next to the XR, although I'm not sure about the paint on the seat.

- Gene

I stopped by the Sacramento, CA dealer on Friday to check out the Scrambler.  I just saw a Buell Blast.  I guess I have to wait to see the drab green model or some serious mods.

Seriously, speaking only of the looks of the bike since there were no test rides, it is half baked.   The new Multistrada and Panigale on display next to it both had  visual snap and looked good, even though I don’t care for what I consider to be BMW styling influence on the Multi.  There was something real about both the other bikes (in addition to the price, well over double the Scrambler price) that was just not there in the Scrambler which looked contrived in comparison.

 Thinking about it, it’s not that it wasn’t there, there was just too much on the Scrambler that shouldn’t be there, in the form of little plastic covers and a sofa looking seat.

(http://i191.photobucket.com/albums/z312/Langanobob/Seat_zpsh8hzrzzi.jpg) (http://s191.photobucket.com/user/Langanobob/media/Seat_zpsh8hzrzzi.jpg.html)


The smog stuff had a big impact on the bike design.  The muffler is really just an artificial housing to make the integrated muffler/catalytic converter look like a muffler.  The Ducati rep told me that the reason for the banana swing arm is to make room for the cat.

(http://i191.photobucket.com/albums/z312/Langanobob/Cat_zps6yniat9l.jpg) (http://s191.photobucket.com/user/Langanobob/media/Cat_zps6yniat9l.jpg.html)

The oil cooler and voltage regulator are mounted in an awkward looking plastic shroud and the canister is just hanging there on the side of the bike.    I have a real issue with all the smog stuff on motorcycles these days.   If you took all the mandated smog equipment off of all the motorcycles in the USA there wouldn’t be any measurable statistically valid increase in pollution. 

(http://i191.photobucket.com/albums/z312/Langanobob/Cooler_zpsmeqrrqoa.jpg) (http://s191.photobucket.com/user/Langanobob/media/Cooler_zpsmeqrrqoa.jpg.html)

One of the reasons I liked the original Monster was the clean design.  With all the required smog equipment maybe the day of the good looking unfaired bike is past.

 Out of curiosity I checked and the Scrambler’s rake, trail and wheelbase  are about the same as the Monster.

The engine, which on a Ducati is the bike’s signature, is kind of hidden and indistinct behind dull black  plastic pieces and is painted mostly dull black with the exception of the barrels and blends in with the dull black frame.   I would’ve left the engine cases aluminum to stand out against the frame.

My apologies for being negative but I just don't think this bike is for me.  Of course that all could change if I rode one and the bike could be fixed by adding a lot of time and money to it.

Bob

Thank you for your journalistic integrity and exposing the Scrambler to the harsh light of reality.  ;)
It is terrible.

Lang, no apologies necessary for opinions at all.

Thing is, I either don't care about, or actually even like everything you mentioned as a negative.

I mean, EVAP stuff is what it is, Cat-Cons are a fact of life. I'm not going to get pissed at Ducati for not being able to hide them well on a very naked bike.

So to me that all doesn't equal half-baked, it equals fully cooked, just a recipe that you don't like.

I see an air-cooled, stripped down model that in many ways is what the Monster WAS.

Hell it even comes with an oil cooler, unlike our 696.

I guess you guys will take the evap can off , throw some plastic into the parts box and change the pipe. The effect will be like tidying up your Monster once you got it home.
I think the plastic that hides the reg and horn probably looks worse than the reg and horn. We'll soon find out one way or another because someone will try it.
As Kev said, its a naked bike.
Imagine the weight loss once the cat and cannister are off. :D

Ditching the EVAPS on my 796 was simple and the oil cooler shroud from the European bikes was ~ $20. Maybe the Termis ditch the CAT?  ???

That EVAP canister is designed to disappear easily.  I doubt many bikes will be delivered with it in place.  Many will also loose the factory exhaust.  In their day, scramblers were standards factory modified to be a little more dirt capable.

The Scrambler is a platform for endless possibilities. A Platform. Once all the high end aftermarket companies like Rizoma  ect .. start producing bling the bike will be transformed from its plasticky appearance to something a bit more appealing. I can't wait.

Dare I say this is a formula for success that was shown in many an "entry level" product like the original Monster, Neo-Bonnie, the Sportster.

Perhaps it even speaks to the relative success that Guzzi is seeing with the current V7 line.

Well . . . it seems people can't wait for new shipments . . . We had to sell our "demo" model and from what I gathered from sales guy, it was basically "an auction" . . .

More plastic than a sportbike!!  Looks like many of the ugly bits can be removed/replaced.  I'm sure the high-brow, short inseam crowd will love it!   [wine]

Well hey, at least it's got a METAL gas tank...

...and if that's STILL too much plastic for you, there's always Harley.  [evil]

absolutely agree.  I don't feel uncomfortable taking my wife/kids into the ducati area at a show.  can't say that for all brands/shows.

here's my Pops and one of this friends-for-40-years at Long Beach:
(http://twoslow.com/wp-content/uploads/wppa/1152.jpg)

I think they were enjoying the attention, but when she found out 2/3 of us were Duc owners her attention moved on.

http://www.motorcycle-usa.com/8/21986/Motorcycle-Article/2015-Scrambler-Motorcycle-Shootout.aspx (http://www.motorcycle-usa.com/8/21986/Motorcycle-Article/2015-Scrambler-Motorcycle-Shootout.aspx) - Gene

Nothing really surprising there, except that they chose to include a V7 Special which is about as much a Scrambler as a stock Sportster.

But it does again remind me about why I like the Scrambler.

Another Scrambler Video:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=ejcHLoGmU-g (https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=ejcHLoGmU-g)

http://youtu.be/mag08JPSTdY (http://youtu.be/mag08JPSTdY)

My buddy in Italy picked up an FT this week.  He's loving it but I'm waiting to see the mods that he has in store for it.  Maybe then I'll see the potential.  All this Scrambler talk though has me spying the 2015 Triumph.  Loving the looks of that bike!


(http://i199.photobucket.com/albums/aa14/akido10/image.jpg1_zpskp4siajq.jpg)

Here's a well written Scrambler Ride Report

http://advrider.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1052425 (http://advrider.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1052425)