Hey ALL!
READER'S DIGEST VERSION - Does anyone know if a dealer can reset the service light IF IT HAS NOT GONE OFF YET? I.E. if you perform a service early, can they restart the counter for the next time it will illuminate, OR if you reach the point of the next scheduled service mileage in only a few hundred more miles will the wrench icon still come back on?
FULL VERSION:
Hope all are well. It seems that it has taken us much longer than we originally planned on to get to the first Desmo service on our 2011 696. (I'll make excuses for her, in the 4 years since we bought this bike to replace her Harley Jenn has had 2 babies, completed a 3-year Fellowship in Neonatology which meant 80 hour weeks in the NICU and 7 or so 24 hour calls per month, sold a house, bought a house, moved, finally started her post residency/fellowship career etc.) So, yeah, it took her 4 years to get to 6800 miles...
We were actually hoping to get to the full 7500 miles by the end of next week (when we have a staycation of bike trips planned), but a few weeks ago we returned from a nice outing and put the bikes away, then a day or two later walked out to the garage to find the Duc had a flat rear tire!
Seems on that last outing she'd hit a sea shell or rock that was big enough/jagged enough to actually puncture the original rear (which was getting close to the wear bars anyway).
I figured I could just pull the rear wheel and have a new tire mounted, but after thinking about it, I figured we were so close to that 7500 Desmo service, AND I was starting to get nervous about the 4 year old timing belts and thought it was smarter to make an appointment and just have the whole thing done.
(One of the deals we made when we bought this bike was "you're going to be an attending in a few years, YOU PAY FOR SERVICE, I'M NOT DOING BELTS AND VALVES UNLESS I HAVE TO"). 8)
So we made an appointment with Coopersburg, Eurosports - a mere 80 miles and one state (and toll bridge) away.
They're going to do the valve check, belts, all the neglected fluids (fork, clutch, brake) etc. and make sure her baby is ready for her, and of course, put on a new rear tire.
We trailered it over (damn that was a long boring drive both ways).
But she'll ride it home, after riding a rare 2-up on one of my bikes to get there.
Question is WHICH BIKE.
I need to get my Guzzi V7 over to them so they can hook up the Guzzi factory scan tool and update the fuel map. No biggie, but just not something I normally have the 5-6 hours (back road, round trip, and a little shop time) to do. So part of me would like to the take the V7. Of course, that's a lot of weight to carry for the V7, so I'd have to totally mess with my rear suspension preload and dampening settings to do it.
OR
I could take the Harley Sportster - it's EXTREMELY comfortable, has a quick and easy-to-adjust rear suspension (just basic Progressive shocks with a ramped pre-load adjuster, no other adjustments) and is actually geared better for the highway if I wanted to get there quick and just take backroads home.
So it comes down to whether or not the dealer is going to be able to pre-reset the Duc's maintenance light.
If they CAN restart the counter and the icon won't come on until another 7500 miles have gone by, then I'll take the Guzzi and have the map updated.
HOWEVER, if no matter what they do the icon is going to come back on when we hit 7500 miles (a mere 700 miles from now, which might be at the end of next week), then I'll just take the Sporty and we can ride the Duc and Goose back up there together in a week or two to get both done.
So that was a long winded way to ask what they can do, and what bike we should take to pick it up.
RIDE SAFE ALL!
Kev
PS - <flamesuit on> RE: for being to lazy to do belts and valves on my own. :-[ [laugh]
No.
I just noticed I ended my answer with a period. I can get long winded sometimes, sorry.
Quote from: jduke on June 08, 2015, 02:19:07 PMI just noticed I ended my answer with a period. I can get long winded sometimes, sorry.
;D
It's OK, at least you didn't candy coat it.
One short follow up question?
No to what? :o:-[:o
I'm assuming you're saying they can't reset the clock on a maintenance light that hasn't illuminated yet?
The light has to illuminate before it can be reset/extinguished with the factory tool, otherwise I'd have had my last service done before spring. Will have to wait in line now, but the bike isn't going to break with a few extra miles. ;)
That Service light is in the ECU and ONLY trips every 7,500 miles...
Nuts! That's what I was afraid of, thanks. Guess I'll take the Sporty.
Follow up question.... Does it come on exactly at 7500 or does it come on a few hundred early to warn you service is due soon? I'm guessing it comes on at 7500 exactly?
Not that I doubted any answers I got here, but Massimo at Eurosports confirmed.
Although, unlike FBF, he said just to stop by when the light comes on and they'd shut it off in a matter of minutes.
[thumbsup]
Bike should be done by tomorrow...hopefully the weather cooperates and we'll pick it up Monday, CRAP closed Mondays, hopefully TUESDAY then!
7,500 on the money IIRC or very, very close to it. Sophisticated enough..., but not quite a European luxury car. ;)
I have to admit that I'm really a Harley and, of the last decade or so, a Guzzi guy. That said, I have to say that our experience with this Duc the past 4 years has been nothing short of fantastic.
I've been impressed by the fit, feel, finish, and rock solid dependability.
Fueling has been neigh on perfect, the chassis (suspension/brakes/handling) have been all we've ever wanted from it.
I've ridden bigger, faster, flashier, more plush, etc. bikes, but this experience would make me buy any other Ducati in which I was interested without hesitation.
Though then I'd also have to admit, I'm now certain I'm just not a "sport bike" guy and the only current model I'd likely consider is the Scrambler (which I really like in street clothes, maybe s Yellow Icon). But that's just a flavor thing.
Mine is still on and I stopped looking at it. My local dealership said it would cost a half an hour of service $45
I asked them why and the response was that it takes at least 20-30 minutes to reset. So I asked them how much an oil change costs if I brought in the oil and filter.
....35..
And that is why I don't trust service shops.
I'd rather just buy a VDSTS equivalent and do it myself. At least then i can do other stuff too..
Well, if you've got a Weber-Marelli ECM, you don't need a VDST, I THINK you can use Guzzidiag for free.
But I've got a Siemens ECM and I don't think the VDST or GuzziDiag work on it.
Your local shop is incompetent.
Quote from: EEL on June 10, 2015, 05:00:40 PM
Mine is still on and I stopped looking at it. My local dealership said it would cost a half an hour of service $45
I asked them why and the response was that it takes at least 20-30 minutes to reset. So I asked them how much an oil change costs if I brought in the oil and filter.
....35..
And that is why I don't trust service shops.
I'd rather just buy a VDSTS equivalent and do it myself. At least then i can do other stuff too..
Quote from: EEL on June 10, 2015, 05:00:40 PM
Mine is still on and I stopped looking at it. My local dealership said it would cost a half an hour of service $45
I asked them why and the response was that it takes at least 20-30 minutes to reset. So I asked them how much an oil change costs if I brought in the oil and filter.
....35..
And that is why I don't trust service shops.
I'd rather just buy a VDSTS equivalent and do it myself. At least then i can do other stuff too..
lift seat, connect DDS2.0 turn ign on, click on service reset, turn ign off, turn ign on, done . . . about 5 mins
Quote from: SpikeC on June 11, 2015, 02:53:23 PM
Your local shop is incompetent.
Its a ducati dealer.. what do you expect..
Maybe people on this forum can pool some resources and set up regional areas to fix up at least some of the minor repairs.
Some of the guys on this forum have completely rebuilt bikes and probably know more than most of the mechanics.
Quote from: EEL on June 11, 2015, 07:41:08 PM
Its a ducati dealer.. what do you expect..
I am a dealer...
Quote from: Dochunt on June 11, 2015, 08:03:35 PM
Maybe people on this forum can pool some resources and set up regional areas to fix up at least some of the minor repairs.
Some of the guys on this forum have completely rebuilt bikes and probably know more than most of the mechanics.
8)
Like anything else..., there are dealers..., and then there are DEALERS. ;) Mine's pretty good, just a 140 mile haul unfortunately. Bikes are seasonal which doesn't help matters from a business standpoint. Of course, no dealer is perfect and personal relationships and accurate communication count for a lot. So far, so good, fingers crossed. ;) The "Master" certifications are not worthless though.
There are also a few really good Ducati independents/specialists around and a few are on the DMF when you need help. None close to you AFAIK.
Sorry to read that Ferracci had slipped. Eraldo used to make engine jewelry. Maybe you'll have better luck farther west.
Maybe it's just because I live in New Jersey.
I have had such bad experiences dealing with all the local Porsche Dealers and their repair crew.
Over the last few years I have started using independent shops.
I will try out FBF, my bike is fairly new and I hope it all will work out.
I have no doubt that Eraldo is highly skilled, perhaps even a genius with a bike.
But it's simple, he obviously doesn't personally work on customer's bikes and there's some question as to the skills and attention to detail of at least some who do work for him.
I shouldn't be surprised. I (like DocH) chose to give his dealership a chance (to try and develop a relationship for continued business) DESPITE the warnings of local riders.
Maybe if I didn't do most of my own service and handed everything over to his shop I'd have a better experience.
I mean fully half of my gripes are because I pay more attention to details than the average customer and/or because he seems to not like customers who work in their own stuff.
But then again, is there really an excuse for such basic screw ups as not adjusting the clutch on a new bike so it is impossible to get into neutral? Or not being able to sell a customer the recommended oil or even the right size crush washers for the oil drain plug? Or refusing to even look at a warranty complaint on a bike UNLESS you first pay for a full service?
I've got a friend who has spent more than 6 figures on new bikes from them in the last decade (multiple Ducatis, multiple Guzzis, and an MV Augusta).
When his brand new (less than 100 miles on odo) Guzzi Cali 1400 was stranded by a demand sensor for the RBW system Eraldo personally came by his home to pick up the bike. (After my little bro and I retrieved his trailer to get it back to his house the day it was stranded).
But my buddy has always brought those bikes back to FBF for service and as trade-ins or consignment sales.
I saw that relationship and figured I'd at least be treated fairly and not blown off when I wanted to pay for something simple.
I was wrong.
I have had bad experiences with BMW, MB, Porsche and Kawasaki repair guys.
I don't mind paying what they ask but sometimes they just don't pay attention to the details like Kev said.
I miss the old days when you had a Master mechanic who was even more anal about the details then you were and educated you in the process.
Some of the crochity old guys in NYC would yell at you for ignoring things that you didn't even know existed and they could spot from a mile away.
Times are a changing.
Dochunt, this is a toughie. Suggest you introduce yourself to Eraldo and explain that you bought your bike "brand used", are now hooked, and want to use him to service this and other bikes you buy and possibly some of those from him..., but that you are willing to trust the shop..., but are ANAL. ;) Then hope for the best I guess. Better yet, invite him to lunch at his favorite Italian restaurant. (Hint: He likes his reds. ;D) Chemistry is a tricky thing. Could be totally wrong, but Kev may have some bad chemistry. It happens.
With my own dealer who's very fond of Eraldo, I know we are on the same page and he alone works on mine. He's a no-nonesense engineer who shoots straight, but with absolutely no "bedside manner". This throws a lot of people off. He's better off avoiding some of the casual clientele as his parts manager has a true gift for customer interaction and is also impressively knowledgeable. I'd have loved to have had him working for me. Sales and the service advisor are so-so.
Eraldo is a bit old now to be wrenching. Be sure to tell the advisor or mechanic precisely what you want and what you expect and hope for the best.
As for your cars and bikes, you are in a dead zone for toy and luxury cars in that part of NJ. Without writing a book, I feel your pain. My dealership was in a Madison Ave. / Wall St. bedroom with fussy customers and high demand. You are right though, this is not the '70's - 80's when most Porsche buyers were enthusiats, supply was very tight and smaller dealers had a loyal following and personal relationships with their clients. These days dealerships are forced to move iron and are machines. This would be a LONG discussion... :'( Glad I could retire when I did.
If you are a PCA member, ask the guys who are the best independents. Ideallly you want a Porsche Master Tech with years of dealer experience who has invested in all the factory tools and diagnostics. Dealers mostly don't enjoy working on older cars. Someone with 20+ years of experience knows all the old tricks. It'll be HIS shop, so he cares. I had three Porsche techs with 90+ years of experience but all have doubtless retired. Those people are super-difficult to replace and it takes forever and a TON of $$$ to train their replacements.
Did you try Freehold for your Benz? Not many "old school" dealers left. Both the two I used in NJ were bought out by groups who could care less. Same down here, so I drive 70 miles to an independent with three Benz Master Techs, all the gear and a spotless shop. He's half rebuilt my old commuter wagon which has to last me the duration. Not cheap but not unreasonable and as my son helped him build his new shop, I can borrow his wife's car to run errands locally. ;D
Thanks Crum for understanding my pain.
I got rid of the Benz as my wife got tried of having to pick me up from the shop, same goes for her BMW 528.
It got to the point that we only lease cars and return them soon as the lease is up.
I am hanging on to the Boxster only for sentimental reasons. ( plus I promised my son he can have it next year if he makes it to a good college).
There used to be two old timers European cars specialists close by (one in Somerset and the other in Kingston) but they are retired now and one shop closed and the other became a Harley shop.
I think I have found one in Flemington but I have not had the chance to go there yet.
I will give FBF a try because a friend of mine with a Diavel raves about them.
Well..., definitely drop the name of that Diavel customer while you're at it! ;D
Surprised you didn't get a loaner when you were in for service. The factories used to subsidize a few of those and it's an effective tool to hook customers on the newer stuff! 8)
In NJ leasing is a really good deal for everybody as there's usually a factory subsidy in them and in NJ you only pay sales tax on the payment. When scheduled maintenance was also included, the clients knew virtually ALL the expense of "ownership". and business clients particularly could expense for the vehicle. My sales were 85% leased and customers were happy campers.
Down here leases are double-taxed and the driver still has to pay personal property tax on a vehicle they don't own!!! [roll] This results in a very healthy, overvalued used car market and a super-tough new car market. I'd have starved... :'(
Again, ask the PCA boys whom they like and use.
Quote from: Curmudgeon on June 12, 2015, 08:52:26 AM
Dochunt, this is a toughie. Suggest you introduce yourself to Eraldo and explain that you bought your bike "brand used", are now hooked, and want to use him to service this and other bikes you buy and possibly some of those from him..., but that you are willing to trust the shop..., but are ANAL. ;) Then hope for the best I guess. Better yet, invite him to lunch at his favorite Italian restaurant. (Hint: He likes his reds. ;D) Chemistry is a tricky thing. Could be totally wrong, but Kev may have some bad chemistry. It happens.
Not for nothing, but the first time I met Eraldo I was with my buddy (the one whose house Eraldo came to last year to personally pick up his brand new/broken Guzzi). Eraldo gave me a big smile and pat on the back the next couple of times I saw him.
That said, I almost never dealt with him... you deal with Jim for Sales, Hoak for service... never learned the counter people names.
It wasn't until the LAST incident (refusing the hook up the V7 to a scan tool even if I paid for shop time to check for a warranty update to the map UNLESS I PAID FOR A FULL 5k mile service etc.) that I gave up on him, and even remotely expressed my displeasure to him directly and even then it was more of a case of disbelief than anything.
Every other time it was one of his staff that screwed up and whom I dealt with. And most of the times I didn't complain to him or his staff (unless I mentioned something to Jim or Hoak) but in most cases it wasn't worth it.
So I'm thinking chemistry personality probably doesn't have anything to do with it.
Thanks guys for the input.
Bikes are so different then cars.
Maybe its me but the emotional attachment I have even with a plain bike like the Kawi Versys is much stronger then my cars.
It may also be that if something craps out while going 75 in a car, you pull over and call AAA, on a bike passers-by will cal 911. [laugh]
I will have to learn the mechanical stuff even on work done at the Dealers.
As far as the Porsche goes, as soon as they started making SUVs and sedans and all the suburban moms started driving them the whole culture was lost. [bang] Even the PCA members become less enthused, I gave up my membership years ago.
Thank god for motorcycles and particularly Ducati. [thumbsup].
PS. I should have bought a air-cooled 911 in 96, they are worth so much more now.
Good conversation about FBF at the Guzzi breakfast meet yesterday.
It reinforced my impressions that I'm not alone.
Someone mentioned that Eraldo may have stepped back about 5 years ago and mostly handed over the business to his kid (not sure if that's true, and I've never met him). But that might explain some changes in what seem to be a poorly run business from a customer service side of things.
I still think that the old man has something against people who work on their own bikes. I suspect that it's not without some justification in that I bet he's had to deal with hundreds of things people have screwed up with over the years.
But that doesn't justify the overall attitude.
Oh well, no biggie.