Are 05/06 wet clutch plates compatible with a 02/03?
02/03 Barnett part# 306.25.10001
9 friction and 8 steel plates
Kevlar
05/06 Barnett part# 306.25.20005
11 friction and 10 steel plates
Carbon Fiber
But
Are the plates the same?
Could I get the 05/06 plate kit and just load my basket until it's full and call it good?
Quote from: Mother on August 09, 2015, 11:30:17 PM
Are 05/06 wet clutch plates compatible with a 02/03?
No, '05-'06 are APTC 'slipper' clutches, different diameter from '02-'03, which are the standard wet clutch plates as fitted to '04 and earlier small-case engines.
Barnette wet clutches suck. I'll never use another set. They drag like mad.
My two cents have been contributed to this topic. We now return you to your regularly scheduled program, already in progress.
Quote from: Cloner on August 10, 2015, 09:43:14 AM
Barnette wet clutches suck. I'll never use another set. They drag like mad.
My two cents have been contributed to this topic. We now return you to your regularly scheduled program, already in progress.
My experience as well, based on a single sample, at least for Ducati.
Oddly, I used several sets of Barnett plates for a Yamaha many moons ago, and they were stellar.
Unfortunately I had to eat that one Ducati set.
I knew the Barnett dry clutches for Ducs sucked, and had good experiences with their wet plates in the past.
Good to know.
To what degree do they suck?
This isn't a race bike, it isn't even a go fast on group rides bike.
I just want the damn thing to go forward
I think they're saying you won't be happy with the drag.
Having never experienced that problem before
Seems like that should be a correctable issue and not necessarily a result of the plates themselves
maybe wear of another component?
I'm speculating of course but an engaged clutch shouldn't drag unless something is preventing the engagement
I think since two fairly well respected Ducati techs are telling you that in their experience they drag and when they installed an OEM stack the problem disappeared...
I'd tend to listen.
I agree, if everything is in tolerance it should disengage and not drag. I don't know if the bikes in question had aftermarket slave cylinders that shortened the pushrod travel causing the drag, or if the manufacturing tolerances on the Barnett plates is such that they just don't work.
Maybe Nick or Cloner will add some info.
Agreed and not questioning their epertise, just the sample size of their experience ... on second thought, not even that
I'm curious to the degree of drag
does applying a brake stop the creep?
Did it drag bad enough to kill the engine with brake application?
If so, is drag that bad an indicator, like you mentioned, of non compatible aftermarket components or of other worn parts
S2R800, so it was an APTC clutch.
OEM master and slave cylinder.
OEM clutch slipping at 34.7k miles.
Replaced OEM plates with Barnett 306-25-20005.
It dragged so bad that it was totally impossible to find neutral when stopped with the engine running.
Fundamentally unacceptable.
Customer was game to try it for a while to see if they bedded in or whatever.
At 42.1k miles they were still dragging, and he had reached his limit.
Replaced them with an OEM set, and no dragging.
Motul 3000 oil for the entire time.
I serviced that bike from 17k miles to 56k miles, over a 4 1/2 year period.
The only time the clutch dragged was when the Barnett plates were in it.
Besides the pure aggravation of it, I've spent $350 in parts and labor to have a useless set of plates on my shelf.
They don't fit any bike I have, so I can't experiment with them.
I see no reason to continue experimentation, even at only my expense, when I've got a perfectly satisfactory solution (OEM plates).
But, all that aside, I think you should buy a set, and install them.
Let us know how they work.
the snark is strong with you two this afternoon
I do appreciate the information
Quote from: Mother on August 10, 2015, 02:50:19 PM
the snark is strong with you two this afternoon
I do appreciate the information
Snark...us?
...and besides...
it's only an $80 price difference.
If you can live with finding neutral on the coast then go for it.
Ducs haven't gotten any cheaper to own. :-\
Makes you wonder about issues like overall stack heights and the relative width of plates. Is it possible to mix and match plates to set stack height and avoid clutch drag, or is the Barnett friction material the problem? You blokes have any tips there?
Tuning the clutch is a real pain with the wet clutch set up. With dry clutches I have been mixing Barnett and oem parts to get the result I want, but thats easy on a 900.
I have installed several sets.
The first set I bought for a customer's Multistrada 1100 because of the slight price difference. I, too, ended up eating them because the bike simply wouldn't find neutral. It actually required a strong pull on the brake lever to keep the bike from pulling through stop lights!
The other two sets were customer purchases, one in an 800 SS race bike (that I now own) with an APTC clutch and one in an 848. Both experienced the same inability to find neutral, though it was worse in the 848. The 800 also has a pronounced chatter on launch that I put down to the lack of a dished plate.
I have also experienced some trouble with their dry clutches, though not as commonly. Recently a customer brought me a 1098 and a set of clutches he purchased that dragged badly. I have had no problem with them in earlier two-valvers, though.
I think from now on I will refuse to get involved in the installation of any clutches that say Barnette on them for Ducati.
I still like their clutch basket design, though. It's an aluminum basket with steel faces where the friction plates interface with the basket to reduce wear. No problem with that bit.
OEM wet non APTC clutches, with a rider who knows how to operate a clutch last a long time. My old bike with over 73K mostly urban miles still has the OEM clutch. My buddy has over 100K on his. When something works that well stick with it.
Thanks guys. Great information.
A buddy picked up a set for his M750 and is keen to use them. I can warn him to stick with his oem plates which have been trouble free for 47k miles.
Quote from: ducpainter on August 10, 2015, 03:17:02 PM
Snark...us?
...and besides...
it's only an $80 price difference.
If you can live with finding neutral on the coast then go for it.
Ducs haven't gotten any cheaper to own. :-\
I noticed that today looking up an OEM stack
$80 difference isn't worth the risk of all that frustration
A recent romp around the web found way too many stories that match speeddog and cloner
It seems like all these problem Barnett wet kits are aptc? Any issues explicitly with the old style wet clutches?
I picked up a set of Barnett plates for $30 my 97 m750, which is the older pantah spec motor with the internal slave cylinder.
This differs somewhat to the APtC setup yes?
I've not tried a set of the regular Barnetts.
I've got a shyte stack that came in my M750, they're not OEM and they drag as bad as the Barnetts.
Dunno if they're Barnett or not.
MTS 1100 is NOT an APTC clutch. Barnett clutches were awful in it.
The end.
get OEM . . .
So who wants to buy my Barnett kit? ;D ;D