rain got into the gauges

[accrocker]

Hey all,
In a strange turn of events, last week in San Diego, it rained!!!! While this was mildly exciting because it has been some time since I have seen water fall from the sky, it has also wreaked havoc on the gauge cluster of my 07 695. I now have fogging, the tach is off by 500rm, the speedo is off by 8mph, and the immobilizer led is no longer lighting up. Thankfully the immobilizer is still functional and the bike starts without any problems. I took the bike to my favorite local dealer (also where I purchased the bike) and they told me that ducati does not like to warranty gauges due to water incursion and that they will have to contact a field rep and get back to me on it. Now, a week later, and one phone call to dealer to check up, I still have not heard anything. Does anybody else have any similar experiences? I mentioned to the service adviser that I had heard of the 1098s having a similar problem with their digital dashes, but he just said that it was different. I checked around online for alternatives to the factory gauges if in fact they decide not to warranty them, which, will royally piss me off. I didn't find any very promising solutions online other than a DP or FIM ecu to eliminate the immobilizer and allow for aftermarket clocks. Any advice would be welcome.

[Speeddog]

It's a pretty common problem.

Keep pushing, politely.

[J.P.]

very common problem. thread on this board a page or 2 back. nothing resolved. Keep us posted as to what the draler does.
Mine fogs up almost every ride, and out of warrenty- guess that doesn't matter anyway.
Again please let us know the outcome.
Someone once said: Never get an Italian motorcycle wet on purpose.

[Capo]

I don't have this problem but I intrigued to solve it.

The condensation on the inside faces of the gauges is a result of the moisture contained in the air within the gauges being cooled to dewpoint by the cold surface of the gauge dial.
Where does this moisture come from?
A correctly assembled cluster should not permit the ingress of water (as distinct from moisture) any water that does enter in this way can drain through the vents in the bottom of the cluster, however, depending on the location of the leak drops of water can remain on interior surfaces, these are sufficient to significantly increase the moisture content of the air as it is heated from the operation of the electronics, when this heat is removed, the air cools down and can no longer hold as much moisture and condensation occurs on the coldest surface first. this being the gauge glass.

The sealing of the cluster halves is accomplished with a profiled rubber gasket, if it is suspected that water is entering the cluster, it should be dismantled and this gasket checked, it is easy to misalign it. When reassembling, apply a liberal coating of silicon grease to both sides of the gasket. The screw that secures the two halves has a moulded dam around it to prevent water from entering the cluster, pack some silicon grease in here.

The other source of moisture is via the 'breathing' that takes place as a result of the expansion and contraction of the air within the cluster due to temperature changes. The cluster is not sealed and is vented/drained by two ports in the bottom surface. This vent is necessary to prevent damage to the gauge from over pressure or vacuum.

One solution would be to place a desiccant in the vent this would remove the moisture from the air as it entered the cluster. Use of an indicator type would show the need fro replacement.

Another cheap solution would be to seal the vents with a couple of balloons (the vents have spigots) , this would allow for the expansion and contraction while preventing the admittance of air, purging the cluster with dry nitrogen prior to sealing would help.

[billg69gmc]

Mash has the 695 listed as one of the ECU's he can flash to kill the immobilizer. But that is half the battle. Is is true that once the immobilizer is nixed, you can put whatever dash you want on the bike?

Sorta sucks that with what little rain you guys get, it just so happens to mess you up. Is this a case of condensation or do the gauges not seal out rain?

[accrocker]

This was a case of the gauges not being properly sealed. There is a small rubber gasket that goes behind the multifunction buttons and around the immobilizer led light. That gasket seems to be the entry point of the water. The immobilizer light was staying dimly lit constantly, and now doesn't work at all. I pulled the dash apart and tried to clean out the corrosion as best as I could, but it seems that the led is dead for sure now. I am still waiting to hear back from the dealer about whether or not they will warranty it. If not, then I will take the gauges apart and at least replace the faulty led. I am working on some ideas for ways around the immobilizer/dash/ecu issues. I am also thinking about doing what Stu at flightcycles did and just remove the dash circuitry and place it somewhere safe and dry near the airbox, and then piggyback a veypor unit or some other aftermarket gauge system.

[Capo]

I have become aware of differences between the instrument housings fitted to later models

Pic 1 is of a housing fitted to a 04 S4R,
note the two breather tubes in the brackets, note also the molded Ducati logo above the connector.

Pic 2 is of a housing fitted to a later model
note the absence of the breather tubes
note a circular device in the position of the logo on the older housing
note two screws below the connector.

I am theorising that the circular device is possibly a breather incorporating a valve or contains an expansion membrane.
This to eliminate the fogging problem


Pic 1


Pic 2

[J.P.]

I knew there wasn't drain holes like others said. Thought I just couldn't find them. Pulled pod and put it in a dessicant chamber overnight.
Now I gotta try it again w/ the thing disassembled!
Thanks for the pics Capo!

[Capo]

In the intrests of expanding the knowledge base, when you disassemble it, it would be helpful if you could examine the 'circular disc' and perhaps take a pic of the inside view of it.

[accrocker]

I would be glad to provide pics of the inside of the cluster when I have it apart next. We have one more day of predicted rain, then it should be dry for a while. I am going to open the cluster up and see what I can do about either removing the circuit board and relocating it, or just trying to come up with a better seal for it so that it won't leak in the future. If anybody out there has a specific wiring diagram for the new instrument clusters (i.e. inputs, outputs, pin numbers) I would greatly appreciate it. I want to hook up the oscilloscope to the immobilizer line while it is communicating with the ecu and see if I can capture and replicate the signal. It might be the first step in finding a way around the system.

[RBX QB]

Is this unique to the newer clusters? My 06 S2R800 fogs occasionally, but only mildly. Curious if I should add another winter project to my schedule.

[Capo]

They all do, it is dependant on the physcometrics.
I believe that the modifications to the case are an attempted solution to the problem.

[J.P.]

Pulled apart the gauge pod on the 2006. Can't see a membrane in the hole of the little vent insert, but that's what it is. Will break the stupid thing if I tried to pop it out- three plastic tabs through a hole.
The gasket was alittle pinched. Sorry no pic. Took one, but no host available. Will e-mail to anyone interested.