***UPDATE 5/23***05 620 Backfiring, coughing, and dying at low RPM's

[2 Wheel Wanderer]

Hey All, I just left the bike at the dealer yesterday but am trying to find out what's going on, my brain just wont leave it alone.

The bike has 12.5K miles on it. 2700 mi. ago the speedo was replaced under warranty, I just got a new chain and sprockets(same size as the originals), and had a 12K service done about a week ago. It also has cut down Termi pipes(dont know it that would have anything to do with it).

About 3 weeks ago it started backfiring at any RPM's while I was riding Hwy 36 up by Fortuna,Ca.

A couple of days ago, when starting from a stoplight I'd give it some throttle while engaging the clutch as you normally do and it would lose power. I had to coax it by pulling in the clutch and reving the bike a bit while trying to let it out again and after coughing to about 4K-4.5K RPMs was able to switch gears then it would start all over again in 2nd. While in 2nd it felt like it was going to die on me so I pulled in the clutch to let it regain the RPM's on its own and what happens? It dies on me. I barely got it home.

The next day I was warming it up so I could take it down to the dealer and while I had the auto choke engaged it dropped to 2K rpm's by itself for a second and then returned to about 3K rpm's like a ghost was doing it. Really weird. The dealer is only 5 miles from my house and it died twice on the way over there. I'm just trying to figure out what it could possibly be.

Any help is appreciated. Thanks DMF...

[johnster]

Jeez.... 

My 1st thoughts would be;

-clogged fuel supply line coming from the tank..

-bad fuel pump...

-Fuel injectors or ECU out of whack somehow...

-Intermittent electrical shenanigans w/the sparkplugs/wires??

-I bet (I hope) it's nothing huge... Sounds like something just needs to be sorted out..... it doesn't sound like a huge mechanical problem, but who knows....      Hopefully you'll get it sorted out!!   

[clubhousemotorsports]

Just curious
was it doing this while the dealer had it for the 12000 mile service? how did they not catch this on a test ride?

sounds like you may have something other than fuel in your fuel tank or a bad fuel line in the tank.

backfiring where? airbox or exhaust?
does the tach do anything funny while this is happening?
does the bike sound normal? I once had a guy trying to rejet his poor running SS, he had a broken timing belt. Drove it a week trying to get his jetting sorted on one cylinder.

[ducpainter]

Sounds to me like a cylinder is dropping out.

Bad plug/wire/coil...bad fuel

[2 Wheel Wanderer]

Ducpainter - thanks for moving this to tech..

Ducvet-

was it doing this while the dealer had it for the 12000 mile service? it was backfiring a few weeks before and then the problems dissappeared until a few days after the service. I went to the dealer up in Santa Rosa to get the service done (instead of the dealer in San Rafael where I live) cause they did a great job on the 6K service and I saved $160 bucks. I brought it down to the local dealer for this problem though. The backfiring started after they replaced the whole speedo-tach unit.

backfiring where? airbox or exhaust? a few weeks ago it was out of the exhaust but then a few days ago it coming out of the airbox big time. 

does the tach do anything funny while this is happening? yes, it drops dramatically.

does the bike sound normal?  yep it sounds ok


Johnster - I was thinking the same thing about the ECU - maybe it got out of whack when they replaced the speedo-tach unit. I know they needed my red key after replacement to reflash it or something.

the fuel lines are ok, the service manager checked it while I was there, plenty of pressure.


Do you guys think the ECU settings would revert back to the stock settings (pre-Termi) when the speedo-tach was replaced? Is it even possible?

Edit - Also, the bike has an extended warranty through 2011(Western Service Contract Corp - Concept Plan) and I'm not a mechanic but am mechanically inclined. Just stating the facts per Duck-Stew's - How to post in tech - sticky.

Thanks All

[clubhousemotorsports]

 it was backfiring a few weeks before and then the problems dissappeared until a few days after the service. I went to the dealer up in Santa Rosa to get the service done (instead of the dealer in San Rafael where I live) cause they did a great job on the 6K service and I saved $160 bucks. I brought it down to the local dealer for this problem though. The backfiring started after they replaced the whole speedo-tach unit.
I cannot think of anything speedo tach related that would be causing this, but that being said. why did you change the speedo/tach? I would contact the shop that did the speedo swap and let them know something changed and see if you could put your old tach back on and see if it improves. I wonder if you could have a bad connection at the new tach and it is causing the problem. Swapping out the new tach for your old tach should take all of ten minutes.


backfiring where? airbox or exhaust? a few weeks ago it was out of the exhaust but then a few days ago it coming out of the airbox big time. 
That indicates a lean condition usually . is your airbox open or closed?


does the tach do anything funny while this is happening? yes, it drops dramatically.
If it is dropping like a stone I would look at the tach connections very closely it would be  common for a new dash to be bad out of the box although I have not seen one do this.

does the bike sound normal?  yep it sounds ok
Running on two makes it sound like whatever is happening is happening to both cylinders so it is a whole system problem.


Johnster - I was thinking the same thing about the ECU - maybe it got out of whack when they replaced the speedo-tach unit. I know they needed my red key after replacement to reflash it or something.
They should have had no effect on each other as they only used the red key to program your imobilizer to the dash




Do you guys think the ECU settings would revert back to the stock settings (pre-Termi) when the speedo-tach was replaced? Is it even possible?
Again this should not be possible but hey its italian.The only other thing would be if something caused the bike to blow the ground circuit in the ecu it will go into full rich mode. you will notice the bike blows black smoke more and the throttle will be lazy, fuel mileage will be low and you should be able to smell it.
If you want to rule out the ecu reinstall your stock ecu and see if the problem follows . Just be sure to reattach the ground wire to the ecu or you could blow the unit.

Edit - Also, the bike has an extended warranty through 2011(Western Service Contract Corp - Concept Plan) and I'm not a mechanic but am mechanically inclined. Just stating the facts per Duck-Stew's - How to post in tech - sticky.

Thanks All

[/quote]

[2 Wheel Wanderer]

 it was backfiring a few weeks before and then the problems dissappeared until a few days after the service. I went to the dealer up in Santa Rosa to get the service done (instead of the dealer in San Rafael where I live) cause they did a great job on the 6K service and I saved $160 bucks. I brought it down to the local dealer for this problem though. The backfiring started after they replaced the whole speedo-tach unit.
I cannot think of anything speedo tach related that would be causing this, but that being said. why did you change the speedo/tach? I would contact the shop that did the speedo swap and let them know something changed and see if you could put your old tach back on and see if it improves. I wonder if you could have a bad connection at the new tach and it is causing the problem. Swapping out the new tach for your old tach should take all of ten minutes. They changed it cause the speedo needle was shaking pretty bad and they thought it was going out.


backfiring where? airbox or exhaust? a few weeks ago it was out of the exhaust but then a few days ago it coming out of the airbox big time. 
That indicates a lean condition usually . is your airbox open or closed?
Its open

does the tach do anything funny while this is happening? yes, it drops dramatically.
If it is dropping like a stone I would look at the tach connections very closely it would be  common for a new dash to be bad out of the box although I have not seen one do this. Ill mention this to them tomoorw when they open.


Do you guys think the ECU settings would revert back to the stock settings (pre-Termi) when the speedo-tach was replaced? Is it even possible?
Again this should not be possible but hey its italian.The only other thing would be if something caused the bike to blow the ground circuit in the ecu it will go into full rich mode. you will notice the bike blows black smoke more and the throttle will be lazy, fuel mileage will be low and you should be able to smell it.
If you want to rule out the ecu reinstall your stock ecu and see if the problem follows . Just be sure to reattach the ground wire to the ecu or you could blow the unit. Ill see if they still have the old one to reinstall.

Ducvet thanks for the comments hopefully they'll help in getting to the bottom of this problem.

Thank you again

[2 Wheel Wanderer]

So I just got back from the dealership. They called earlier and said the bike was ready. They got an error message for the atmosphere pressure sensor, they erased the error, reset the TPS and set the idle mix on EGA (whatever that means). It ran great when I picked it up, then about 10 miles down the road it started acting up again. It also had a new symptom. At idle, it dropped from 1250 rpm to under 1K then back to 1250 all in a matter of a couple of seconds. I immediately turned around and took it back. 

They said the sensor is part of the dash so if they have to replace it it'll all be under my extended warranty again.

Here we go again, round 2 DING, DING!!   

[clubhousemotorsports]

If the part was replaced under warranty it also has a one year warranty from ducati.

setting thje bike up on a ega is a good thing but if you have a sensor going bad it will do no good.
now think how nice it would be if you had to shell out $800 for this sensor.

[2 Wheel Wanderer]

Shelling out $800 would be no bueno.    

I talked to the guys at the dealership today, the problem was the air sensor inside the new dash they replaced 2 months ago under my extended warranty policy. They were going to order one from Ducati but they have a new one for an S4R that they got stuck with somehow and are going to let me have it.

I went down there to check out how it looked and I believe the only thing different is the white on the outside of the dials, otherwise it looks the same. They said it is a $1000 part, that extended warranty really paid off. I’ve also had a leaking breather replaced as well.   

I hope to get the bike back tomorrow. Thanks for the help in understanding the problems I have been experiencing with my monster. 

[Cucciolo]

Wow..all of this makes me wonder HOW EXPENSIVE parts for the monster are.

What are the most expensive parts that could fail ?

[2 Wheel Wanderer]

Yep, Ducs are expensive but absolutely worth every penny. I just started riding last year and am loving every second of it. At this point if I had to choose between the bike and my car, I'd sell the car.

So, I picked up the bike today and its running phenomenal. The only problem is the speedo and odometer are not working correctly. I was out on hwy 1 for a test ride today and probably went 75-80mph at most, the speedo said I was doing 140 (I have the fastest 620 on the planet ). The total mileage for the ride should have been just over 80 miles, the odometer said 126. It's off by about 45%, I think. Anyway, I'm gonna use this dash for a couple of weeks until they get yet ANOTHER dash from Ducati.

Until then, RIDE ON 

[clubhousemotorsports]

Sounds like your bike is reading kilometers instead of miles

[Howie]

2 Wheel Wanderer, you must be new to the family.  Randal has a 620 that does 140 with ease