Sanity check need for valve specs (Now Belts! 2/1)

[yotogi]

So I dove in and started doing the valves on my S2R1K this afternoon. Obligations meant I only got the bike torn down and the vertical head checked. I did this with the belts on and finding TDC was an interesting trick since the pictures of other people's windows had different kinds of marks. Anyway... 5 rechecks later these are the consistent numbers I was getting:

Vertical Cylinder:
 Intake
   Opener 0.003
   Closer  0.003
 Exhaust
   Opener 0.003
   Closer  0.002

These kinds of numbers would make sense as the valves seated more since the last check, right? (Openers tightened, closers loosened)
And if these are the correct readings, I should plan to file down or replace the openers to get to those to spec and replace the closers to try and get to 0.0-0.001, right?

Thanks guys just first time valve adjustment virgin.

[He Man]

you should just pull the belts. makes life loads easier.

but assuming you did it correctly. it sounds right.

[ducpainter]

Loosen those openers and tighten the closers.

[yotogi]

Loosen those openers and tighten the closers.

Thanks man!

you should just pull the belts. makes life loads easier.

but assuming you did it correctly. it sounds right.

I wasn't planning on replacing the shims right now. I just wanted to figure out what I needed to do, get a little confidence in what I was doing at stages that I could back out of and have a mechanic do the work, practice as it were.

So how does removing the belts make it easier? Just that you can spin the cams easier? I am planning on doing the belts next so when I am in there doing the belts, I will do the valves at the same time.

Thanks for the help guys.

[uclabiker06]

I personally read everything and I mean everything I could on the process.  I know it sounds crazy but i read every article i could find, got the pro Italia dvd, the LT Snyder Manual (this is really good one), and finally last but not least, skimmed through and read every thread on the topic.  Perhaps i overdid it a bit but thats just how i am. I didn't really have anyone to teach me and i didn't know much about mechanics but I got through it and so can you.

Make sure to stick a screw driver in the valve hole where the spark plug goes to make sure you don't drop your valve stem when you remove the shims....this option will work much better than trying to hold the stem in place w/ forceps; Specially for the vertical exhaust valve.

[He Man]

So how does removing the belts make it easier? Just that you can spin the cams easier? I am planning on doing the belts next so when I am in there doing the belts, I will do the valves at the same time.

Thanks for the help guys.

pretty much. once the piston is out of the way, you can spin the cam shaft as you please (though there is resistance in the springs) and is much easier than fighting the belts.

[Speeddog]

The biggest reason for taking the belts off is so you can rotate the cams by hand to make sure your closers aren't too tight.

#2 Reason is it makes it a *lot* easier to get the opener rocker moved to the side so you can get shims on and off.
And on a DS, it'd be *really really* hard to get the opener back in position with the belts on.

Whichever head you're working on, get the piston at top dead center.
That way you can't drop a valve.

[AndrewNS]

Hey Speeddog, I think I already know the answer to this, but I'm going to ask anyway...With the piston at TDC, is the valve going to strike the piston when you spin the cam with the belts off?

I'm guessing your answer is "no", but I'm surprised 'cause I always thought it would be a problem. 

[printman]

The biggest reason for taking the belts off is so you can rotate the cams by hand to make sure your closers aren't too tight.

#2 Reason is it makes it a *lot* easier to get the opener rocker moved to the side so you can get shims on and off.
And on a DS, it'd be *really really* hard to get the opener back in position with the belts on.

Whichever head you're working on, get the piston at top dead center.
That way you can't drop a valve.

Exactly why I do this. You can feel if there is any slight resistance on the closer with the opener slid over, not sure on a DS model. Such tight tolerances aren't always accurately measured with a feeler gauge when your talking .001". spinning it will gaurantee it is free to turn smoothly.

[Speeddog]

Hey Speeddog, I think I already know the answer to this, but I'm going to ask anyway...With the piston at TDC, is the valve going to strike the piston when you spin the cam with the belts off?

I'm guessing your answer is "no", but I'm surprised 'cause I always thought it would be a problem. 

With piston at TDC, yes, the valves will hit the pistons if you spin the cam far enough.
You don't need to turn the cam that far to get the opener rockers on and off, same for checking for drag or binding due to overly tight clearances.

[seevtsaab]

This board is reason enough to get a Duc

everybody who goes thru it and lives to tell about it will add one useful tidbit

Lose the belts, don't fight it

after consulting the experts I came up with this, is worked with my brain,
(Clip off)
(opener rocker - move)
(opener shim - off)
forceps - on valve stem
closer rocker - down, secure with 8-10mm allen (EEEEEEEEEXCELENT TIP)
collets - out
Allen - out
closer shim - out

Closing shim -on
Allen - in
Collets - on
Allen - out
Forceps - off

With a little pressing on the closer rocker and spinning the cam at various points


http://ducatimonsterforum.org/index.php?topic=29821.0


enjoy

[yotogi]

Thanks for all the tips and pointers! I must have watched Chris's video a dozen times before I dove in there.

I got a set of the new ExactFit belts from California Cycleworks today and am diving in this weekend!

[Blue]

closer rocker - down, secure with 8-10mm allen (EEEEEEEEEXCELENT TIP)

Nevermind, I was able to figure it out (I ended up using a 3/8" drill bit). 

[Ddan]

This board is reason enough to get a Duc

everybody who goes thru it and lives to tell about it will add one useful tidbit

Lose the belts, don't fight it

after consulting the experts I came up with this, is worked with my brain,
(Clip off)
(opener rocker - move)
(opener shim - off)
forceps - on valve stem
closer rocker - down, secure with 8-10mm allen (EEEEEEEEEXCELENT TIP)
collets - out
Allen - out
closer shim - out

Closing shim -on
Allen - in
Collets - on
Allen - out
Forceps - off

With a little pressing on the closer rocker and spinning the cam at various points


http://ducatimonsterforum.org/index.php?topic=29821.0


enjoy

One other thing, you want to block off the oil return galley with something or sure as hell a collet will jump from the end of your finger and go right down that little hole.

[yotogi]

Well, the work is done!

But, how do you do secure the closer rockers? I had to grab a buddy of mine from down the street to help me get the the closers on and off.

I got a little stumped when trying to get both opening rockers clear. In the ducatitech.com video Chris points out that you can get it so the cam turns over freely. I was never able to get both openers clear at the same time. I have an S2R1K so there may some differences up there in the head. After turning it over and checking it out, I just didn't think it possible, nor did it matter as I as able to do them one at a time.

The ExactFit belts were perfect and the 5mm allen key belt tension trick worked perfectly. Thanks for the pointers guys!