Holy Shit!

[Howie]

So sad.  Everyone looses.  We will never know what the Pit was thinking, but dogs should never be left loose on their own. 

To a quick and complete recovery for your Dad   And to Mom

[cyrus buelton]

FWIW, Pit Bulls usually make poor guard dogs. Not that they aren't/can't be protective, but many other breeds are much more suited to the task (like a Doberman).

I agree with that.

My doberman (soon to #2 in the house........a male) female is VERY protective of our home. She does laps. She goes to all the windows and doors when she hears something.

I've never heard of any of my pit friends saying their pooches do that.


I just really wonder if my current beloved Greta would throw down if she had to.................

[ZLTFUL]

I guess I should elaborate a bit more on the owner of the pit bull...she is an angel of a woman. She didn't let the dog run lose purposely. In fact, today's instance was the fault of a meter reader. The meter reader didn't latch the gate fully after leaving her back yard and the dog was able to push the gate open and roam freely without her knowledge.

I feel bad for the dog. It's history was one of violence. I also feel bad for the owner as she was naive enough to think that a dog with an abused past was capable of rehabilitation.

My dad is known to be an animal lover. He has a bad habit of feeding strays and taking in unwanted animals (growing up, I remember a time when we had 11 cats, 7 dogs, 2 cows and 8 chickens). The last thing he wanted was for this to end the way it did. He feels bad that my nephew lost his dog but he also feels horrible that this pit bull will most likely be put down.

Nobody wins in this situation.

[ZLTFUL]

Adam, my dad is 59 and a single leg amputee. He lost his leg to a drunk driver before I was born.

He also managed to fight his way through a perforated esophagus that at one point Drs said he had a 5% chance of walking away from...4 monthes after he was admitted into the hospital, he was released and has made a full recovery.

He has always been a fighter and I think the physical damage is far less than his emotional damage at seeing little Bear getting taken down like he did.

Everyone, I don't want this to be a Pit Bull thread. This just happened to be the breed that attacked. But I have seen attacks from most breeds and have scars on my hands from a scrappy little pug that I picked on as a kid. All breeds are capable of violence and the nature of the violence can be caused by many things. I know the most docile black lab in the world. We call him Willly the Poseable Dog because when he is lounging he just doesn't care what you do to him. But I have seen him turn into Cujo once when he thought one of the owner's kids was in danger.

[RAT900]

Thank you for the updates Z...humans are resilient and the nephew will get through it and your father sounds like he is tougher than nails...I would let the nephew know his dog died rather than tell him it ran off...how it died can be skipped....otherwise he will spend months/years looking for it

and to put the loss into a cold-comfort perspective...thank God your nephew wasn't the one with Bear when this happened

A few people posted about the fact that animals are animals and ultimately/primarily will behave as such...

there is no truer statement that can be made...and none more important...and one that humans always seem to lose sight of

ANY animal is a crap-shoot under the wrong conditions irrespective of breed, training or ownership history...something as simple as a hornet or bee sting can throw the animal into a state that could have awful consequences to a child, adult or smaller creature

they are not lifestyle accessories, they are in fact an enormous responsibility with a daunting liability

like a loaded weapon..."oops" and "I'm sorry" or "I thought that"....those sorts of words just don't work if something went wrong

pet ownership and complacency are a formula for disaster...if you are not thinking preemptively when you assume responsibility for a dog you are playing odds

and no matter how good the stats and the odds are....they become meaningless in a heartbeat if you find yourself on the wrong side of the statistics

my heart goes out to you and yours

[hadesducati848]

Thank you for the updates Z...humans are resilient and the nephew will get through it and your father sounds like he is tougher than nails...I would let the nephew know his dog died rather than tell him it ran off...how it died can be skipped....otherwise he will spend months/years looking for it

and to put the loss into a cold-comfort perspective...thank God your nephew wasn't the one with Bear when this happened

A few people posted about the fact that animals are animals and ultimately/primarily will behave as such...

there is no truer statement that can be made...and none more important...and one that humans always seem to lose sight of

ANY animal is a crap-shoot under the wrong conditions irrespective of breed, training or ownership history...something as simple as a hornet or bee sting can throw the animal into a state that could have awful consequences to a child, adult or smaller creature

they are not lifestyle accessories, they are in fact an enormous responsibility with a daunting liability

like a loaded weapon..."oops" and "I'm sorry" or "I thought that"....those sorts of words just don't work if something went wrong

pet ownership and complacency are a formula for disaster...if you are not thinking preemptively when you assume responsibility for a dog you are playing odds

and no matter how good the stats and the odds are....they become meaningless in a heartbeat if you find yourself on the wrong side of the statistics

my heart goes out to you and yours

very well put 

[Speedbag]

Indeed.

Sorry about your Dad, Z.

[WarrenJ]

At one point, I had some vandalism here and was between dogs.  I gave some serious thought to getting an Ovcharka Shepard or a Dogos Argentinos as a watchdog/family dog.  The more I thought about it, the  more I realized it was worse than having a loaded gun laying out in the yard.   It was a weapon with its own brain.  Mistakes and incidents will happen in spite of our best intentions.  Having a breed or an individual dog with the reputation, pre-disposition and physical ability of causing grave bodliy harm is problematic.  Getting nailed in the back of the leg or the hand by a springer spaniel or a lab is bad enough, but they will typically not break  your bones or kill you.  I understand the people that have pits or other "aggressive" breeds loving their dogs - if I had one, I know I would love it, but the disaster factor for these breeds or individuals is too high unless your situation necessitates having a dog that can alert you to problems and neutralize   perceived threats without regard to consequences. 

[Stella]

All breeds are capable of violence and the nature of the violence can be caused by many things. I know the most docile black lab in the world.

So true....

Your dad AND your step-mom sound like remarkable people.  Best wishes to all for recovery of all kinds!

[hadesducati848]

At one point, I had some vandalism here and was between dogs.  I gave some serious thought to getting an Ovcharka Shepard or a Dogos Argentinos as a watchdog/family dog.  The more I thought about it, the  more I realized it was worse than having a loaded gun laying out in the yard.   It was a weapon with its own brain.  Mistakes and incidents will happen in spite of our best intentions.  Having a breed or an individual dog with the reputation, pre-disposition and physical ability of causing grave bodliy harm is problematic.  Getting nailed in the back of the leg or the hand by a springer spaniel or a lab is bad enough, but they will typically not break  your bones or kill you.  I understand the people that have pits or other "aggressive" breeds loving their dogs - if I had one, I know I would love it, but the disaster factor for these breeds or individuals is too high unless your situation necessitates having a dog that can alert you to problems and neutralize   perceived threats without regard to consequences. 

Dogos Argentinos are so beautiful (white coat, blue eyes, black nose) i met a guy that has 6 of them and he hunts wild boars with them here in hawaii. his biggest one is 120lbs.

[Doctor Woodrow]

My wife and I manage the apartment complex we live at and have a neighbor with a pit who just cannot seem to keep their dog in their pit bull in their yard. This is not a case of digging out or jumping fence, this is leaving the door or gate open and just either not noticing or not caring. Anyways, this dog keeps ending up on my property, and we have five children here under the age of 2, and a few other young ones. Many tenants have comnplained about this dog threatening them (ie growling, barking, rushing at them), but no physical contact has occured or any injury. I don't want that to happen and don't know what my course of action should be. I live in Vancouver Washington (for reference) and only live about 3 blocks from the police station so I can just walk down and ask questions any time I want to.
Talking to the neighbors seems to have no effect. These neighbors are in government housing around the corner, I just say that because they seem to fit the general idea of people in government housing in other ways too (no job, fights all the time, trash in the yard), and I want to give a complete picture of my situation. My place is clean, quiet, and pretty safe and secure feeling, and I want to keep it that way.

So in the end I am asking for advice as to what I should do; talk to the cops at the station, call the cops next time the dog is here (no I can't catch it myself, I tried that and won't again), should I call the Vancouver housing authority?

The Doc

[SacDuc]

My wife and I manage the apartment complex we live at and have a neighbor with a pit who just cannot seem to keep their dog in their pit bull in their yard. This is not a case of digging out or jumping fence, this is leaving the door or gate open and just either not noticing or not caring. Anyways, this dog keeps ending up on my property, and we have five children here under the age of 2, and a few other young ones. Many tenants have comnplained about this dog threatening them (ie growling, barking, rushing at them), but no physical contact has occured or any injury. I don't want that to happen and don't know what my course of action should be. I live in Vancouver Washington (for reference) and only live about 3 blocks from the police station so I can just walk down and ask questions any time I want to.
Talking to the neighbors seems to have no effect. These neighbors are in government housing around the corner, I just say that because they seem to fit the general idea of people in government housing in other ways too (no job, fights all the time, trash in the yard), and I want to give a complete picture of my situation. My place is clean, quiet, and pretty safe and secure feeling, and I want to keep it that way.

So in the end I am asking for advice as to what I should do; talk to the cops at the station, call the cops next time the dog is here (no I can't catch it myself, I tried that and won't again), should I call the Vancouver housing authority?

The Doc

You could hire ZLTFUL's mom.   

sac

[Popeye the Sailor]

I would contact the authorities.

[DCXCV]

Do you have a local animal control office you can call?  They might be either willing to talk to your neighbors about proper care or certainly would be equipped to take the unleashed dog away.  The most useless people too often have big dogs.  Sadly, it ends up being the dogs and other people who pay for their laziness and stupidity.

[SacDuc]

I would contact the authorities.

Actually, you should contact the police (non-emergency) AND animal control EVERY time you see the pitbull unattended outside of its yard. You need to start establishing that it is a pattern of behavior and a regular occurrence. Tell all of your tenants and neighbors to do the same and provide them with the phone numbers.

Any bureaucracy loves a paper trail. When we finally got serious about the noise from the apartments next door the cops presented the landlord with a record of complaint stretching back over six years. Fences went up that week and no lawyers involved.

Another time I called the office of the city arborist because some city trees were blocking my view of the water. The lady told me that they don't trim trees just to better someone's view. So I called back two weeks later and said that it looks like those trees are top heavy and in danger of falling. They said they would check it out. I called back two weeks later and said the same thing. The lady says, "Oh, you are the second person who has called about that!" They inproved my view the very next day.  

Good luck. Hopefully the dog friendly and there will not be an incident.

sac