Moto GP Round 14 - Aragon (SPOILERS)

[kopfjäger]

Fastwin, I'm not sure what Moto2 race you were watching, but Marquez by no means just ran away with that race. It was a battle till about 7 left.

[Triple J]

Fastwin, I'm not sure what Moto2 race you were watching, but Marquez by no means just ran away with that race. It was a battle till about 7 left.

Agreed.

Put down the tinfoil hat Fastwin. 

[fastwin]

OK Marquez is good. I'll take that back but it sure looked like a horsepower race at the end, not tires or talent. If it had been an AMA race someone would have demanded a tear down. I hope someone in Aragon did. I've seen "getting a good drive" out of a turn a few times in my life regarding a pass but that was pure HP. He passed folks at the end of the race like Stoner did to Spies. Again, I'm still thinking it stinks. Spanish race, Spanish rider, Spanish team all with links to Honda for years. Besides, if you had a secret HP advantage wouldn't you hide it until the end of the race? Why show your hand on lap 2? Besides, I'm a fan of conspiracy theories.

Reminds me of the bullshit "illegal crankshaft" crap pulled by the AMA on Mladin at VIR a few years ago. Only it's the reverse. If I was Bradl, De Angelis or Iannone I'd be checking that bike for a NOS bottle. You talking smack about my tin foil hat??

[OT]

Hopefully not a derby...

http://www.cyclenews.com/articles/road-racing/2011/09/19/wayne-s-world-business-as-usual/

[fastwin]

He pretty much said what friends and I have said to one another. Ducati is in a big mess. They walked away from WSBK for this? Thankfully Checa is doing them a HUGE service. I can't imagine the amount of money that has gone to Rossi and the MotoGP effort. And they have shit to show for it. How sad and embarrassing is that? Not that miracles were expected from the Dream Team but still... how about some podiums at least. Hope this isn't indicative of how the 1199 will fare in racing.

[Jester]

He pretty much said what friends and I have said to one another. Ducati is in a big mess. They walked away from WSBK for this? Thankfully Checa is doing them a HUGE service. I can't imagine the amount of money that has gone to Rossi and the MotoGP effort. And they have shit to show for it. How sad and embarrassing is that? Not that miracles were expected from the Dream Team but still... how about some podiums at least. Hope this isn't indicative of how the 1199 will fare in racing.

Two completely different bikes in shape and form.  Besides, its not like Ducati really changed or fixed anything.  The Ducati has been a disaster for every single person to ride the thing except one person, so its not like its ever been a good bike.  They tweaked with the existing concept, but really haven't changed anything, so they have the same results.  Also Rossi is a front end centric rider, not rear like Stoner.  If Rossi's front isn't good, then forget it.  I think Burgess made the gross miscalculation that he could fix the bike in 80 seconds, so they believed in it and stepped into their own grave.

[Spidey]

OK. I'm done with MotoGP. The big bike races are boring and after watching the Moto2 race I'm calling foul. If it was an AMA race there would be a motor tear down on Marquez's bike. Sealed 600cc Honda engines my ass. It was a Spanish GP with a Spanish rider on a Repsol sponsored bike. He motored past every rider he wanted to down every straight. Slip streaming my ass he had 20 horsepower on everyone. He had some good tussles up front but when he said goodbye it was all horsepower. I'm calling bullshit. He isn't that good.

Didn't he put the pass on Iannone (?), who is 4 inches taller and 22 lbs heavier than Marquez?  That pass looked entirely like draft and drive on a heavier, taller rider.  Everyone said that he got updates to the suspension and chasis that gave him at least .3 second a lap.  And those updates helped with drive out of turns.  Which is what you saw.

Besides, if you think that what you saw was a one-off because he got fast-bits, you haven't been paying attention to Marquez.  And you didn't pay attention to him last year.  Sure, he started off this season crashing a lot, but he f'n killed it last year and is killin' it this year.  It's not about go-fast parts.

[fastwin]

At my age it's hard to pay attention. Comments based on what I saw... not what I know. Which is thin at best. Again, just sayin' it looked funny. If it wasn't, then it wasn't. No biggie. Personal opinions are never fact.

[fastwin]

Two completely different bikes in shape and form.  Besides, its not like Ducati really changed or fixed anything.  The Ducati has been a disaster for every single person to ride the thing except one person, so its not like its ever been a good bike.  They tweaked with the existing concept, but really haven't changed anything, so they have the same results.  Also Rossi is a front end centric rider, not rear like Stoner.  If Rossi's front isn't good, then forget it.  I think Burgess made the gross miscalculation that he could fix the bike in 80 seconds, so they believed in it and stepped into their own grave.

Rossi and Burgess ain't dumb. It wouldn't take ten minutes over cold beers with Hayden and Stoner to confirm everything they saw from the Yammyhammer paddock before they signed the Ducati contract. And I can't believe they would sign a contract that did not give them a shit load of control regarding bike development and changes. Am I stupid here once again? I just don't see Vale & Co. going into this blind and not aware of the f'uped bike they were going to ride and what it needed. And I don't see that power team being pushed around by Ducati engineer nerds or top brass. Makes no sense. I would think if Vale & Co. wanted an in-line 4 with an aluminum twin spar frame that is what they would get... yesterday! Guess I'm wrong once again because they haven't accomplished shit. Might as well be running a Multistrada out there against the Hondas and Yamahas!

By the way Jacob, it was all I could do to not toast you on the Rossi/front end vs Stoner/rear end comment. It was out of respect and the fact I know you. Besides, it was just too damn easy! Still a true comment jokes aside.

[duccarlos]

About 75% of developing a bike starts the season prior. So Rossi/Burgess could only do so much with what was provided to them. Throw in that Rossi was still recovering from his shoulder thing to make things even more complicated. They will definitely have more input on next year's bike, but the engineers were always looking at the CF frame. They tried a lot of things to make it work. Now, they're looking at another solution and using the GP11 as a test bed for any changes. Basically they are using this season as an extended development time for the GP12.

[zooom]

Hopefully not a derby...

http://www.cyclenews.com/articles/road-racing/2011/09/19/wayne-s-world-business-as-usual/

there is 1 bit in there I think he is 100% wrong about in there...

....I think there's a strong possibility that the factory will simply cut its loses and walk away from MotoGP entirely, maybe as early as this year. What a disaster that would be for the sport at the moment. They may decide to go back to World Superbikes in an official capacity next year, possibly taking Rossi over to that series....