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1999 M900 - No Fuel Pump Installed

Started by J-Speed Inc., January 02, 2012, 07:03:10 AM

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J-Speed Inc.

January 02, 2012, 07:03:10 AM
I was looking through the owners manual of my 1999 M900 today and noticed that there should be a vacuum-operated fuel pump mounted on the right side of the frame, I don't have one!  The feed line from the fuel tank goes directly into the carburetors.  I bought the bike as a project bike about a week ago, I was able to ride it from the sellers place to my home (about 30 miles) with a few hiccups, but overall OK.

Anyone know the story on this?  Was removing the fuel pump a mod for this bike?  Based on what I've found thus far, the previous owner had no idea what he was doing and should not be allowed near a motorcycle.

Howie

#1
January 02, 2012, 07:12:03 AM
If the fuel pump is eliminated you will have greatly reduced cruising range since the carb inlets are mounted higher than the bottom of the tank.  There may be an electric pump mounted somewhere.

Dellikose

#2
January 02, 2012, 07:12:26 AM
Is this what you are referring to?



I know that replacing the vac petcock is a good mod, since they are prone to failure. But, the vacuum pump is supposed to be a pretty good piece.

So, you basically now have a gravity fed system...which means you can't use as much fuel out of your tank as if you had a pump. There might also be fuel starvation issues with high load on the engine.
1999 Ducati M900

J-Speed Inc.

#3
January 02, 2012, 07:31:54 AM
The previous owner seemed to take the stance that if something broke or he didn't know how to fix something, remove it.  Since the vacuum petcock is gone, I will be installing an inline fuel shut off valve in case I ever need to remove the tank.  Also found out that my low fuel sensor had the wires ripped off, spent about 3 hours trying to find the cut wires, and have given up the fight.  The PO was a MORON!

I've checked on eBay and Ducati forums and haven't been able to locate a frame mounted fuel pump, you guys have any ideas?

J-Speed Inc.

#4
January 02, 2012, 07:46:38 AM
Howie, I like your idea of running an electric fuel pump instead of the OEM vacuum operated one.  I've chedk on eBay and found 12V electric fuel pumps for about $40.  The pump supplies 5-9 psi which should be plenty for my application, though I would prefer to lower the pressure to what the factory pump puts out so I don't blow any seals in the carburetors. 

Regarding the fittings on the tank, I have a feed, drain, and bleed.  Does anyone know what function the "bleed" fitting performs?  If I am to use the electric fuel pump, my plan is to cap off the bleed fitting and use only the drain and feed fittings.

Raux

#5
January 02, 2012, 08:28:49 AM
you might need a return.

Howie

#6
January 02, 2012, 09:01:06 AM Last Edit: January 02, 2012, 09:03:11 AM by howie
Actually, I didn't recommend installing one, though it is a good idea.  I said look and see if there is one in line.  5-9 PSI is high and could cause flooding.  I think you would want 3 PSI, not sure.  

Does the bottom of your tank look like this?



The feed is clear.  Where the factory got drain and bleed from is beyond me, but one is overflow and the other is vent, assuming your tank is stock.  They can be joined, assuming your bike has no charcoal canister.  Here is a thread on said canister      http://www.ducatimonsterforum.org/index.php?topic=3446.0

If you go with a vacuum pump, the advantage being not needing to run electrics, you will need add a fuel shut off.  The bike came from the factory with a vacuum operated shut off (circled)

May of us, including me went manual



ducpainter

#7
January 02, 2012, 12:23:26 PM
You can use an electric pump that delivers about 3-4 psi safely without a pressure regulator or return.

"Once you accept that a child on the autistic spectrum experiences the world in
 a completely different way than you, you will be open to understand how that
 perspective
    is even more amazing than yours."
    To realize the value of nine  months:
    Ask a mother who gave birth to a stillborn.
"Don't piss off old people The older we get, the less 'Life in Prison' is a deterrent."


J-Speed Inc.

#8
January 02, 2012, 06:23:47 PM
Howie, thanks for your post, it was very helpful.  I have decided to abandon the electric fuel pump in favor of an aftermarket vacuum pump.  I also don't understand what the "bleed" line is for, I will join the "bleed" and "drain" tubes as I have removed the charcoal canister. 

Some searching on eBay lead me to this:

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Vacuum-Pulsed-Fuel-Pump-Clone-Go-Kart-Racing-/310362084226?pt=Go_Karts&vxp=mtr&hash=item4843059382

The way I look at it, the carburetors are expecting very low fuel pressure due to the float needles.  They are probably not designed to handle more than 1 or 2 psi before they start leaking by.  Since all vacuum pumps work on the same principle, I would mount this go-kart vacuum fuel pump somewhere on the frame and run it the way the OEM pump would have run which is off the vacuum ports on the intake manifolds. 

$125 for a used Ducati pump, I THINK NOT!

J-Speed Inc.

#11
January 02, 2012, 08:35:10 PM
What I found for $125 was the OEM fuel filter, petcock, and pump.  I think my $16 go-kart vacuum fuel pump should work just as well as the OEM Ducati one, with half the price.  Once I receive the pump and install it, I'll be sure to post the details for anyone else who may experience this problem.

Cloner

#12
January 03, 2012, 08:20:06 AM
I have had one Monster in the shop with an alternate fuel pump that suffered fuel starvation issues.  It ran this pump:



which is a commonly used alternative.

I've had best luck with rebuilding OE units (the kit is CHEAP from Sudco).
Never appeal to a man's "better nature."  He may not have one.  Invoking his self-interest gives you more leverage.  R.A. Heinlein

'64 Ducati Monza 250
'67 Aermacchi/HD Sprint SS (race bike)
'00 Aprilia RSV Mille
'03 Ducati 800 SS (race bike)
'04 KTM 450 EXC
'08 Kawasaki Ninja 250 (race bike)

Howie

#13
January 03, 2012, 02:43:10 PM
QuoteI've had best luck with rebuilding OE units (the kit is CHEAP from Sudco).

J Speed Inc. does not have one to rebuild.

Yep on the Sudco.  It is a genuine Mikuni kit.  DO NOT buy the Winderosa kit unless you would like to eventually turn your vertical cylinder into a giant fuel pump (requires removal of spark plug).  Many have been successful with the rectangular pump.  I wasn't, fuel starvation after a few weeks.   

ducpainter

#14
January 03, 2012, 02:59:39 PM
For my money I'm going with an electric when my factory pump fails.

http://www.yourautopartsstores.com/napa-auto-parts/product/carter-p74029-electric-fuel-pump/B000C01BAQ

That will work...

On line reports have it at 2-3 psi on a car.

http://mgaguru.com/mgtech/fuel/fp201.htm

That article lists several pumps that should work.
"Once you accept that a child on the autistic spectrum experiences the world in
 a completely different way than you, you will be open to understand how that
 perspective
    is even more amazing than yours."
    To realize the value of nine  months:
    Ask a mother who gave birth to a stillborn.
"Don't piss off old people The older we get, the less 'Life in Prison' is a deterrent."


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