School me on Amateur Racing

[ducpainter]

being that i race and coach for a track school i will say that trackdays are way........way......way......more dangerous.  track days consist of people who do 2-4 per year at a given track.  racers are there 5-7 WEEKENDS a year and some of those trackdays.  generally there are more people on the track at a given time on several different levels of bikes and they are grouped, to the best ability of the orgs, into 2-4 groups.  its amazing some of the shit i've seen at trackdays.  this past year i wanted to kill some guy for cutting out of the coned in track exit into me to do 1 more lap, I've also seen people hit the brakes from full 6th gear pinned throttle to go through turn 1 at BIR Long which you do not need to brake for at all this could result in the ultimate 140mph+ ass packing of one's life.  also keep in mind that if you are slower than the rest of the pack you'll be at the back of it by the 2nd turn where there are no other riders to take you out for the plastic trophy, dfl doesn't get a trophy.  Trackdays are a great way to ride in a controlled enviroment and see what you and the bike can do but to dismiss racing for being more dangerous is just plain wrong.

Who dismissed it? Not I.

I disagree with you regarding the relative danger, but I think the OP should definitely do it.

[atomic410]

to each ones own.  hopefully i didn't come accros as being an ass, wasn't my intent

[atomic410]

Thanks for the links zooom!   




BTW, to all of you...
Why isn't there more notoriety in amateur racing (i.e. press, television airings, etc.). It seems like you kind of have to be part of the circle to know what's going on in it. Doesn't anyone want to be more "noticed"?

I'm assuming all of this of course, since I've never been to a race.

Roadracing world is a great website to follow all sorts of racing from amateyr to gp.  I read it daily

[ducpainter]

to each ones own.  hopefully i didn't come accros as being an ass, wasn't my intent

Not at all.

If I was younger and had more money/less responsibility I'd probably give it a go.

Trackdays w/ the provider I work for are the most cost effective/safest way for me to get my fix.

Every situation is different, and I'm sure your experience is as valid as mine.

[atomic410]

word up.  now someone sponsor me a new R1

[fasterblkduc]

I don't come here often anymore but I'll give you my feedback based on my experience. I've race club level for many years and won many expert level championships, Lead instructor at a professional school, and handle the contingency program for the CRA.

Club racing has nothing to offer sponsors to pay contingencies. The U.S. is the only country that even has contingency paying sponsors. There is not enough spectating going on to be worth their money and time. I set up the contingency program each year, and have seen the sponsors pulling out more and more each year lately. I try each year to attract new sponsors for the club, and fight to retain some of the regulars. Bottom line is, it's not even worth the sponsors paying out to racers for podiums because racers don't spend enough with them, and don't attract enough spectators.

Club racers pay for everything out of pocket unless they are creative and ambitious enough to attract personal sponsors. It's very difficult to do this and most racers aren't ambitious enough to market themselves. I've done the work and had seasons where I was getting cash sponsorships and factory level sponsorships from gear and oil companies but it's hard to do and you have to show them that you are giving a R.O.I.

The average club racing career is 2 years because of cost and injuries. Some of us are hooked and become "lifers" after we grid up the first time, but it's rare. I'm not sure what your big "idea" is that you are working on but it sounds like you are thinking of some kind of marketing deal. There is no money in club racing, and I guarantee that someone else has tried whatever it is you're thinking already. Racers race...everyone else tries it on for a minute and they get weeded out pretty quick. The rest of us can never quit, but again, that's rare.

The racers that go on to race Professional are even more rare and the ones to actually make a career out of it are so rare that your chances of being struck by lightning are greater. For the past few years, most of the AMA grid and even a lot of riders in WSBK, MotoGP, etc. are paying for their own rides. They attract personal sponsors to help out but many of them are not even breaking even. Sad but true. This summer I was chatting with Colin Edwards Senior at the TTBC, and I was picking his brain about why wouldn't Colin go back to WSBK instead of racing the new CRT class. He said that even in WSBK, there is no money. You have to stay in MotoGP to get any endorsement money at all. It's sad when you can't even make $$ if you go back to WSBK and kick ass.

As far as the skill levels...the fastest club racers are a small and very talented part of the population that most trackday riders will never be able to comprehend how they go so fast. Those top club level racers are lucky to ever grid up in AMA and normally are running at the back with occasional mid-pack finishes. They are spending approx. $8,000-$10,000 an AMA weekend to finish mid-pack. The racers up front in AMA have been racing since they could walk and are only there because the planets aligned just right for them to find the money, luck, support, etc. to do what they do.

I know this from my personal experience and from knowing many others who have raced or still race professionally. I work with contingency sponsors, instruct new riders getting their race license, Lead instruct at a professional school, and have had a very successful racing career. This career has left me a hole of debt, and a lot of trophies/championships. Racers race. Is there $$ in it? Hell no.
 

[ducpainter]

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

well said.

[The Bearded Duc]

Roadracing world is a great website to follow all sorts of racing from amateyr to gp.  I read it daily

Thanks for the link, I'll take a look at that as well. 

I don't come here often anymore but I'll give you my feedback based on my experience. I've race club level for many years and won many expert level championships, Lead instructor at a professional school, and handle the contingency program for the CRA.

Club racing has nothing to offer sponsors to pay contingencies. The U.S. is the only country that even has contingency paying sponsors. There is not enough spectating going on to be worth their money and time. I set up the contingency program each year, and have seen the sponsors pulling out more and more each year lately. I try each year to attract new sponsors for the club, and fight to retain some of the regulars. Bottom line is, it's not even worth the sponsors paying out to racers for podiums because racers don't spend enough with them, and don't attract enough spectators.

Club racers pay for everything out of pocket unless they are creative and ambitious enough to attract personal sponsors. It's very difficult to do this and most racers aren't ambitious enough to market themselves. I've done the work and had seasons where I was getting cash sponsorships and factory level sponsorships from gear and oil companies but it's hard to do and you have to show them that you are giving a R.O.I.

The average club racing career is 2 years because of cost and injuries. Some of us are hooked and become "lifers" after we grid up the first time, but it's rare. I'm not sure what your big "idea" is that you are working on but it sounds like you are thinking of some kind of marketing deal. There is no money in club racing, and I guarantee that someone else has tried whatever it is you're thinking already. Racers race...everyone else tries it on for a minute and they get weeded out pretty quick. The rest of us can never quit, but again, that's rare.

The racers that go on to race Professional are even more rare and the ones to actually make a career out of it are so rare that your chances of being struck by lightning are greater. For the past few years, most of the AMA grid and even a lot of riders in WSBK, MotoGP, etc. are paying for their own rides. They attract personal sponsors to help out but many of them are not even breaking even. Sad but true. This summer I was chatting with Colin Edwards Senior at the TTBC, and I was picking his brain about why wouldn't Colin go back to WSBK instead of racing the new CRT class. He said that even in WSBK, there is no money. You have to stay in MotoGP to get any endorsement money at all. It's sad when you can't even make $$ if you go back to WSBK and kick ass.

As far as the skill levels...the fastest club racers are a small and very talented part of the population that most trackday riders will never be able to comprehend how they go so fast. Those top club level racers are lucky to ever grid up in AMA and normally are running at the back with occasional mid-pack finishes. They are spending approx. $8,000-$10,000 an AMA weekend to finish mid-pack. The racers up front in AMA have been racing since they could walk and are only there because the planets aligned just right for them to find the money, luck, support, etc. to do what they do.

I know this from my personal experience and from knowing many others who have raced or still race professionally. I work with contingency sponsors, instruct new riders getting their race license, Lead instruct at a professional school, and have had a very successful racing career. This career has left me a hole of debt, and a lot of trophies/championships. Racers race. Is there $$ in it? Hell no.
 

Thanks fasterblkduc, this is very insightful! 
It gives me a better perspective on where the money comes from and how things are paid for. I will definitely keep this in mind moving forward. I don't know that my idea will or will not work out, obviously my fingers are crossed that it does!

[Goat_Herder]

I don't come here often anymore but I'll give you my feedback based on my experience. I've race club level for many years and won many expert level championships, Lead instructor at a professional school, and handle the contingency program for the CRA....

Great insights.  Thanks for sharing your insider view on club racing.

[atomic410]

if you are gonna go racing you need a good back protector and i have a bohn in the gear for sale section.  they are nice for racing because they cover the tailbone in the tuck

[The Bearded Duc]

if you are gonna go racing you need a good back protector and i have a bohn in the gear for sale section.  they are nice for racing because they cover the tailbone in the tuck

Thanks, but I'm not looking to race right right now.