Uh Oh...Noticing all the deficiencies after taking CSS

[xsephirot]

So I just took california superbike school and got to ride their bmw s1000rr. I thought I would still love my bike and convinced myself at the track that I would. But I took her out today and noticed ALL the deficiencies that some of you guys have talked about and/or tried to fix. The brakes are an absolute joke which I had never really noticed, the front end feels way too light and unstable, the wide handlebars and reach combined makes it hard to tuck my knees up into the tank and relax my arms into a turn, the suspension especially the front just wants to dive.

BUT I love the way she looks and sounds. I figured all the money and time spent trying to "fix" or adjust her to the way I would want it that it would be almost cheaper getting a different bike. I know I don't even need to fix her just for the streets but man... I can't describe this feeling, like i'm cheating on my bike =(

[gatorgrizz27]

What bike do you have and what is your weight?  If it is a classic monster and you have adjustable suspension, clip-ons, springs, 4-pad calipers, and a radial master will solve all of those issues pretty easily and cheaply.  S1000RR's are pretty sick though, going to be hard to compete with one ridden at 100%...

[xsephirot]

What bike do you have and what is your weight?  If it is a classic monster and you have adjustable suspension, clip-ons, springs, 4-pad calipers, and a radial master will solve all of those issues pretty easily and cheaply.  S1000RR's are pretty sick though, going to be hard to compete with one ridden at 100%...

I have a s2r 800 and weigh around 140~145. I don't know if I could go the clip on route as many reviews I have read here says it put you way too low for normal street riding. I guess I would do that if I decided to go dedicated track bike. I think if I were to change anything it would definitely be the brakes first. On that s1000rr middle finger and very light braking took  me from 120mph+ down to 60 soo fast, smooth, and predicable.

[Spidey]

You're now picking up on all the stuff that makes a monster not a great bike on the track.  But that's because you were just on the track with a superbike.  If you took an S1000rr on the streets, you'd notice its deficiencies too.   Spend some more time on the road, and you'll notice the monster's good points again.  Brakes can be too touchy, too much weight on the front end can kill you when the road is bumpy, the body position of a supersport can get taxing after a while, great track suspension is harsh on the street, etc, etc. 

That said, there is significant room for improvement on the s2r, espcially with suspension and brakes.  The brakes are not going to compare with an S1000RR, but you don't need that for normal riding. 

Lots of folks go with clip-ons on the classic-styled monsters without feeling like they're too low.

[xsephirot]

Thanks for the points spidey. I guess I will give it a couple of weeks to simmer down my lust haha. Hoping I refind that kindle for the monster other than for its looks and sound.

[RC Fan]

Can you try an S1000RR on the street?  How many other bikes have you tried?  Maybe you are ready for a change?

[PhilB]

The S2R800 did have a budget suspension and brakes.  The brakes in particular can be upgraded pretty easily; I think the 4-piston calipers from other models are a direct bolt-on.

PhilB

[Ak1nza]

I just recently upgraded my S2R800 brakes to the Brembo Goldlines off a S2R1000.  It's a nice relatively inexpensive way to improve the braking system on the bike.  I upgraded to the bigger coffin masters of the 1k as well but everyone here says for the best braking feel go with radial masters.  I picked up my parts off another forum member here and got some Performance Friction pads as well.

It's not going to make your bike stop like a 1000RR but it's definitely an upgrade I recommend. 

[gatorgrizz27]

I have to admit the brakes on the BMW are astonishing, on your monster the 4 pad calipers from a 749/999 and the radial master from a 1098 or newer should help immensely though.  The calipers should run about $250 and the master about $175 used.

[xsephirot]

Can you try an S1000RR on the street?  How many other bikes have you tried?  Maybe you are ready for a change?

Nope just only on the track for 2 days. 2 glorious days haha. Like others have mentioned not sure if I'm ready to jump ship yet as the more aggressive riding position may tire me out much quicker.

I just recently upgraded my S2R800 brakes to the Brembo Goldlines off a S2R1000.  It's a nice relatively inexpensive way to improve the braking system on the bike.  I upgraded to the bigger coffin masters of the 1k as well but everyone here says for the best braking feel go with radial masters.  I picked up my parts off another forum member here and got some Performance Friction pads as well.

It's not going to make your bike stop like a 1000RR but it's definitely an upgrade I recommend. 

Yeah I think I may have to go radials. What confuses me is determining what dimensions and what not for the masters as they provide different amounts of feel/power.

I have to admit the brakes on the BMW are astonishing, on your monster the 4 pad calipers from a 749/999 and the radial master from a 1098 or newer should help immensely though.  The calipers should run about $250 and the master about $175 used.

Hmm, very tempting. I will look into this. Thanks! If I may ask if the guys on the supersports are upgrading their brakes what are they going up to? monoblocks?

[Slide Panda]

If you go to any of the mentioned calipers you'll need the 320mm 10mm offset rotors as well. Common enough, same ones from an S2R1000, M1000, M800, Older 620s 600 400 900 S4, S4R (not S4Rs) and on and on.

When I had it, I upped the brakes on my 620 to the 4 piston 2-pad on 320 rotors like the older 620s and more current (at the time) S2R1000. Made quite a difference.

On my current Monster it's got the caliper and master from a 999 and that's plenty of stopping power. Hell my Ktoom has one radial 4-piston 4-pad caliper on a 320 and pretty cruddy master and will lift the rear.

[xsephirot]

If you go to any of the mentioned calipers you'll need the 320mm 10mm offset rotors as well. Common enough, same ones from an S2R1000, M1000, M800, Older 620s 600 400 900 S4, S4R (not S4Rs) and on and on.

When I had it, I upped the brakes on my 620 to the 4 piston 2-pad on 320 rotors like the older 620s and more current (at the time) S2R1000. Made quite a difference.

On my current Monster it's got the caliper and master from a 999 and that's plenty of stopping power. Hell my Ktoom has one radial 4-piston 4-pad caliper on a 320 and pretty cruddy master and will lift the rear.

So the 759/999 will give me 4 piston 4 pad while the s2r1000 is 4 piston 2 pad? What confuses me the most is all these offsets and whatnot. Is the master on a 1098+ bike that much better than from a 749/999?

[gatorgrizz27]

So the 759/999 will give me 4 piston 4 pad while the s2r1000 is 4 piston 2 pad? What confuses me the most is all these offsets and whatnot. Is the master on a 1098+ bike that much better than from a 749/999?

Correct.  Any of the 320mm rotors with 10mm offset and 6 bolt pattern, which are basically any bike that came with the 3 spoke Brembo wheels rather than the 10 spoke Marchsinis which take a 5 bolt 15mm offset rotor will work.  The 4 piston 4 pad 749/999 calipers are better than the 4 piston 2 pad monster calipers also.  The monster calipers are still a huge upgrade but if you are buying new calipers why not go up 2 levels, the 749/999's are only about $100 more used.  The 15mm superbike rotor offset v the 10mm monster rotor offset is compensated for by the fork mounts, meaning that either calipers will work with no mods or spacers.  The 1098 master supposedly has much better feel than the 999, and also more reliable.  999's have a rep for leaking, and the 1098 masters usually only run about $50 more used.

Not to drag you off to the deep land of crazy mods and custom work where I've ended up, but if you plan on upgrading the suspension as well, you could consider a whole take off frontend from a 749/999 or even better an S4Rt/Hyper/848/1098/Streetfighter.  Awesome fully adjustable forks, radial mount brakes, and a 10 spoke Mrachesini, and the matching rear will bolt straight on with no mods.    The forks just require having your top tripple bored from 50mm to 53mm, an easy job for any machinist, and a 1mm shim on the bottom, and bar risers or clip-ons for clearance.

[xsephirot]

Correct.  Any of the 320mm rotors with 10mm offset and 6 bolt pattern, which are basically any bike that came with the 3 spoke Brembo wheels rather than the 10 spoke Marchsinis which take a 5 bolt 15mm offset rotor will work.  The 4 piston 4 pad 749/999 calipers are better than the 4 piston 2 pad monster calipers also.  The monster calipers are still a huge upgrade but if you are buying new calipers why not go up 2 levels, the 749/999's are only about $100 more used.  The 15mm superbike rotor offset v the 10mm monster rotor offset is compensated for by the fork mounts, meaning that either calipers will work with no mods or spacers.  The 1098 master supposedly has much better feel than the 999, and also more reliable.  999's have a rep for leaking, and the 1098 masters usually only run about $50 more used.

Not to drag you off to the deep land of crazy mods and custom work where I've ended up, but if you plan on upgrading the suspension as well, you could consider a whole take off frontend from a 749/999 or even better an S4Rt/Hyper/848/1098/Streetfighter.  Awesome fully adjustable forks, radial mount brakes, and a 10 spoke Mrachesini, and the matching rear will bolt straight on with no mods.    The forks just require having your top tripple bored from 50mm to 53mm, an easy job for any machinist, and a 1mm shim on the bottom, and bar risers or clip-ons for clearance.

Great thanks for the info grizz! I feel like this is a bad (for my wallet) slippery slope that I may just be about to venture down. If I wanted to go off the deep end I would want to build a clone of a 9 1/2 ducati cafe bike but for pure track.

[Triple J]

Yeah I think I may have to go radials. What confuses me is determining what dimensions and what not for the masters as they provide different amounts of feel/power.

Just go with this:
http://www.yoyodyneti.com/ProductInfo.aspx?productid=110.A263.10

See how it feels and then decide if you need new calipers. You might not. I put one of these on my 748 race bike, and it was all I needed. Go crazy and get the clutch equivalent and you'll have a cool looking set-up as well.