School me on timing

[memper]

So my older brother who races tells me to get a "timing advancer" to eek out a bit more HP. I was under the impression that this type of mod is more for high compression motors. Or can I do it? Is it a worth while mod? If so, any brands to recommend? All I know is that Factory Pro has them as well as Dyna.

[motoxmann]

what's the year/model/engine size of your bike?

[ducpainter]

what's the year/model/engine size of your bike?

Look under his avatar...

I say snake oil.

[koko64]

Doug Lofgren's MPS site and Brad Blacks bikeboy.org sites have good articles on ignition timing. Check 'em out, they are a good education.
With your 750, leave the timing alone unless you really know what you are doing. You generally dont advance maximum timing on high comp big twins. My 900 has hi comp pistons and requires premium fuel and a few degrees less maximum advance, otherwise it will hole a piston. See bikeboy.org.

Do you have plans for your motor?

Many of the timing retard eliminator devices available are to derestrict inline 4 bikes. I have one on my gixxer 750 track bike. The timing on that (with the vicious setting I have) would blow up my Monster!

Depending on your plans for your motor, get advice from a reputable tuning shop for your ignition requirements. If your motor is basically stock, then save your money.

It's useless trying to look for that one "magic bullet" of performance, a performance motor has a carefully selected combination of compatible ingredients.

[memper]

Will give that a read thanks. I have a open airbox and fbf slip ons. Jetting is good. Rear sprocket is a couple teeth over stock. But it still seems to lack that torquey snap that I experienced on my last bike which was an intruder bobber I built (if anyone is interested in seeing it chk out my site: www.variastudios.carbonmade.com
and scroll down to physical design)
Maybe better coils? I dunno, this is my first Ducati, maybe this model is less torquey? It just feels like it needs to wake up a little.
Plz don't tell me to get a 900...I'm poor  

[koko64]

Brad has hotted up a 750. Better cams, heads and compression help, seems to all be in the heads for these motors. I havent worked on a 750, but quite a few forum members have.

[brad black]

the 750 motor is a dog.  get a 900.

how's that for advice you didn't need?

the 750 motor really is a dud.  it's undervalved and has cams that don't do it justice and it sort of had to be that way to not show up the 900 (like the 800 does), but the lack of a 6th buries it for me.  i hotted one up (bought a motor specifically to fit to my m600 and do it) because no one had ever asked me to and i was curious.  it's not a bad motor as it stands now, but a 900 with similar mods would be much better, and the 900 is more durable bottom end wise.

the ca cycleworks coils help with low speed and cold running, but not performance outright.

[motoxmann]

while on the topic, are the chassis arrangements/dimensions identical for the 99-00 600/750/900? ie: can these 3 motors be swapped around without any modifications?

[ducpainter]

while on the topic, are the chassis arrangements/dimensions identical for the 99-00 600/750/900? ie: can these 3 motors be swapped around without any modifications?

Yes...except some of the later engines had larger motor mount bolts 12mm as opposed to 10 I think...easy mod.

Most 2V FI motors will also fit.

[carbmon]

...it still seems to lack that torquey snap that I experienced on my last bike which was an intruder bobber .....Plz don't tell me to get a 900...I'm poor  

I'm not about to disagree with Brad's basic characterization of the 750, I think that is well substantiated by the experience of others, too.

But, IMHO my carbie 750 is much more responsive to the throttle with the swap to a slightly lighter flywheel and 39mm FCR carbs.  Significant reduction of rotating mass at the wheels helped in this regard, too  (see my mods in my sigline).

Please understand I'm not suggesting that these mods increased horsepower or torque, simply that these mods allow the engine to rev quicker in response to throttle inputs ("snappier" response, if you will).  I think it is accurate to say my bike is much "quicker" but no "faster" with these mods.

No, I do not think that the same result can be achieved through juking with the timing.  I do have Dyna coils but as I made incremental changes to my bike I don't believe that mod affected responsiveness measureably.

Would it be cheaper to shop for a 900 take-out for your chassis?  Quite likely.

[koko64]

Light flywheel and FCRs would give more pep for sure. Exacrfit coils smoothen things out down low.
You know, used 900 heads come up now and again for half the price of FCRs.
So light flywheel, 900 cams and valves, open airbox and tuned carbs would  liven things up.
It could be done over time when good deals came up.

[memper]

Thanks guys for all the input. I'm ok with the top speed. I had her at a bit over 90 and thats ok by me. But I do more inner city riding and love to romp that throttle. I like the low end snap (which this bike clearly is snoozing on). Soooo because I cant afford a complete 900, I will keep my eye out for just the engine or even just the heads and go from there.
I appreciate the schooling.

[motoxmann]

factoryPro jet kit woke my 750 up nicely in the low and midrange, especially in the throttle response department.
the octane fuel you use will also make a difference. I run 89 in mine. a lot of people actually run 87. higher octane than what is necessary will usually make it run a bit smoother and cooler, but also weaker. if you run 91 or higher octane, and the timing is set to the stock setting, I would try 89 octane and see how it does

[Ddan]

Thanks guys for all the input. I'm ok with the top speed. I had her at a bit over 90 and thats ok by me. But I do more inner city riding and love to romp that throttle. I like the low end snap (which this bike clearly is snoozing on). Soooo because I cant afford a complete 900, I will keep my eye out for just the engine or even just the heads and go from there.
I appreciate the schooling.

If you're just looking for low-end fun change the gearing.  Down one tooth in the front and up 3-4 in the rear will wake it up.

[carbmon]

... You know, used 900 heads come up now and again for half the price of FCRs.
So light flywheel, 900 cams and valves, open airbox and tuned carbs would  liven things up.
It could be done over time when good deals came up.

Have to be careful to ensure those are the big-valve 900 heads/cams, not the somewhat more commonly available small-valve version (which is essentially what his 750 has now), is that correct?