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ExploSafe causing a short somewhere by the fuel pump?

Started by stopintime, December 30, 2012, 03:27:45 PM

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stopintime

December 30, 2012, 03:27:45 PM
Race regulations require me to fill my plastic tank with some kind of fire inhibitor - foam or ExploSafe.

Since foam steals fuel capacity I was thinking ExploSafe, but have been told it can cause a short somewhere by the fuel pump...

Any experience?
252,000 km/seventeen years - loving it

ducpainter

#1
December 30, 2012, 03:39:19 PM
Not here. :-\
"Once you accept that a child on the autistic spectrum experiences the world in
 a completely different way than you, you will be open to understand how that
 perspective
    is even more amazing than yours."
    To realize the value of nine  months:
    Ask a mother who gave birth to a stillborn.
"Don't piss off old people The older we get, the less 'Life in Prison' is a deterrent."


stopintime

#2
December 30, 2012, 03:59:40 PM
I regret not studying the fuel pump better when it was out last winter.

Maybe it's the fuel level sensor (thermistor) - AFAIK it's exposed to gas and is somehow electric (?)
252,000 km/seventeen years - loving it

ducpainter

#3
December 30, 2012, 04:19:40 PM
Quote from: stopintime on December 30, 2012, 03:59:40 PM
I regret not studying the fuel pump better when it was out last winter.

Maybe it's the fuel level sensor (thermistor) - AFAIK it's exposed to gas and is somehow electric (?)
My understanding is the late model fuel level sensors are not thermistors, but a float type rheostat.

The explosafe site doesn't really tell how it works.
"Once you accept that a child on the autistic spectrum experiences the world in
 a completely different way than you, you will be open to understand how that
 perspective
    is even more amazing than yours."
    To realize the value of nine  months:
    Ask a mother who gave birth to a stillborn.
"Don't piss off old people The older we get, the less 'Life in Prison' is a deterrent."


stopintime

#4
December 30, 2012, 05:29:38 PM
The ExploSafe is made of aluminum. Looks like small balls of lathe/mill (?) shavings and is sold by the liter.

The SBK guys having issues with it talked about a short somewhere at the pump, but the symptoms of a confused fuel level sensor would be the same - engine suddenly stalling.

Maybe alu touching the thermistor could cause this. My parts catalog describes it as a thermistor, but I don't know if that's what's in there. Truth be told I don't know a thermistor or a rheostat is either...
252,000 km/seventeen years - loving it

ducpainter

#5
December 30, 2012, 05:38:02 PM
I don't understand how it would be different from foam with regard to fuel capacity.

You're adding a volume of material to the tank which will reduce capacity in either case, unless you need a very small volume of the explosafe to work...

where is the benefit?

How long are these races anyway?
"Once you accept that a child on the autistic spectrum experiences the world in
 a completely different way than you, you will be open to understand how that
 perspective
    is even more amazing than yours."
    To realize the value of nine  months:
    Ask a mother who gave birth to a stillborn.
"Don't piss off old people The older we get, the less 'Life in Prison' is a deterrent."


stopintime

#6
December 30, 2012, 05:53:37 PM
First: the metal tank (only checked the S4R) has a different sensor which I think has some kind of coil inside. My S2R has another sensor - an open thermistor/thingy - it slides into the base of the fuel pump assembly. I remember seeing it and it can be contacted by ExploSafe, but I don't know if that is my potential problem.

I can't see how a short would play out... In my limited experience, a short can cause sparks  :o

The ExploSafe steals somewhere around .2 liters. The foam can hold a liter or two, but I haven't been able to get precise numbers. It's my bike's touring duties that will suffer. 
252,000 km/seventeen years - loving it

Speeddog

#7
December 31, 2012, 05:19:10 PM
It appears that the Explosafe is an aluminum foil mesh.

It inhibits the flame front physically, and absorbs the combustion heat.
Evidently to an extent that the explosion can't propagate.

IIRC, there are uninsulated connectors or wiring on the plastic tank fuel pump/flange assemblies.
But I've not looked at one in a while...

What about a 'race' tank and a 'street' tank?
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(951) 640-8908

~~~ "We've rearranged the deck chairs, refilled the champagne glasses, and the band sounds great. This is fine." - Alberto Puig ~~~

ungeheuer

#8
January 04, 2013, 11:22:08 PM
Quote from: Speeddog on December 31, 2012, 05:19:10 PM
It appears that the Explosafe is an aluminum foil mesh.

It inhibits the flame front physically, and absorbs the combustion heat.
Evidently to an extent that the explosion can't propagate.
Thats my understanding of Explosafe too.  When installed it looks like chook-wire inside your tank.

Quote from: Speeddog on December 31, 2012, 05:19:10 PMWhat about a 'race' tank and a 'street' tank?
^^ This IMO is the solution  [thumbsup].
Ducati 1100S Monster + Ducati 1260S Multistrada + Moto Guzzi Griso 1200SE

Previously: Ducati1200SMultistradaDucatiMonster696DucatiSD900MotoMorini31/2

stopintime

#9
January 05, 2013, 02:49:28 AM
...still need to solve the exposed wires / sensor issue  [coffee]
252,000 km/seventeen years - loving it

ungeheuer

#10
January 05, 2013, 05:36:19 AM
Quote from: stopintime on January 05, 2013, 02:49:28 AM
...still need to solve the exposed wires / sensor issue  [coffee]
Foam?  In the who-gives-a-shit-about-lost-capacity race tank?

Ducati 1100S Monster + Ducati 1260S Multistrada + Moto Guzzi Griso 1200SE

Previously: Ducati1200SMultistradaDucatiMonster696DucatiSD900MotoMorini31/2

ducpainter

#11
January 05, 2013, 05:39:24 AM
Quote from: ungeheuer on January 05, 2013, 05:36:19 AM
Foam?  In the who-gives-a-shit-about-lost-capacity race tank?


Quote from: stopintime on December 30, 2012, 05:53:37 PM
First: the metal tank (only checked the S4R) has a different sensor which I think has some kind of coil inside. My S2R has another sensor - an open thermistor/thingy - it slides into the base of the fuel pump assembly. I remember seeing it and it can be contacted by ExploSafe, but I don't know if that is my potential problem.

I can't see how a short would play out... In my limited experience, a short can cause sparks  :o

The ExploSafe steals somewhere around .2 liters. The foam can hold a liter or two, but I haven't been able to get precise numbers. It's my bike's touring duties that will suffer. 
"Once you accept that a child on the autistic spectrum experiences the world in
 a completely different way than you, you will be open to understand how that
 perspective
    is even more amazing than yours."
    To realize the value of nine  months:
    Ask a mother who gave birth to a stillborn.
"Don't piss off old people The older we get, the less 'Life in Prison' is a deterrent."


stopintime

#12
January 05, 2013, 07:33:24 AM
Quote from: ungeheuer on January 05, 2013, 05:36:19 AM
Foam?  In the who-gives-a-shit-about-lost-capacity race tank?


True, but there are two/three deciding factors: low budget, minimal prep and the fun of 'race what you brung'.

I imagine it to be a lot more fun to finish mid pack on a bike that shouldn't be competitive than to get a podium on a race prep'ed SBK. I plan to show up on my bike with a few tools in a back pack, tape off lights, zip tie side stand, warm up the street sport tires in the parking lot and have some Desmo fun.
252,000 km/seventeen years - loving it

Raux

#13
January 05, 2013, 08:43:43 AM Last Edit: January 05, 2013, 08:45:49 AM by Raux
second solution is a secondary tank with foam for racing.
300-400 on ebay right now
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