Heads rebuilt-Runs like nothing happened

Started by DesmoTillDeath, April 11, 2014, 06:21:16 PM

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DesmoTillDeath

Hello all,

So my princess of a grundle rumbler has struck again.
I just got my heads back from Speeddog and they are completely rebuilt.
I installed them with all the proper procedures in mind and torqued everything back down and took her for a spin.
The beast runs terrible still. Just as bad as when it had worn rocker arms and a cracked exhaust valve and a broken exhaust stud.

I'm thinking it is an issue with the ECU or fuel system.
I'm hoping to get down to Southern Cal Motorcycles for a trim adjustment next week.

There seems to be a loss of power, rough running, popping and backfiring under engine braking, especially at lower RPMs. And upon cold start up theres a "chug" noise that happens twice as the bike tries to start. Almost noises like a hiccup.

If anyone can think of anything that might be the culprit i'm all eyes.

-injectors
-throttle body sync
-ecu
-spark timing
?
'01 900D: open airbox, K&N filter, termi slipon high mounts, Barnett lightweight clutch basket, 12VDC accessory port

'01 m900: Project; tail chop, raised seat pan, 999 tank, clipons, 900SS front upper half fairing, ST2 footpegs

'71 BSA B25T: Fully restored (custom). Clubman bars. POS

Monsterlover

"The Vincent was like a bullet that went straight; the Ducati is like the magic bullet in Dallas that went sideways and hit JFK and the Governor of Texas at the same time."--HST    **"A man who works with his hands is a laborer.  A man who works with his hands and his brain is a craftsman.  A man who works with his hands, brains, and heart is an artist."  -Louis Nizer**

brad black

what is the cranking compression?
how much leakdown?
how much fuel pressure?
battery charging voltage?
voltage at coils and injectors?
Brad The Bike Boy

http://www.bikeboy.org

DesmoTillDeath

Brand new NGK plugs.

How do I test fuel pressure?
'01 900D: open airbox, K&N filter, termi slipon high mounts, Barnett lightweight clutch basket, 12VDC accessory port

'01 m900: Project; tail chop, raised seat pan, 999 tank, clipons, 900SS front upper half fairing, ST2 footpegs

'71 BSA B25T: Fully restored (custom). Clubman bars. POS

brad black

Brad The Bike Boy

http://www.bikeboy.org

DesmoTillDeath

Okay heres what I got:

Cranking compression:           ~100psi both cylinders
Leak down:                         No audible leak. Used the Harbor Freight leak down tester setup and it read less than 5% leak.
Battery charging voltage:      I ran the bike at ~4000 rpm and the battery read 13.6VDC.
Coil voltages:                      Running the bike at idle both read ~3VDC each.
Fuel pressure:                     Didn't check the recommended operating pressure before buying gauge. Gauge only went to 15psi and It was pinned while bike was running.
Injector voltage:                  Not totally sure how to measure this.

What else are we thinking?
Maybe the injector/spark timing it off.
A trim adjustment is needed but I dont think it would run this bad if that was the only issue.
'01 900D: open airbox, K&N filter, termi slipon high mounts, Barnett lightweight clutch basket, 12VDC accessory port

'01 m900: Project; tail chop, raised seat pan, 999 tank, clipons, 900SS front upper half fairing, ST2 footpegs

'71 BSA B25T: Fully restored (custom). Clubman bars. POS

koko64

How'd you check cranking compression?
Warm motor, throttle Wide open?
2015 Scrambler 800

DesmoTillDeath

Quote from: koko64 on April 20, 2014, 10:04:42 PM
How'd you check cranking compression?
Warm motor, throttle Wide open?

Exactly
'01 900D: open airbox, K&N filter, termi slipon high mounts, Barnett lightweight clutch basket, 12VDC accessory port

'01 m900: Project; tail chop, raised seat pan, 999 tank, clipons, 900SS front upper half fairing, ST2 footpegs

'71 BSA B25T: Fully restored (custom). Clubman bars. POS

Ddan

2000 Monster 900Sie, a few changes
1992 900 SS, currently a pile of parts.  Now running
                    flogged successfully  NHMS  12 customized.  Twice.   T3 too.   Now retired.

Ducati Monster Forum at
www.ducatimonsterforum.org

Howie

Compression numbers and cylinder leakage don't seem to agree with each other.  5% is good, 100PSI is not.  I suspect either one gauge is off or valve timing off a bit if you have adjustable pullys.

DesmoTillDeath

I have the stock pulleys which do have slots for adjustment.
Does anyone have a source for the timing procedure?? I can't seem to find it in the Haynes Manual.

Otherwise that might be pricey at the shop.

Compression should be around 160psi correct?
'01 900D: open airbox, K&N filter, termi slipon high mounts, Barnett lightweight clutch basket, 12VDC accessory port

'01 m900: Project; tail chop, raised seat pan, 999 tank, clipons, 900SS front upper half fairing, ST2 footpegs

'71 BSA B25T: Fully restored (custom). Clubman bars. POS

koko64

Round about that, say even 150 according to Haynes. For reference I've seen 150 in a 750, 160 in a 900, 190 with hi comp and 200 with hi comp big bore.
2015 Scrambler 800

Speeddog

Cranking compression should be somewhere close to 150 or so.

Fuel pressure should be 45psi.

I wouldn't put much meaning on HF Leakdown numbers.
- - - - - Valley Desmo Service - - - - -
Reseda, CA

(951) 640-8908


~~~ "We've rearranged the deck chairs, refilled the champagne glasses, and the band sounds great. This is fine." - Alberto Puig ~~~

DesmoTillDeath

So I found this article:

http://www.ducati-upnorth.com/tech/camtiming.php

I'm not sure If this is what I should be looking into but its a start.
Id be willing to get this looked at at a garage but its my only vehicle and thus tough to let go for extended periods of time.

This is also an interesting article:

http://www.ducatitech.com/2v/maint/rebuild/headwork.html
'01 900D: open airbox, K&N filter, termi slipon high mounts, Barnett lightweight clutch basket, 12VDC accessory port

'01 m900: Project; tail chop, raised seat pan, 999 tank, clipons, 900SS front upper half fairing, ST2 footpegs

'71 BSA B25T: Fully restored (custom). Clubman bars. POS

Speeddog

I'd say there's a fundamental problem.

Small adjustments to cam timing or port work to improve airflow aren't going to solve the problem.

Did you get a fuel pressure reading?
- - - - - Valley Desmo Service - - - - -
Reseda, CA

(951) 640-8908


~~~ "We've rearranged the deck chairs, refilled the champagne glasses, and the band sounds great. This is fine." - Alberto Puig ~~~