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Author Topic: So I started thinkin' about getting a different bike .......  (Read 12114 times)
diamonddog-2
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« on: June 25, 2022, 11:08:26 AM »

Earlier last winter I started dreaming of a newer, more powerful Monster. I was looking for a more current Duc model with a bit more power and maybe some tech upgrades to replace the 2001 900s. I was looking at a few models: S4R/S, 1100S and the 1100Evo. Nothing so new as to be out of my price range but new enough.  I found a 2012 1100Evo that was priced right and in really good shape.  I had it dropped off at one of the local Duc mechanic's shop that knows me and my limited wrenching skills....  Roll Eyes  Our agreement was that I could work on it while under "adult supervision" and make some modifications, all while getting to know my new ride.  Anthony would give me direction and help me out as needed.
I had been in touch with koko64 about his experience with different Monsters and the 1100Evo specifically. He had given me a few places to source for the airbox modification [ https://www.ducati-kaemna.de/monster-796-1100-pure-tec-race-kit.html] as well as a mid-pipe/exhaust valve replacement from QD exhaust. I put a few other parts on my wish list but really tried to dial back my OCD behavior that manifested itself with my 2001 M900s project.  Trying to keep it simple this time.   I opted for a Spark C.F. high mount exhaust in addition to the Competition Werkes tail tidy /turn signal/brake lights kit and CRG bar end mounted mirrors. Obligatory fork/frame sliders, tank grips, tank protector as well as a lithium battery.  A Power Command V was also installed in anticipation of later tuning.
I found enough time to make the drive to the shop 1 or 2 days a week for 4 or 5 hours at a time.  I was very appreciative of the opportunity to work on it at Anthony's shop, using his tools, getting the benefit of his experience and upping my understanding of how my bike works and gets serviced. Just taking the tank off to access the battery was an eye-opener.
In the course of getting into the project we figured out the bike had received a full desmo service @ 15K miles but had only 400 miles put on it since the 2019 service.  Good to know.   We still went through the bike but without a valve/belt service. 
I got to watch the forks being serviced too. The 26mm valves were VERY close the Ohlins design that had been considered as a replacement for OEM, so those seemed okay. The shim stacks just looked to be in need of an adjustment to move the oil a bit more freely.
Everything was gone through, looked at, adjusted if needed, flushed and refilled, etc.
 I finally got to take it out for a spin when bringing it to the tuner, Doug Lofgren.  It was highway all the way there but the
He quickly realized the Siemens ECU would allow limited access to the AFR tuning range. Doug and koko64 had some back and forth on how the lower rpm map might be accessed or maybe try a work-around.  In the end Doug tried running the bike with a different [fatter?] set of 18mm O2 sensors but wasn't happy with the overall results. The other areas of the map were out of balance. He tuned it for 3 hours on his dyno and gave it back to me, saying here's the chart, go have fun. 
So far, I have nothing to complain about. It's just a tad rough at lower rpm is all I've been able to notice so far.  It spins up like crazy to redline in 1st and 2nd and pulls like a mother effer.
I'll hang onto the current Michelin Power Pilot tires for the season but will likely get back to Pirelli next season. The suspension feels just great so far but will see if I feel the same as miles are put on it.  I'm still getting familiar with the ABS and traction control settings.
The exhaust is running without the db killers and sends grown men running, crying out to their mommies when the throttle gets opened up. Well, not really but it does sound wicked.
Seriously it SHOULD be named the 1100Evil the way it sounds and rides. Pretty nasty for the last 2 valve model Monster. 
Anyway, somebody stop me next time my mind starts to wander......  Grin
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2001 M900S   2002 Aero 1100   2012 1100 EVO

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« Reply #1 on: June 25, 2022, 11:51:21 AM »

I won't be the one stopping you  Dolph
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koko64
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« Reply #2 on: June 25, 2022, 01:52:59 PM »

An apex model of the line for sure.

Having ridden a few MTS1100's with the 1100DS motor, the motor comparison between the Marelli ECU DS and Evo is like the difference between a Subaru Liberty and WRX STI. Someone has also suggested the earlier DS 1100 Monster motor with the quick thinking Seimens Conti ECU is like the WRX while the Evo is the STI.

The lighter internals, higher compression and hotter cams of the Evo give a nasty engine character. With stock EPA mapping they can run a bit ragged at lower rpm/throttle openings. Flywheel weight can be useful at times (or an impediment at others Evil).
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« Reply #3 on: June 26, 2022, 01:30:29 AM »

Enjoy your 1100EVO  Dolph

The second best of the last of the 2 valve Monsters  Wink
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« Reply #4 on: June 26, 2022, 02:55:33 AM »

Fightin' words right there. laughingdp
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« Reply #5 on: June 26, 2022, 02:56:52 AM »

Fightin' words right there. laughingdp
Grin
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Charlie98
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« Reply #6 on: June 26, 2022, 06:59:51 AM »

Noob question of the week:

What makes the Evo different from the plain vanilla 2v air-cooled Monsters of the same era... like my '13 796 ABS?
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Dennis

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« Reply #7 on: June 26, 2022, 11:10:29 AM »

Noob question of the week:

What makes the Evo different from the plain vanilla 2v air-cooled Monsters of the same era... like my '13 796 ABS?
... in the 1100cc capacity: Dual spark vs single spark EVO.  Siemens ECU vs Marelli ECU (IIRC) on EVO?  EVO has the newer style "rams horns" exhaust routing  vomit laughingdp.  Traditional dry clutch on M1100  Cool, wet clutch on EVO.  Different footrest hangers - EVO much nicer than the chicken wings on 696/796/non-EVO 1100...  Different fork suppliers...  Showa for M1100, Ohlins for M1100S.   Marzocchi?? for EVO??  

And some engine internal differences that I'll let Koko64 bore you with....
« Last Edit: June 26, 2022, 11:23:01 AM by ungeheuer » Logged

Ducati 1100S Monster Ducati 1260ST Multistrada + Moto Guzzi Griso 1200SE


Previously: Ducati1200SMultistradaDucatiMonster696DucatiSD900MotoMorini31/2
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« Reply #8 on: June 26, 2022, 12:14:45 PM »

He Man once posted a pic of 1100DS and 1100Evo motors with the outer engine cases removed. The Evos flywheel, timing and primary gears were machined down and drilled for lightness. The Evo has a lighter alternator and I read that it has a lighter crankshaft, but not seen a comparison. The cams, ports and combustion chamber were changed on the Evo. Evo cams have more duration and lift but they aren't hot like ST2 or 900ie cams. Evo has more compression in the 11:1+ range. The Evo forks are Marzocchi. M1100DS and Evo have the quick thinking Seimens Conti ECU compared to the MTS Marelli. The manual says Siemens EFI but the ECUs have a Continental label on them. Subsidiary?
I can't say what common components are shared with the 796 motors. The Evo cams have more lift and duration, but the greater engine capacity supports that. Externally the bikes do look very similar.
The Evo motor is a last hurrah before Euro 4 or 5 killed tuned big bore air cooled motors. I note that the detuned 1100 Scrambler has a factory claimed hp similar to my old modified M900's rwhp. 
Imo, the M1100 and Evos stock exhaust look only so so, but both look great with Termis.
« Last Edit: June 26, 2022, 12:48:28 PM by koko64 » Logged

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Charlie98
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« Reply #9 on: June 26, 2022, 03:01:40 PM »

I kind of wondered.  I initially thought it was water cooling, but I was completely wrong on that.  I know the easy way to tell is the exhaust... which I'm not a big fan of.

FWIW, my 796 has the Continental (Siemens) ECU, the ABS may have required that.  They also cheaped out with my front forks... they were supposed to be adjustable, it even says so in the manual, but they are most definitely NOT adjustable.

I'm happy as a pig in slop that I have a 2v air-cooled Monster... although I won't lie, I envy you guys with the 1100's...   waytogo
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Dennis

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« Reply #10 on: June 27, 2022, 04:34:27 AM »

I do love the brutality of the 1100 motor. There's a sense of old school performance like a tuned old V8.
Yet people who ride my Evo comment on how smooth it is (it's carefully tuned), but now and then it surprises me with wheel spin and wheelies. I have the traction control on the minimum setting which allows controlled spin before the system catches it. On setting #1, the bike can spin up a little while upright or transitioning through a roundabout in the dry, its good fun with some protection.
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« Reply #11 on: June 27, 2022, 05:57:04 AM »

Wait?  What?    T r a c t i o n   control? 
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« Reply #12 on: June 27, 2022, 08:12:40 AM »

Wait?  What?    T r a c t i o n   control? 

No no no  Huh?
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« Reply #13 on: June 27, 2022, 04:26:59 PM »

 laughingdp
Traction control and ABS can be turned off. I keep the TC on the minimum and ride like its not there. I do like ABS due to the deteriorating state of our roads here. The loss of grip under braking on damaged tarmac is more of an issue than wet roads. Returning from riding in Italy in 2019 highlighted how bad Melbourne drivers are and emergency braking on crap roads in a wine region....
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« Reply #14 on: June 29, 2022, 04:43:30 AM »

Took the GLW on the Evo for the first time today. I was sure she would be uncomfortable or be thrown off. How wrong was I. She was much more comfortable than on the 750 with its custom seat and lowered pillion pegs. None of the usual hip, knee and sciatic pain. Outrageous. I haven't even fitted the lower pegs yet. I was looking to sell one of my bikes and was sure the Evo would go, but it stays. Shots
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