My Glock 34 and 35 have factory 3-3.5lb triggers and are very nice indeed... at least for a trigger pull on a Glock. But I don't think I would do a trigger bar swap on my 19 as a carry gun. I'm fine with it as is. That being said I am a 1911 guy at heart and many of mine have had some aftermarket gunsmithing work or came straight from Les Baer or Wilson with "light" triggers. Still, I wouldn't hesitate to use one in self defense and certainly wouldn't be concerned about what some Asst. DA would try to do to me in court. I just tend to use the cheap stock Glock 19 more... for carry use that is.

Quote from: Statler on July 28, 2010, 11:43:25 AM
Anything on the civil side, 'tiz?

Far more difficult to search that, Shepherd's only tracks statutory and case cite. 

The same sort of problems exist for a civil suit, though, even more so.  Given that the P's attorney would have to somehow have access to the firearm, pay an expert to examine it, etc.

If someone subpoenaed a firearm for evidence, I would be very surprised if it didn't show up pristine and just as it came from the factory.

Aside from the legal merits or issues of lightening a trigger for self defense, when you are in the middle of an adrenalin dump,tunnel vision, and chaos, your fine motor control skills go away.  Having a gun go off at an inopportune time is not a good thing, especially while holding someone at gunpoint.  That takes you from a justified shooting to being charged with manslaughter or worse.  Even shooting a stressful IPSC match or high dollar pin shoot can cause you get a little aggressive on the trigger and cause an oops.  I know its happened to me at matches a time or two - with some of my slicked up 1911's.  I had Jimmy Clark build my wife a 9mm Commander and the trigger is exquisite, but too lite for social work.  I set up another Commander frame with a standard trigger for carry for her. 

I am a big fan of excellent, light triggers on most of my competition guns, (My smallbore rifle is around 2.5 oz) but social stuff should be a little heavier IMHO.

Really good point. Well said WarrenJ.

I love my groovy high speed low drag 1911s for sure and would be happy to use them as carry guns (and I have done that many times) but the cheap reliable stock G-19 will "get er dun" just fine. Remember, if use a firearm in self defense you will loose it for a while to the police first then the DA's office if charges are filed. You will only get it back if charges are dropped, you are no-billed/not indicted by a Grand Jury or found not guilty in a trial before a Judge or jury. And you have to go through a nice hassle to get it back. Oh, you'll get it. They'll just make it some what difficult.

My theory is to have two of whatever it is a use for self defense. You get into an altercation and have your weapon seized then you always have it's twin to use in the interim. That's my "excuse" for having extra guns and my wife believes it!!

even more than that, fastwin, I'd expect to be arrested, jailed, potentially fight a criminal charge, definitely fight a civil suit later, go broke on legal defense, need counseling and therapy, have marital problems....

but be alive.

last resort.

Quote from: Statler on July 28, 2010, 03:12:36 PM
even more than that, fastwin, I'd expect to be arrested, jailed, potentially fight a criminal charge, definitely fight a civil suit later, go broke on legal defense, need counseling and therapy, have marital problems....

but be alive.

last resort.

You forgot to mention the need to hire a high-rolling attorney.  One who happens to think that froo-froo white is actually fast.  

the only rolling I do is into gravel traps.

^
bad place to look for clients

Quote from: Monsterlover on July 28, 2010, 03:46:32 PM
^
bad place to look for clients

best place to chase an ambulance is from inside

Quote from: Statler on July 28, 2010, 03:30:34 PM
the only rolling I do is into gravel traps.

Better than a lowside, right?


(note: I am too much of a wimp to track my bike(s))


Question for the lawyers:

Obviously state law differs and not asking for legal advice as I wouldn't open carry because I don't have the training to protect my weapon in a confrontation.


I can conceal carry a gun with my permit. Open carry does not fall under this and is legal without a permit.

But yet.......open carry is not advisable as you can be arrested/ticketed for this under certain laws as "insighting panic" etc.

Is that common in most states or is Ohio backwards?

the NRA has pretty good info on different states.  Anyone here would just be copying info from there so it's a good place to start looking at differences.

Years ago I got stopped by a New Mexico State Trooper for speeding on a small two lane road heading to my family's cabin outside Cimarron, NM. I had an IPSC sticker on the rear window of my Suburban and actually had an IPSC t-shirt on at the time. I noticed the trooper had a cocked and locked 1911 as his sidearm and said to him that I didn't think many law enforcement agencies allowed that due to liability issues (ie: lack of single action auto training).

He saw the IPSC sticker and t-shirt and asked if I had competed in the recent IPSC Regional event at the NRA Whittington Center in nearby Raton, NM. I hadn't but knew about it. We shot the shit for awhile about shooting and I asked him about the carry license situation in NM. It was new in TX at the time and I wasn't sure about NM. In fact I hid my carry gun, unloaded in the back of my car out of concern. That's when he told me about the NM open carry law and that NM considers your vehicle part of your "home" and allows you to carry concealed in your vehicle. I think since then they have passed a comprehensive carry bill. First time I have ever been in a state with open carry. He said it was law but rarely no one did it. I certainly wasn't going to test the waters!

Long story short... yeah I got the damn ticket! I was sure he would let me go after the bonding gun talk but his damn rookie training officer got out of their car and walked up probably wondering why we were talking so long. Out came the ticket book to make her happy!! Bingo, big buck speeding ticket when I was sure I was on easy street with this trooper!! Oh well...

Quote from: WarrenJ on July 28, 2010, 01:18:23 PM
Aside from the legal merits or issues of lightening a trigger for self defense, when you are in the middle of an adrenalin dump,tunnel vision, and chaos, your fine motor control skills go away.  Having a gun go off at an inopportune time is not a good thing, especially while holding someone at gunpoint.  That takes you from a justified shooting to being charged with manslaughter or worse.  Even shooting a stressful IPSC match or high dollar pin shoot can cause you get a little aggressive on the trigger and cause an oops.  I know its happened to me at matches a time or two - with some of my slicked up 1911's.  I had Jimmy Clark build my wife a 9mm Commander and the trigger is exquisite, but too lite for social work.  I set up another Commander frame with a standard trigger for carry for her. 

I am a big fan of excellent, light triggers on most of my competition guns, (My smallbore rifle is around 2.5 oz) but social stuff should be a little heavier IMHO.

Ah, there is NOTHING like a true single action trigger.  I have been wanting to build a 1911 in 38 super for years now, but they are just so damn expensive.  Any chance you could post some pics of the rifle you use for smallbore?

Quote from: Statler on July 28, 2010, 03:30:34 PM
the only rolling I do is into gravel traps.

Quote from: Monsterlover on July 28, 2010, 03:46:32 PM
^
bad place to look for clients

He found me....

of course I stiffed him on the fee.