Idle thoughts...

[duc_fan]

So I've been thinking... (always dangerous)

I have two GTIs and an SUV.  Erica's little roadster will be joining the garage at the end of March, pushing one of the GTIs out.  I had also been thinking that I need to get rid of a vehicle, anyway, just because I don't have the time for all three of my cages plus the SS.

I'd been trying to figure out which GTI to part with for months now.  The '86 is not really in sale-able condition as it sits, at least not for much money.  The '98 VR6... well, crap, I just put a grand in wheels and tires on it last fall (17" Audi TT "Fat Fives").  The thought of taking a monetary bath on either of them literally makes me sick to my stomach, but something needs to happen.  No money to finish the '86 right now (paying off the Durango, just bought an engagement ring, paying for honeymoon, etc), so something has to be sold, or one of them is getting parked outside and will do nothing but degrade.

So I had a thought last weekend... get rid of both for whatever I can get for them (I have this huge hangup about the monetary hosing I'm going to take, so this will be tough to do).  In order to ease my suffering, and still have a more economical commuter car than the Durango for when the weather is good, I should get something fun.  Rear-wheel drive.  Decent balance.  Preferably small and light, but doesn't have to be.  Reasonably easy to work on would be nice, too (no twin-turbo Audi V6s, regardless of how much I like the S4).  Soooo..... I'm looking for suggestions.

Needs to stay under 10 grand.

Cars I've thought of:

1972-1974 Alfa Romeo spider (wanted one of these even before I had my license)

Triumph GT6+

Triumph TR6

old Porsche 911

Late 80's Porsche 944

late 90's BMW Z3

E30 BMW with some variation of sport package/equipment (E30 325is, E30 M3, etc)


As you can tell, performance is not my top priority... I'm looking for something fun, rear-wheel drive, and reasonably economical to operate.  Suggestions?  Oh, and I know I fit in a Z3, but not a Miata (I've tried both of 'em on).

If Erica's Sky was a manual transmission I might be looking for something more practical, like a sporting sedan.  But... I drove her little roadster and was underwhelmed... that car NEEDS a manual transmission DESPERATELY.  Now I feel the need for a sporting rear-wheel-drive car with a proper clutch and manual gearbox (as it was meant to be).  If a Sky Redline with a manual was available nearby (and remotely affordable on trade), I'd be seriously trying to convince her to trade up.

Oh yeah, this is still in the "thought experiment" stage, not the "go out and drop 10 grand next weekend" stage.

Fire away...

[INFIDEL]

Fiero.

I learned recently that not only is the Fiero exact dimensions to scale but also the exact performance/weight ratio of the Ferrari . . . ummmm . . . the Magnum PI one . . .

And it'd be a lot less expensive and easily mechanicalized with.

[bnbmike]

Car and Driver just did a story on the top 911's of the past 20 years, saw it on the news stand in Feb.  911's are good cars, just don't get any turbo version.  If I was looking for a cheap RWD, I'd look and a mid 80's BMW 325is.  I raced one for a year and it's fast and easy to work on.  If'n your looking for more sporty, Datsun Z's.  The 240 is the best, but I don't know how cheap they would be (being a fellow GTI guy, I'd never suggest a 510).  Look at insurance, your age in a 911 may cost more than your car payment.

[scott_araujo]

Porsches are nice, fairly reliable, and the only supercar that doesn't rot like a pear.  If you get any of the old English cars you're in for battles with rust and reliability, figure on driving the Durango now and then.  The Z3s are pretty good but more pricey than the rest.

Don't worry about the money you 'lose' on selling the VWs.  If you let them sit in the garage without driving them you're losing money anyway.  Cars are not investments.  You'll forget about it in a year anyway when you have a car you like and a garage that's not packed with things that don't run.

Scott

[ryandalling]

the old porsche turbos liked to kick in mid corner and throw you off the road... nice value added feature to indicated you were speeding... nothing like a hard RPM kick of turbo from a squirrelly rear wheel drive car.... lol

[bnbmike]

I autocrossed a friends 944 turbo.  The boost halfway 'round a corner is a nightmare.  Let's just say it was something I couldn't overcome in the 3 runs I got at it.  The 3rd run was the only one I didn't spin the car, left foot braking and not letting off the gas was the solution.  Left foot braking on the road, not advised.

[scott_araujo]

Weren't some of the later 911's prone to sticking like glue in turns and then coming loose with little warning?  Just the way they were made.  I remember reading an article comparing a (then) modern 911 to the old Speedster.  The Speedster tended to slip more and more as you got faster, letting you know what was going on the whole time.  The 911 had more of a sharp letting go with little feedback before it did.

Guess a 912 is not in your selection but I thought they were cool, 911 with a 4 cyl bus engine.  Can't get easier to maintain.

The 914 is super roomy for tall folks.  I had two friends over 6'6" who were very comfy in theirs.  Packs a punch if you can get the 914/6 and has a targa top for sunny days.

Scott

[duc_fan]

(being a fellow GTI guy, I'd never suggest a 510).

Yeah, I couldn't afford a 911 Turbo anyway... but good to know about the boost-in-corner issue.  911's in general seem to like swapping ends when driven carelessly, but it's nice to know the older models will let you know before they spit you into the ditch (or off a cliff).

Oh, also great to know about the boost-in-corner handling nightmare on the 944 Turbos.  They were on my list (barely) until now... they can be troublesome and expensive to maintain, so I wanted a NA version anyway.

E30 325is is definitely on my radar.  I've seen a few sharp examples around, and every now and again there's a really nice one featured in Eurotuner.

Had forgotten about the old Z-cars... will need to do some browsing.  The older ones look really neat.  Like a 1970 240Z... "I wanna be a Ferrari when I grow up".

Oh yeah, I'll have the Durango as a backup car, so in sour weather or in the event of mechanical trouble, I can take the SUV to work.  Hence why it wouldn't bother me to buy a more maintenance-intensive old Euro.

Thanks Scott for the 914 suggestion!  I'll add that to my list.  The 914/6 is a neat little car.  The 912 is kinda my dad's thing.  ;-)  He's wanted a 1976 912E to use as a commuter for a long time (IIRC, that's the year they stuffed leftover prior-year 911 engines in them).  I'm gonna guess you're right about the feeling of loss/remorse going away once I get something fun (and functioning) in the garage.

Speaking of 914's... Holy wow: http://portland.craigslist.org/mlt/ctd/1616550151.html

(had to throw in a little stuffed-wheelwell pr0n... gawd I luvz me some proper wheel and tire fitment)

...

Okay, after doing some looking and reading, the 914/6 is out of my league.
http://www.autotraderclassics.com/find/vehicle/vehicleDetail.xhtml?adId=71770&actionMethod=find%2Fvehicle%2FvehicleSearchResults.xhtml%3AuShipController.init&conversationId=97059

Anyway, some good food for thought thus far.  

[scott_araujo]

Out of your league?  I think it depends on whether you want a concourse ready show car or a daily driver.  If it needs some work it's probably way more affordable.  Also, even a 4 cyl is easy and cheap to hot rod.  It's purty close to a VW bus engine.  I think the tranny is a step up from the bug trannies which are always a weak link when you start adding power.

If you're looking for fun on a budget and are willing to let off on performance ain't nothin' finer than a convertible Karmann Ghia, IMO.  Again, dead cheap engine to hot rod.  But I'm an old air cooled VW guy if you couldn't tell already.  Lusted after these for most of my youth but never owned one.  Couple nice ones in town here in PDX.

"American industrial designer Walter Dorwin Teague selected the Type 14 for his list of the world's most beautifully designed products."
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Volkswagen_Karmann_Ghia

Speaking of turbos, never understood the turbo motorcycle thing.  It's only good for straight line and even then the kick from the turbo lag can be 'disconcerting' to say the least.

And if neither reliablity nor performance are that important, Maserati built the convertible biturbo in late 80's or early 90's.  Awful car, I think it was actually based on a Chrysler.  Unreliable, didn't handle, but it is a convertible Maserati and if you could find one I don't imagine you'd spend more than a couple thousnd to get it.  Awful car.

Scott

[scott_araujo]

One last thought, another unicorn I lusted after: Lotus 7.  You won't find a real one but there are many kits available and there's not much too them: frame, a few bocy panels, and a drivetrain.  This car was a monster when it came out.  Most of the kits will take 4, 6, or even v-8 engines.  It's quick with a 4, ridiculously fast with a 6.  Can't imagine what it's like with a v-8.  It weighs about as much as a heavy office chair.  Beautiful example of the English roadster at it's finest.  Tight foot box.  Even most of the replicas require removing a shoe to have enough room to work the pedals.  Dead sexy though.

"It was designed by Lotus founder Colin Chapman and has been considered the embodiment of the Lotus philosophy of performance through low weight and simplicity"
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lotus_Seven

Scott

[GAAN]

the girl has a roadster...meets all your criteria for a fun summer commuter

you have a durango and an SS

ditch both GTI's and call it good

[duc_fan]

the girl has a roadster...meets all your criteria for a fun summer commuter

you have a durango and an SS

ditch both GTI's and call it good

It's a slushbox.  If it was a 5-speed, your advice is exactly what I'd do.

If I can convince her to trade it for a manual, then it would fill my newfound need for a balanced-feeling, RWD, sunny Sunday car.  I'll probably ditch the '98 GTI and finish the '86 for use as a fuel-efficient (but still fun) commuter.

Scott: I have wanted a Lotus 7 replica since I was in college (that's when I first saw one).  Holy crap... small, light, purist... instant love.    A Caterham kit is nearly 30 grand, tho (not including cost to complete).    I'll do some shopping around and see if there's a cheaper option, like one of the Honda moto-engine-powered ones.

Oh, and thanks for the tip on the Karmann Ghia.  Those are really cool looking, might be fun for a while.  I was looking for something that was a bit more handling-oriented, though.  Sounds like a running, driving 914 should be on my list to keep an eye out for.

[scott_araujo]

Caterham makes a nice kit, didn't realize that were that pricey these days.  There was a company some years back that was making the frames on the original Lotus jigs that they had acquired.  There was some legal action and they had to stop, went to using their own jigs.  Shame.

The Ghia is basically a Bug, a little wider I think.  You can get sway bars, gas shocks, etc. but there are built in limits.  Heck, the stock Bug front end doesn't even have a caster adjustment, just camber and toe-in.

Scott

[bnbmike]

914/6 is one of my dream cars.  I didn't suggest it as I was keeping it for myself.  Good ones are hard to find and real ones even harder.  I always thought they were ugly until I saw a full race prep'd one with box flairs, this one had "24 hures of Le Man" history.

[GAAN]

It's a slushbox.  If it was a 5-speed, your advice is exactly what I'd do.

If I can convince her to trade it for a manual, then it would fill my newfound need for a balanced-feeling, RWD, sunny Sunday car.  I'll probably ditch the '98 GTI and finish the '86 for use as a fuel-efficient (but still fun) commuter.

what kind of Roadster is it?

a simple gearbox swap would fit your bill

and be a lot cheaper