How To: install SBK fork, clipons, and more @ M696

[DoWorkSon]

What are the setting for the stock 1098 suspension?

I have yet to adjust mine for my weight(probably about 180ish lbs as well with gear).

[ReapeR696]

This is the excerpt from the 1098 manual i downloaded off the ducati website. It's kind of hard to interpret at first but if you read it while looking at your forks or have a photographic memory everything makes sense. I ended up scrapping what the manual said and adjusted mine based off the link in my last post.

Front fork adjusters
The front fork can be adjusted for rebound, compression and
spring preload.
The settings are adjusted by way of external adjuster screws:
1) to adjust rebound damping (fig. 44.1 and fig. 44.2);
2) to adjust inner spring preload (fig. 44.1 and fig. 44.2);
3) to adjust compression damping (fig. 45.1 and fig. 45.2).
Park the motorcycle in a stable position on its sidestand.
To adjust the rebound damping setting, turn the adjuster (1)
on the top of each fork leg with a flat-blade screwdriver
(1098) or the special wrench (1098 - 1098S Tricolore).
As you turn the adjusting screws (1 and 3), you will hear
them click. Each click identifies a setting. The stiffest
damping setting is obtained with the adjuster turned fully
clockwise to the “0” position. Start with this position and
turn counterclockwise. Count the screw clicks, which
correspond to position “1”, “2” and so forth.

The STANDARD factory settings are as follows:
compression:
3/4 turns (1098),
8 clicks (1098S - 1098S Tricolore);
rebound:
12 clicks (1098),
10 clicks (1098S - 1098S Tricolore);
Spring preload (1098)(A, fig. 44.1): 18 mm;
corresponds to an actual preload of 9 mm.
Spring preload (1098S - 1098S Tricolore); starting with the
adjuster screwed FULLY OUT, screw it in clockwise 8 turns;
corresponds to an actual preload of 8 mm.To change the preload on the inner spring for each fork leg,
turn the adjuster with the hex end (2, fig. 44.1 and fig. 44.2)
with a 22 mm hex wrench.

Corresponding images



So far i'm happy but i do have suspicions that the spring rate is to stiff for 180 lbs. After doing some more reading, i think i'm going to do a little further riding and then do another round of calculations on my static sag and free sag based off an article i read that indicates that freshly serviced forks tend to have more stiction in the seals. I'm going to allow for a break in period and then go from there. Stock spring rate for the 1098 forks is 10.0 N/mm from what i've read, anyone know what it is for a 1100S? I know there is a slight difference because of the difference in fork lengths but i'm curious if the numbers are close enough that i could re-spring my forks for the same rate as the M1100S and that would be enough to get the 30% free sag per my static sag figure of 35mm. Just thinking out loud.

[mattc7]

1100S has 9 or 9.5kg springs in it.  Depends on the actual forks you have. They are constantly updating them over at Ohlins

[Raux]

The 1198 forks i have came with 9.5 ohlins springs. the stock 10 were in the box. so at least I'm set on that. the valve was already changed to racetech gold valves with new oil.

I think right now I just have some minor tweaking to get where it needs to be as compared to your situation with the heavier springs.

[ReapeR696]

Thanks Raux, Please update us on what your impressions are when your bike gets back together. I'm gonna slug it out with mine for a bit more, however i've already began looking at the re-springing process. Anyone have thoughts on if a revalve with new springs would be better than just the springs. Raux, how are the those racetech gold valves going to act differently than the stock one's? Different size? I'd be really interested to see what your static sag / free sag numbers turn out to be, especially if you weigh anywhere in the ball park of 170-180 lbs like myself and DoWorkSon. 

[ReapeR696]

Raux, forgot to ask. Any chance you have documentation of a part number for those Öhlins springs. I trust my searching abilities but a second reliable source would be great. Thanks!

[ReapeR696]

1100S has 9 or 9.5kg springs in it.  Depends on the actual forks you have. They are constantly updating them over at Ohlins

mattc7, thanks for the info. Secondary question, have you heard or even better know what other 1100S riders are reporting as the better spring rate, specifically 108ish sorts? I know my questions is borderline insane because i'm asking for a ballpark figure for a very critical / unique to each rider component.....

[Raux]

i don't have the part number right now. but i can get it. i bought them that way, so I will ask the seller.
plus the shop i work with has access to Ohlins parts but they're closed for 2 weeks.

i HOPE to be riding before the end of august to give riding impressions. by that time it will be one year so it may be hard to compare. last thing i remember about riding my bike. is OH SHIT RAIL

[Veloce-Fino]

... last thing i remember about riding my bike. is OH SHIT RAIL

lolz

[ReapeR696]

Thanks Raux, I'm really interested to hear those sag figures. End of august ehh, not to far off. I've been following the evolution of your bike sense it's inception after the crash. It nice to see it coming together and your approach with new and different parts. Seeing it all together will be a big payoff for not only you but all of us that have been drooling over every detail you've told so far .

Not sure if anyone else has looked at this angle which is kind of what my questions have been pointing towards with the spring rates. The '09 M1100 has a 24deg Rake and a travel of 130mm, the 1*98 forks for '08 have a rake of 24.5deg and a travel of 127mm. Half a deg difference in rake and 3 mm in travel is pretty close, not perfect or identical but close. I'm thinking that what is working for 1100S riders, spring rate wise, will probably work for us 1*98 fork converts. This entire theory is based off the often echoed (other fork conversion threads) observation that the monsters weight is carried differently by its suspension components than those on a superbike. Someone check me if i'm off, i'm still pretty novice with suspension.

[Raux]

the 1198 forks and 1100 forks comparison should be close since the travel is similar. the rake is unimportant because that's set by the steering head if not mistaken. so we should be running the stock 24.5 of the 1100 if we raise the rear with the new suspension mount (and of course get the forks to the right height on the front triples)

IMO you have to look at weight distribution.
take two scales and measure the weights at both wheels. do that for the 1100, 696 and 1198.

then you can start to figure rate comparisons. also, i now have single rate springs, not sure if the stock 1100 has progressive, but i know the 696 does have progressive. the 1100s ohlins should be single rate as well.

my bike with rider, will definitely be more front biased. I have zero rise clipons, lighter exhausts, lighter rearsets with a more raised and rearward peg location. take into account I have dropped some pounds at least until i add the superbike front lights (freaking heavy things) and i should be fine for the new springs ( i weight 1 hundred sixty-mmmphh plus gear)

[ReapeR696]

Thanks Raux, I figured that the rake wasn't very important but thought it best to mention because of the slight difference in angle. Not sure how much of a factor it is as it pertaints to force directed towards the ground but since we are dealing with a relatively short distance, there wouldn't be much of a variance. I'd be interested to see what it is though however i don't have a 1098 laying around to get the measurements i need to run the pythagorean theorem off of. Enough said on that.

I visited the Racetech website to see what they had to offer in the way of suspension components for my forks. Using their suspension calculator and a base weight for the bike i came up with a recommended spring weight of .90 kg/mm (my actual figure was .897 kg/mm IIRC so i rounded to the nearest spring rate). Looks like I  need to drop .1 kg/mm up front. I'm thinking that one of the next things I'm going to have to tackle is pulling the springs and replacing them, anyone have thoughts on replacing valves and if changing them as well would be of significant benefit?

[Raux]

ok going back over this and reading more.

rake/trail

the stock 696 is 24deg/96mm

the stock 1100 is 24/87mm

the 848 however has a slower set up

24.5/97mm which is more like the 696. i think it's because of the offset is less. BUT i read if you go with the 30mm offset on the 848 you get a trail of 91mm.

which also makes sense since i also read changing the rake of the 848 to 24 gives you the @88 mm trail.

sooooo

if you set up your forks at the same mounting height as an 848 you'll get the correct rake/trail or at least close to it for a good starting point.

[ReapeR696]

That's interesting and pretty technical . I did a little bit of research on your findings, and i thought that calculating free/static sag and looking at springrates was "in the weeds". I might have to get a few beers in me before i tackle this one  . When i put my forks on i did so one at a time and checked axle fit with the first 1098 for before taking the second 696 stocker off so that my fork length didn't change from the factory set length. This is still kind of over my head in some regards soooo, what would be the advantage to changing the trail on my bike if it's only 1 mm off? I recognize that your in somewhat of a different situation sense you're sporting the 1100 shock mount. By the way, what spring did you go with or did you just get it refinished in black? The 30mm offset you spoke to, are you referring to the distance from center of top of steering neck to centerline of top of fork tubes? Eyeballing the stock triple i still have laying around i get a 40mm measurement for the 696.  Hmmm interesting. What is the stock mounting height for the 848?

[Raux]

ok hang on

you need to work off the stock

24/96mm of the 696 since you aren't changing your ride height. and your triples should be 30mm offset
centerline steering stem to centerline forks.

if you kept your stock fork on then lined up the new fork to that you should be good as everything SHOULD be the same, if your triples are correct.

yeah i will be shooting for the 1100 rake/trail settings

the rear spring is stock, powdercoated black. eventually i'll be putting something better on. i have an 848 rear shock but it doesn't fit right now, wondering how to make it work, maybe mount it upside down if that's possible. i'll use my stock spring with the 848 shock if that works with a bit more preload to reduce the early soft part of the spring.