Should pepper spray the parents too!

[Slide Panda]

yeah - her saying that he never does stuff like that at home smacks of a big case of denial. I'm sure he does, perhaps to a lesser extent, and she just tunes it out. It's amazing what we all can blind ourselves too when we want.

And while pills can be *part* of the fix at times - they sure aren't the only part. I'm guessin' there's some more old fashioned parenting that needs to be done there.

[The Architect]

And where is the dad in this story?!?!? 

This is a bad incident.

How does going on national TV help?  Where's that news thread?   

The dad is probably hiding. 

[herm]

no doubt the memories of Columbine are still fresh...
if he had been a few years older, the cops might not have been so gentle.

[Grappa]

Really make the beast with two backsed up to put these two dipshits on t.v.  I would be so ashamed if that was my kid that there would be no way I would go on t.v. to talk about how much of an ass he is.  But they probably recorded it and told everyone they knew to watch.  This is just plain make the beast with two backsed up.

[RAT900]

with the application of sufficient voltage

even an amoeba can be convinced

it needs to move to the far side of the petri dish

[redxblack]

I'm a teacher and have avoided this story because these "news" accounts always seem to omit the important stuff. From my understanding of this, the kid was in a special ed class for severe emotionally disturbed kids. A lot of kids that used to go to special ed centers or even institutions are now in public schools as there has been a transition over the last 20 years to include people rather than isolate them. Sometimes they get the balance wrong. It seems like public school is not the least restrictive environment in which this kid can function. As a consequence, people not specifically trained to address this kid's behavior ended up addressing it as if he was a "regular" kid. You can't beat mental illness out of a kid. This isn't a kid behaving badly, it's a kid with SERIOUS mental illness. Again, I've tried to stay out of this so I may have missed some important information. Regardless, please consider the role we are asking of our schools now and know that they aren't the same as they were 20 years ago.

[the_Journeyman]

I'm a teacher and it amazes me how far some parents' heads are up their own butts.

I'm a teacher and we are on the same page.

I'm currently trying to figure out why two of my "bad boy rule breakers" are suddenly carrying around and using chocolate & orange lip balm several times in a 45 minute class and laughing about it.  I feel there's more to this than being sensitive to attract the girls.

JM

[live2ride]

Really make the beast with two backsed up to put these two dipshits on t.v.  I would be so ashamed if that was my kid that there would be no way I would go on t.v. to talk about how much of an ass he is.  But they probably recorded it and told everyone they knew to watch.  This is just plain make the beast with two backsed up.

this.  i want to spray the mom.  WTF

What is she thinking?  'my son was a menace so i'll take him to be on TV?'  i don't think she realizes she's the one who looks like a retard.

[The Bacon Junkie]

...From my understanding of this, the kid was in a special ed class for severe emotionally disturbed kids....   
...A lot of kids that used to go to special ed centers or even institutions are now in public schools as there has been a transition over the last 20 years to include people rather than isolate them.... 
...As a consequence, people not specifically trained to address this kid's behavior ended up addressing it as if he was a "regular" kid...

I did not realize this was a special needs child who was mainstreamed. 


Besides teaching, I used to coach gymnastics.  From recreational classes all the way up through my Elite women's team. 

In one of my rec classes I had a new 6 year old student starting.  As with all my new students, I asked Johnny's (not his real name) mother if there was anything in particular that I needed to know about Johnny to make his time in my gym more enjoyable.  I ask more from a safety standpoint, i.e... Does the child have asthma, allergies, seizures, etc...  That way if anything happens, I'm prepared. 

Mom said no.  He was just like any other six year old boy.  I said great and Johnny came into class.  Well, Johnny had a tough time at first in my class.  I run a pretty tight ship in the gym, because one false move and someone could really get hurt.  Johnny would frequently run away from the group, tearing across the gym to dive into our foam tumbling pit.  Usually it was into a path of an oncoming athlete.  I remember one instance in particular where he actually ran directly UNDER a girl as she was throwing a layout double twist! 

I tried to give the kid the benefit of the doubt, and made excuses for him... He'd never been in a group class before, maybe he had ADHD, maybe there was no structure at home...  I tried my best to keep him safe, but after a few classes, I knew I had to do something.  I made up my mind to confront Mom before the next class to see what could be done about his behavior.  Well, Dad brought Johnny that day, and I'm glad he did.  Instead of leaving Johnny at the door between the lobby and the gym, Dad started walking onto the floor with Johnny.  I explained to dad that only the students were allowed on the floor.  He looked at me in such a way and asked, didn't Mom come in, because Johnny needed a one on one.  I said no and Dad asked me if Mom had told us that Johnny had Autism. 

I was floored!  I never had had a student with Autism before and didn't really know anything about it.  I sat down with Dad and Johnny while another instructor took over the class.  Dad educated me briefly about Autism, and gave me several techniques that he used with his son to help him focus, relieve anxiety, etc...

That was a turning point for Johnny.  Using the techniques Dad had given me, and my newfound understanding of what Johnny was going through, I helped him shine in the class.  It was amazing to see the transformation a little understanding and a different approach could cause.  The light shining in his eyes when he overcame an obstacle or performed a move previously unattainable to him, I will never forget.

If you educate the educators, you can make a difference in children's lives.   I understand that some parents may feel reluctant to talk about issues their child may have, like Johnny's mom.  But, like Johnny's dad, if you DO discuss it, their child will be better off than if you just deny that they might need some extra help.  After all, it IS all about the kids, not the parents.

Sorry for the book, thanks for reading...


-Ryan 

[redxblack]

Ryan - that's a great story. I'm glad you bothered to type it. I teach (mostly) US history and always request the AP course and the special ed inclusion class. It is amazing how much difference there is between 15 and 16 year olds at various points of mental development. It gives me a deep appreciation for the individual to see such variation.

Alright, I need to get a fresh scotch and finish grading these essays. 

[Ddan]

I'm a teacher and have avoided this story because these "news" accounts always seem to omit the important stuff. From my understanding of this, the kid was in a special ed class for severe emotionally disturbed kids. A lot of kids that used to go to special ed centers or even institutions are now in public schools as there has been a transition over the last 20 years to include people rather than isolate them. Sometimes they get the balance wrong. It seems like public school is not the least restrictive environment in which this kid can function. As a consequence, people not specifically trained to address this kid's behavior ended up addressing it as if he was a "regular" kid. You can't beat mental illness out of a kid. This isn't a kid behaving badly, it's a kid with SERIOUS mental illness. Again, I've tried to stay out of this so I may have missed some important information. Regardless, please consider the role we are asking of our schools now and know that they aren't the same as they were 20 years ago.

The story did say he was in a class for kids with issues, so he wasn't really 'mainstreamed'.  I'm way out of my depth here, but it seems unlikely that a school would have a program for kids with problems and not have teachers with training for those problems.  Also, if the kid truly had problems, why would Mom say this behavior was strictly school related?  In the video, the kid came off as bright, articulate, basically a normal kid with the exception of having a skewed perspective on allowable behavior, and even then he acknowledged he deserved what he got.  According to the story, the school went to significant lengths to not 'beat' it out of this kid.  There is no mention in the story that the kid does, in fact, have any mental illness, and diagnosing him with one after watching him on a 4 minute clip seems a little hasty.  If every kid who misbehaves gets labeled as mentally ill, you are taking away from the legitimate needs of kids, and the parents of those kids, who truly have issues. 

[redxblack]

The "special class" for "kids with problems" is a severe emotionally disturbed (SED) class. To get into this class, you don't have to be a behavior problem, you have to have a medical diagnosis. There are degrees of how bad this issue can be, ranging from mild to extreme. Teachers in these courses are trained professionals to deal with certain kids, but some need much more time, attention and even medication than a teacher can give. This kid seems to have been placed into an environment (based on the limited news story) which he's not capable of functioning within. That does not mean he isn't bright, or articulate, or high functioning. It means that he is unable to control his impulsive behavior due to a mental issue. He needs to be taught coping mechanisms AND likely be medicated.

As far as why mom says the problems are school related - there could be several answers. If the kid IS on meds, it's possible they're not effective until the afternoon or that by the afternoon, he's so tired he isn't misbehaving. It's possible that the mom is not entirely truthful. It's possible she ignores bad behavior or no longer recognizes it. There's a lot of possibilities on why the mother would make that statement. I can't really explain, but just speculate. I wouldn't trust her word as authoritative on the subject, though. You don't get into an SED program unless the problems are more than just situational.

I'm not trying to diagnose this kid, but contextualize this issue. There's a kid in a class around the corner from my room that should be in an institution. While they evaluate his condition, he's in our building. It takes time. The kid is bright, but his impulse control is non-existent and his behaviors are somewhat sociopathic. It's not a question of smart or not, but can this kid function appropriately in this environment. That's the nature of the "least restrictive environment" issue. I agree with the premise of LRE, but this is the downside. I'm just a bit depressed that this article is a "water cooler story" that misses the real point or constructive discussion of a problem in our schools.

[ducatiz]

All of you bookmark this kid's name in your mind.  He'll be in the criminal justice system eventually and it won't be because he got a little oleoresin capsicum sprayed in his face.

[sbrguy]

my question is this.

at what point is something a "medical mental illness" or just someone that is a jacka$$?

what i have a problem with is it seems there are too many people that want to label something an "illness" and then they can drug up the person child/adult and also as soon as you label something an illness what you really want is people to say "well its not their fault its the illness" so at what point do we say someone may be just devoloping slower and that does not in itself show an illness or that a person is just the jacka$$?

[ducatiz]

my question is this.

at what point is something a "medical mental illness" or just someone that is a jacka$$?

what i have a problem with is it seems there are too many people that want to label something an "illness" and then they can drug up the person child/adult and also as soon as you label something an illness what you really want is people to say "well its not their fault its the illness" so at what point do we say someone may be just devoloping slower and that does not in itself show an illness or that a person is just the jacka$$?

My question is at what point does being a jackass excuse you from being put in a straitjacket and drugged up? 

If you have a child that age doing what he did, I really don't care if he's a jackass or a mental patient.  Either way, he needs to be dealt with. 

I know what I'd LIKE to do, but I am not a child psychology expert.  That being said, I know things like this did not magically NOT happen ages ago when kids got beaten at school so maybe beating him isn't the solution -- not that I don't think he needs to be beaten. 

I've always said that our civilization has preserved too many bad genes and precivlization that would have resulted in a kid like this being thrown out of the cave and eaten by a sabre tooth tiger.