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Goldline Caliper Pinch bolts - torque setting?

Started by junior varsity, February 14, 2011, 12:02:35 PM

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ducpainter

#15
February 14, 2011, 04:56:06 PM
Yoyodyne sells kits for older bikes.

I wonder if the o-rings changed all that much from the older style calipers to now?

http://www.yoyodyneti.com/Category.aspx?CategoryID=3017
"Once you accept that a child on the autistic spectrum experiences the world in
 a completely different way than you, you will be open to understand how that
 perspective
    is even more amazing than yours."
    To realize the value of nine  months:
    Ask a mother who gave birth to a stillborn.
"Don't piss off old people The older we get, the less 'Life in Prison' is a deterrent."


ducatiz

#16
February 14, 2011, 05:54:47 PM
there is a metric gasket seller in NJ that has a full line of EPDM gaskets of all kinds.. i've ordered from them in the past and they do small quantities.  let me see if i can dig their info out.
Check out my oil filter forensics thread!                     Offended? Click here
"Yelling out of cars, turning your speakers out the window to blast your music onto the street, setting off M-80 firecrackers, firing automatic weapons into the airâ€"these are all well and good. But none of them create a merry atmosphere of insouciance and bonhomie quite like a revving motorcycle.

junior varsity

#17
February 15, 2011, 07:01:43 AM Last Edit: February 15, 2011, 07:04:09 AM by a m
Let me know if you come up with anything. I got a reply back from Bevel Heaven, but I'm not sure what it means - I asked if the small o-ring in the old kits would be the same:

He said

QuoteYep they all use the same orange between the halves.

Now. I read that to mean the color of the O-ring he's referring to was the red/orange one while mine is black (I don't know which materials come in orange, but is obviously different than the black or the green). Or he's on an iPhone that autocorrected from O-Ring to Orange.

Thoughts?

And I've read so many positive reviews and even a friend racing BMW cars uses it, I can't pass up the opportunity to use ATE Super Blue racing brake fluid. I was farting around the .MS board and sure enough, its barely lower on the boiling point than RBF 600, but is supposed to be better about absorbing moisture.   Also, with clear lines, they look like blue lines and the M900 'W' that its going on has blue accents all about it, such as the handlebar.

Cloner

#18
February 15, 2011, 08:16:43 AM
If it's a standard sized o-ring (and it almost certainly is) you can probably go to your local seal house (most major metro areas have one or more....look for the words "seal" and/or "rubber" in the title) and just select a replacement from their bin very inexpensively. 

When selecting an o-ring for use with automotive brake fluid, though, you have to be careful with materials.  Most commercial o-rings are made from buna n (also called nitrile rubber) and this isn't satisfactory for use with brake fluid.  Instead, select one made from Teflon (commonly available), Butyl, Ethylene-Propylene (EPDM...also commonly available and most often used in braking systems), Styrene Butadiene, or Aflas.

You can refer to this chart to see if your o-ring is standard:  http://www.allorings.com/size_cross_reference_framed.htm

You can order o-rings in lots of 50 made from EPDM here:
http://www.allorings.com/cgi-bin/CatalogMgr.pl?cartID=b-5842&SearchField=category&SearchFor=EPDM+O-Rings&template=Htx/order_epdm.htx&hdr=Order+EPDM+O-Rings&displayNumber=369

50 pieces generally run between $5 and $10, though it'd be much less expensive to buy one locally if you can find what you need.

Good luck!

Cloner
ABQ, NM
Never appeal to a man's "better nature."  He may not have one.  Invoking his self-interest gives you more leverage.  R.A. Heinlein

'64 Ducati Monza 250
'67 Aermacchi/HD Sprint SS (race bike)
'00 Aprilia RSV Mille
'03 Ducati 800 SS (race bike)
'04 KTM 450 EXC
'08 Kawasaki Ninja 250 (race bike)

junior varsity

#19
February 15, 2011, 08:25:44 AM
Very cool. I had found a near fit version in Aflas on McMaster but it wasn't perfect. Measuring isn't so easy since I'm certain that this o-ring (the "good" one) has deformed over the years and my calipers are garbage.

I suppose "close" will get me there. I can't brainstorm a reason against erring on the slightly thicker side, since it gets squashed between the calipers, can you?

ducatiz

#20
February 15, 2011, 08:48:50 AM
Call these guys:

http://www.alliedmetrics.com/

They will have every type and size and material.  You want EPDM for this, and I would try getting several gaskets in 0.5mm steps to see what will fit the best.  They'll work with you.
Check out my oil filter forensics thread!                     Offended? Click here
"Yelling out of cars, turning your speakers out the window to blast your music onto the street, setting off M-80 firecrackers, firing automatic weapons into the airâ€"these are all well and good. But none of them create a merry atmosphere of insouciance and bonhomie quite like a revving motorcycle.

junior varsity

#21
February 15, 2011, 11:43:40 AM
well its been said several times, including from Fred at yoyodyne, that EPDM is what I want.  Since I'm shopping with little immediacy, is it the same as the original equipment on the calipers, and is it the best for 'high-heat' + brake fluid, or is another rubber even better?   Not that I think moto calipers hanging out in the breeze get "that" hot like car calipers, I'm just curious.


Next up. The billet calipers I have are, in some areas, cosmetically challenged. This includes the logo paint (its fill-in the groove red) and there's some external corrosion in spots (nothing in the cylinder bores, they are perfect. Same with the pad travel area for that matter).

while I've seen people paint calipers (I assume with automobile caliper paint like G2), I was curious as to re-anodizing these. Or hard anodizing these. And then later coming back to refill in the recessed logo.

ducatiz

#22
February 15, 2011, 11:58:35 AM
The original is natural rubber.  Epdm is superior in every way
Check out my oil filter forensics thread!                     Offended? Click here
"Yelling out of cars, turning your speakers out the window to blast your music onto the street, setting off M-80 firecrackers, firing automatic weapons into the airâ€"these are all well and good. But none of them create a merry atmosphere of insouciance and bonhomie quite like a revving motorcycle.

junior varsity

#23
February 15, 2011, 12:14:33 PM
Quote from: ducpainter on February 14, 2011, 04:56:06 PM
Yoyodyne sells kits for older bikes.

I wonder if the o-rings changed all that much from the older style calipers to now?

http://www.yoyodyneti.com/Category.aspx?CategoryID=3017

Got word back from Bevel Heaven. That 'joining' O-Ring is indeed identical on the old ones and new ones.

i'm going to venture over to the KTM dealer on Friday hopefully to see if they have a seals kit in stock, and if so, if it comes with the necessary middle o-rings, and get a price.

Kind of want the EPDM o rings now though. I will get in touch with the allied metrics folks shortly as well.


So, thoughts about hard anodizing these calipers?

junior varsity

#24
February 15, 2011, 06:00:20 PM
QTMI has the rebuild kits for the 30/34 calipers for $50/caliper - comes with 4 piston seals, 4 dust seals, the center O-Ring. I'm guessing these are "brembo" pieces, so not the EPDM o-ring.

I might choose to get both.

http://www.qtmi.com/

Speeddog

#25
February 15, 2011, 06:15:35 PM
Did you find those kits on their website?

Quote from: a m on February 15, 2011, 06:00:20 PM
QTMI has the rebuild kits for the 30/34 calipers for $50/caliper - comes with 4 piston seals, 4 dust seals, the center O-Ring. I'm guessing these are "brembo" pieces, so not the EPDM o-ring.

I might choose to get both.

http://www.qtmi.com/


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junior varsity

#26
February 15, 2011, 06:16:59 PM
No, i busted out some serious googling and that's when I learned about KTM calipers and seals, and Harley calipers and seals (all related to Brembo rebuilds) and I found QTMI.

I emailed through their website and was responded to by Tara P.


This is a pretty good company bio at the beginning:

junior varsity

#27
February 15, 2011, 06:24:31 PM
Things I learned, or at least, I think I learned:

Brembo does not sell rebuild parts for modern / oem calipers. Complete bullshit.
The immediately preceding line does not apply to KTM.
KTM uses a lot of the same calipers as Ducati including the Goldline series and the Monoblocks.
This means that one can get rebuild seals and such for their Ducati calipers from the KTM dealer. The seals kits are shown in the parts fiches online.

2000-2002 KTM Duke II for goldlines
RC8R for monoblocs

ducpainter

#28
February 15, 2011, 06:27:54 PM
Quote from: a m on February 15, 2011, 06:24:31 PM
Things I learned, or at least, I think I learned:

Brembo does not sell rebuild parts for modern / oem calipers. Complete bullshit.
The immediately preceding line does not apply to KTM.
KTM uses a lot of the same calipers as Ducati including the Goldline series and the Monoblocks.
This means that one can get rebuild seals and such for their Ducati calipers from the KTM dealer. The seals kits are shown in the parts fiches online.

2000-2002 KTM Duke II for goldlines
RC8R for monoblocs


Re read what you wrote...

"Once you accept that a child on the autistic spectrum experiences the world in
 a completely different way than you, you will be open to understand how that
 perspective
    is even more amazing than yours."
    To realize the value of nine  months:
    Ask a mother who gave birth to a stillborn.
"Don't piss off old people The older we get, the less 'Life in Prison' is a deterrent."


ducatiz

#29
February 15, 2011, 06:31:21 PM
Quote from: a m on February 15, 2011, 06:00:20 PM
QTMI has the rebuild kits for the 30/34 calipers for $50/caliper - comes with 4 piston seals, 4 dust seals, the center O-Ring. I'm guessing these are "brembo" pieces, so not the EPDM o-ring.

I might choose to get both.

http://www.qtmi.com/



i've used the brembo rebuild kits for the older calipers and they are natural rubber. 

the main advantage of the EPDM is that it is DOT5 compatible, but also will last a jillion years longer.  natural rubber will absorb some moisture but epdm wont.
Check out my oil filter forensics thread!                     Offended? Click here
"Yelling out of cars, turning your speakers out the window to blast your music onto the street, setting off M-80 firecrackers, firing automatic weapons into the airâ€"these are all well and good. But none of them create a merry atmosphere of insouciance and bonhomie quite like a revving motorcycle.
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