You're too stupid to... own a diesel small truck

[Kev M]

About the new Tacoma:

http://www.automobilemag.com/auto_shows/detroit/2015/1501-q-a-with-2016-toyota-tacoma-chief-engineer-mike-sweers/

Good read, and it addresses WHY we're not seeing many new diesels in the US.

The much higher cost of diesel fuel and the expensive emissions equipment needed for US EPA regs make it not worth it to most people.

[DarkMonster620]

interesting take on the diesel . . . diesel HiLuxD4D, Frontier 2.5/3.0di, BTUGLYASS50, Ford Ranger 3.2di, Mitsubishi L200 DiD, Isuzu 2.5/3.0 are the leaders in the market and they " handle our crappy diesel" fairly well as do the VW/Audi/Porsche, MB, BMW, Skoda diesel engines . . . AND yes, people DO pay the premium happily

[Randimus Maximus]

interesting take on the diesel . . . diesel HiLuxDiD, Frontier 2.5/3.0di, BTUGLYASS50, Ford Ranger 3.2di, Isuzu 2.5/3.0 are the leaders in the market and they " handle our crappy diesel" fairly well as do the VW/Audi/Porsche, MB, BMW, Skoda diesel engines . . . AND yes, people DO pay the premium happily

You're not in 'merica.

We like big, fancy trucks with lots of gadgetry in them.

That being said, I think the HiLux D4D would sell plenty here.  Although it would have to get bigger & heavier to accommodate all of our safety regulations.

[Triple J]

The current emission equipment required for US diesels, and recently European diesels, is a real pain in the ass. The requirements of the diesel particulate filter in particular really impact how they operate and their efficiency. The Urea injection systems are more just a pain in the ass. Nevermind the cost, as the guy in the article mentions. Hopefully the systems become less of an issue as the manufacturers get better and making them.

[MendoDave]

OK so its not a truck but it has a diesel without the particulate scrubber.
1969 Camaro with Cummins Diesel.

http://www.aggressivecars.com/yes-truecummins-powered-1969-camaro/

All you would have to do is cut the top off with a cold chisel and open up the trunk to make a truck out of it.

[Speeddog]

OK so its not a truck but it has a diesel without the particulate scrubber.
1969 Camaro with Cummins Diesel.

http://www.aggressivecars.com/yes-truecummins-powered-1969-camaro/

All you would have to do is cut the top off with a cold chisel and open up the trunk to make a truck out of it.

That's just wrong on so many levels.

[Kev M]

interesting take on the diesel . . . diesel HiLuxDiD, Frontier 2.5/3.0di, BTUGLYASS50, Ford Ranger 3.2di, Isuzu 2.5/3.0 are the leaders in the market and they " handle our crappy diesel" fairly well as do the VW/Audi/Porsche, MB, BMW, Skoda diesel engines . . . AND yes, people DO pay the premium happily

But I'm assuming they don't require you to run a low sulfur fuels and make your diesel motors meet the same emissions standards (through particulate filters, exhaust catalysts, EGR, urea injection etc.)?

The relative costs and effects of all that make diesel much less attractive in the US for passenger cars and light duty trucks.

Higher initial cost, plus more expensive maintenance and operational costs, plus less efficient motors are really killing the market here.

[DarkMonster620]

But I'm assuming they don't require you to run a low sulfur fuels and make your diesel motors meet the same emissions standards (through particulate filters, exhaust catalysts, EGR, urea injection etc.)?

The relative costs and effects of all that make diesel much less attractive in the US for passenger cars and light duty trucks.

Higher initial cost, plus more expensive maintenance and operational costs, plus less efficient motors are really killing the market here.

same engines as Europe . . . same equipment as Europe . . we get Euro Spec cars from Europe and Euro Spec bikes from Europe . . . from Japan/Asia we get "Gen Spec" but otherwise are the same engines . . . and these vehicles are, mostly all are equipped with some sort of "emission equipment". . .

[DRKWNG]

About the new Tacoma:

A: Ford has a “One Ford” strategy to sell one product globally, but Toyota keeps the Hilux and Tacoma pickup trucks separate. Why?
S: The Toyota Hilux itself would work. The size is different, it’s not as wide as the Tacoma. The other side of it is that it doesn’t fit the [U.S.] customer’s image of what a Toyota truck should look like. It’s a world truck, designed for countries outside North America. It’s a great truck, it’s a very durable truck, but it doesn’t have all the creature comforts of the Tacoma. [The Hilux buyer is] a different customer, it’s different demographics, and it’s a different product.
A: So, people use the Toyota Tacoma more as a regular daily vehicle versus the Hilux's work focus?
S: Yes, but we pride ourselves on our off-road heritage and capability. The Tacoma is built to do it. We have no qualms saying that the Hilux and Tacoma are brothers as far as the platform. The basic frame design is similar. We [the Tacoma] have a little bit more compliancy in our frame compared to a Hilux. That’s mainly to satisfy the ride requirements for the North American customer. The Hilux is a great truck, a great durable truck. Out of that family, we have the 4Runner [SUV]. That’s more refined than the Hilux. The essence of our trucks, the roots of our trucks, comes out of Land Cruiser [SUV]. That sets the standards for all our trucks.

In essence, Americans are soft.

[Bick]

Not that its a Diesel but I just bought another ML320. This ones nicer than the other one.

Still not taking my advice and looking for a 55?

[Kev M]

same engines as Europe . . . same equipment as Europe . . we get Euro Spec cars from Europe and Euro Spec bikes from Europe . . . from Japan/Asia we get "Gen Spec" but otherwise are the same engines . . . and these vehicles are, mostly all are equipped with some sort of "emission equipment". . .

Some sort does not equal same.

I'm under the impression the EU diesel emissions standards are not nearly as stringent (read that as not nearly as costly or inefficient).

Are they widely using DEF/UREA injection yet? Or cleaning cycles that use fuel to super heat the exhaust and burn off particles. That regeneration cycle wastes fuel and has been causing problems for the Moroni sourced diesel Fiat/Chrysler Auto is using in the US Grand Cherokee/Ram (for example).

In other cases full sized non-commercial trucks have lost up to 30% of their mileage with no offsetting gains.

Also, can't say about you, but in the EU I believe fuel is more costly across the board and diesel less of a difference than here.

[MendoDave]

Still not taking my advice and looking for a 55?

A 55 hasn't come my way that's all. Maybe next time.

[DarkMonster620]

Some sort does not equal same.

I'm under the impression the EU diesel emissions standards are not nearly as stringent (read that as not nearly as costly or inefficient).

Are they widely using DEF/UREA injection yet? Or cleaning cycles that use fuel to super heat the exhaust and burn off particles. That regeneration cycle wastes fuel and has been causing problems for the Moroni sourced diesel Fiat/Chrysler Auto is using in the US Grand Cherokee/Ram (for example).

In other cases full sized non-commercial trucks have lost up to 30% of their mileage with no offsetting gains.

Also, can't say about you, but in the EU I believe fuel is more costly across the board and diesel less of a difference than here.

Diesel here is $0.666/litre as of today . . . 95Oct $0.702/litre as of today . . .

European vehicles here are the same as in Europe . . . I am saying what I know  . . . I do know there are talks with the Munich manufacturer to "downgrade" diesels coming here since filters and other fuel system parts are being replaced more often . . . Stuttgart manufacturers, are keeping their "same engines as in Europe"  . . . the rest, are either being purchase by "special order" or because agreement issues oblige the distributor/dealer to import diesel engined vehicles . . .

Kev, I would have to do a bit more digging, but, the only different specs we get are Asian . . .

[Triple J]

I'm under the impression the EU diesel emissions standards are not nearly as stringent (read that as not nearly as costly or inefficient).

As of either 2012 or 2013 (can't remember exactly) European diesel emissions are essentially the same as US (which started in 2008). So any Euro pre-'12 or '13 diesel doesn't have the urea and DPF systems...afterwards they do. That is why the US is all of a sudden getting more diesel options from the European manufacturers in the last couple years...they no longer have to put special emissions equipment on them for the US market.

[Kev M]

So the market is just catching up, but the EU still doesn't have $2.00/gallon petrol vs. $3.00+/gal diesel.