powered by:
September 01, 2024, 01:13:05 AM
Welcome,
Guest
. Please
login
or
register
.
1 Hour
1 Day
1 Week
1 Month
Forever
Login with username, password and session length
News
:
Tapatalk users...click me
Home
Help
Search
Login
Register
Discussion Boards
Introduce Yourself
FAQs and Policies
General Monster Forum
Remembering our friends...in Memorium
Riding Techniques
Tutorials
Tech
Accessories & Mods
Gear
Racing & Trackdays
Stolen Motorcycles
No Moto Content
Board Tech Issues
Local Club Boards
BOMb
RCP
Sponsors
Valley Desmo Service
California Cycleworks
MotorcycleGear.Com
Monsterparts
Minor Sponsor Board
Sponsor Info
Flea Market
Monsters for Sale
Monsters Wanted
Other Bikes
Parts for Sale
Parts Wanted
Gear for Sale
Misc for Sale/Wanted
Ducati Monster Forum
>
Moto Board
>
General Monster Forum
(Moderators:
ducpainter
,
bigiain
,
Speeddog
) >
Plastic Tank problems: Discussion thread, see info thread sticky for updates
Pages:
1
...
85
86
[
87
]
88
89
...
191
Go Down
« previous
next »
Print
Author
Topic: Plastic Tank problems: Discussion thread, see info thread sticky for updates (Read 699701 times)
Bill in OKC
Hero Member
Offline
Posts: 897
S4Rs
Re: Plastic Tank problems: Discussion thread, see info thread sticky for updates
«
Reply #1290 on:
December 20, 2010, 10:53:07 AM »
Not for the faint of heart - this made me feel a bit queasy like doing taxes only worse.
http://www-odi.nhtsa.dot.gov/acms/docservlet/Artemis/Public/Pursuits/2010/PE/INIM-PE10045-42821.pdf
Logged
'07 S4Rs '02 RSVR '75 GT550 '13 FXSB '74 H1E '71 CB750
BoDiddley
Sr. Member
Offline
Posts: 376
S4Rs In Michigan
Re: Plastic Tank problems: Discussion thread, see info thread sticky for updates
«
Reply #1291 on:
December 20, 2010, 11:24:24 AM »
Craige / Tech Support / Caswell has given us answers to some of our questions. I will cut and paste his response to a questionaire email that i sent him.
-----------------------------------------------------
Craige : At this time there are 31420 views so there is a few riders needing answers on how to fix the problem of tank expansion in Ducati's. I will list them so I can cut and past this whole bit in the thread. Or which every way you are comfortable with. The riders thank you
Craig : If you have any tips "PLEASE" feel free to help.
------------------------------------------
It seems a bit thick to get around and cover all the tanks interior? Can it be thinned?
The gas tank sealer can be thinned using Xylene or lacquer thinner. You can add no more than 5% by volume ( 1 fl oz for the motorcycle kit). This serves to retard the cure cycle and thin the sealer somewhat to expand coverage.
Is it a solvent that will have a molecular connection with the tank?
Once applied it will permanently bond to the tank it is an epoxy.
If the tank continues to shrink will this cause a problem with adhesion?
No, it is a hard finish.
Screws are getting stuck in the tanks, are they really necessary?
For a plastic tank it is not necessary to use the screws.
Will double the amount make it easier to coat?
It will provide a thicker layer and give you more volume to slosh around.
Does the MEK (acetone) actually soften the plastic or is it used just for cleaning?
If you are dealing with a plastic tank you do not have to use the acetone. Acetone will attack the plastic if left in over about 10 minutes. You will only use the acetone if the tank has cured and you require an additional coating due to incomplete coverage. The acetone is poured in and sloshed around for about 5 to 7 minutes to make the existing coating tacky, poured out allowed to evaporate and the second coating is applied.
If not MEK what soap would work?
No MEK, dawn dish washing detergent and hot water to clean, then rinse with hot water and allow to dry before applying the Caswell Gas Tank Sealer.
How thick is the coating?
About 1/16" +/-
Do you advise coating twice?
Not usually necessary unless you see gaps where it did not flow to an area.
Feel free to add any comments.
Caswell Gas Tank Sealer GTS1750
http://caswellplating.com/aids/epoxygas.htm
Logged
"But sire what are we to do. You have taken all our weapons and now the heathen hordes are at the gate. Are we to lie down and give them our lives. Without weapons they will make us eat ourselves."
ducatiz
No trellis. no desmo. = Not Ducati.
Post Whore
Offline
Posts: 15590
Re: Plastic Tank problems: Discussion thread, see info thread sticky for updates
«
Reply #1292 on:
December 20, 2010, 11:43:02 AM »
Quote from: Bill in OKC on December 20, 2010, 10:53:07 AM
Not for the faint of heart - this made me feel a bit queasy like doing taxes only worse.
http://www-odi.nhtsa.dot.gov/acms/docservlet/Artemis/Public/Pursuits/2010/PE/INIM-PE10045-42821.pdf
The main points to note are:
1. it's an official communication and Ducati has to respond with the information requested.
2. NHTSA has had 13 reports of LEAKING tanks. This isn't deformation by itself, it is deformation that has led to actual leaking of gasoline.
3. NHTSA seems to think that the leaking is unrelated to the deformation issue.
Logged
Check out my oil filter forensics thread!
Offended? Click here
"Yelling out of cars, turning your speakers out the window to blast your music onto the street, setting off M-80 firecrackers, firing automatic weapons into the air—these are all well and good. But none of them create a merry atmosphere of insouciance and bonhomie quite like a revving motorcycle.
ducatiz
No trellis. no desmo. = Not Ducati.
Post Whore
Offline
Posts: 15590
Re: Plastic Tank problems: Discussion thread, see info thread sticky for updates
«
Reply #1293 on:
December 20, 2010, 11:45:12 AM »
Quote from: BoDiddley on December 20, 2010, 11:24:24 AM
Does the MEK (acetone) actually soften the plastic or is it used just for cleaning?
MEK (Methyl Ethyl Ketone) and Acetone are two different chemicals, same family, but not the same. MEK is 2-butanone and Acetone is 2-propanone. Both ketones, but definitely not the same stuff.
Logged
Check out my oil filter forensics thread!
Offended? Click here
"Yelling out of cars, turning your speakers out the window to blast your music onto the street, setting off M-80 firecrackers, firing automatic weapons into the air—these are all well and good. But none of them create a merry atmosphere of insouciance and bonhomie quite like a revving motorcycle.
BoDiddley
Sr. Member
Offline
Posts: 376
S4Rs In Michigan
Re: Plastic Tank problems: Discussion thread, see info thread sticky for updates
«
Reply #1294 on:
December 20, 2010, 11:51:21 AM »
Quote from: ducatiz on December 20, 2010, 11:45:12 AM
MEK (Methyl Ethyl Ketone) and Acetone are two different chemicals, same family, but not the same. MEK is 2-butanone and Acetone is 2-propanone. Both ketones, but definitely not the same stuff.
Do they both have the same effect on the tank material? Which would be better for addesion purposes?
Logged
"But sire what are we to do. You have taken all our weapons and now the heathen hordes are at the gate. Are we to lie down and give them our lives. Without weapons they will make us eat ourselves."
ducatiz
No trellis. no desmo. = Not Ducati.
Post Whore
Offline
Posts: 15590
Re: Plastic Tank problems: Discussion thread, see info thread sticky for updates
«
Reply #1295 on:
December 20, 2010, 12:09:51 PM »
Quote from: BoDiddley on December 20, 2010, 11:51:21 AM
Do they both have the same effect on the tank material? Which would be better for addesion purposes?
I don't know, there are chem engs around who can tell you that, but I assume both will attack the Nylon if applied in any significant concentration or duration. For the purposes of thinning the Caswells, I assume both are ok, but I am more familiar with using MEK>
Logged
Check out my oil filter forensics thread!
Offended? Click here
"Yelling out of cars, turning your speakers out the window to blast your music onto the street, setting off M-80 firecrackers, firing automatic weapons into the air—these are all well and good. But none of them create a merry atmosphere of insouciance and bonhomie quite like a revving motorcycle.
mitt
Flounder-Administrator
Hero Member
Offline
Posts: 4378
2003 M1000s
Re: Plastic Tank problems: Discussion thread, see info thread sticky for updates
«
Reply #1296 on:
December 20, 2010, 12:21:16 PM »
Ford and GM join legal fight over the 15% Ethanol
http://www.marketwatch.com/story/ford-gm-join-legal-fight-against-higher-ethanol-2010-12-20
Send a letter to your congress representatives - I did.
mitt
Logged
homepage
http://sites.google.com/site/mittelstadtc/
myleslong
New Member
Offline
Posts: 7
Re: Plastic Tank problems: Discussion thread, see info thread sticky for updates
«
Reply #1297 on:
December 20, 2010, 12:54:18 PM »
Well..BoDiddley,
You got different answers from Caswell than I did. When I asked about skipping the Acetone and screws, I was cautioned not to skip this step. If I had gotten the answers you did, I would have avoided the whole paint issue. According to Caswell's answers to your questions, the acetone is not necessary for "plastic" tanks. As I noted on my original post, I couldn't tell any difference in the surface after I did my tank, so I would skip the acetone completely. Also the screws.
By the way, acetone eats the sticky on duct tape in about 1/3 a second, so don't expect duct tape to hold back acetone.
I made a steel plate with an inner tube gasket to cover the fuel pump hole and used an automotive expandable rubber freeze plug to plug the gas filler hole. But as stated earlier...don't even use the acetone and all should be good.
To answer another question that was asked...I did 2 coats because the quantity of the motorcycle kit is for two 5 gal tanks. I was trying to ensure that I had good coverage. Yes, thin Caswells with lacquer thinner. Just follow the directions.
Strangely, when I got my new (3rd) tank, the dealer still had my original tank which was replaced almost 1 year ago to the day in his storage holding area. Unfortunately, the ripples in the knee cutouts were still very obvious. I can't say if the tank had shrunk any, but cosmetically is still looked terrible. (Black S4rs)
Regards,
Myles
Logged
ducpainter
The Often Hated
Flounder-Administrator
Post Whore
Offline
Posts: 78608
DILLIGAF
Re: Plastic Tank problems: Discussion thread, see info thread sticky for updates
«
Reply #1298 on:
December 20, 2010, 01:43:48 PM »
Quote from: ducatiz on December 20, 2010, 04:47:30 AM
<snip>
The best way to do it is to keep the ingredients at room temp or above, around 70-75 F. If you thin, then go very conservatively and use no more than 2-3 drops at a time.
Izaak...if you've ever used the Caswell you'd see it doesn't need to be thinned a drop or two at a time...
an ounce at a time is more like it.
Someone described it like honey...it is...if you keep your honey in the fridge.
Logged
"Once you accept that a child on the autistic spectrum experiences the world in
a completely different way than you, you will be open to understand how that
perspective
is even more amazing than yours."
To realize the value of nine months:
Ask a mother who gave birth to a stillborn.
"Don't piss off old people The older we get, the less 'Life in Prison' is a deterrent.”
jgrm1
Full Member
Offline
Posts: 147
Re: Plastic Tank problems: Discussion thread, see info thread sticky for updates
«
Reply #1299 on:
December 20, 2010, 02:39:17 PM »
Quote from: ducatiz on December 20, 2010, 11:43:02 AM
NHTSA seems to think that the leaking is unrelated to the deformation issue.
...and the 2008 model year is not affected. I assume none of the reported leakers were 2008s, though.
-Jeff
Logged
BMW: 2016 R1200RS, 2000 R1100S, 1975 R90S
Ducati: 2008 S2R1000, 1998 900 Supersport Final Edition
Norton: 1974 Commando 850
Triumph: 2016 Thruxton R, 1971 T120R
ducatiz
No trellis. no desmo. = Not Ducati.
Post Whore
Offline
Posts: 15590
Re: Plastic Tank problems: Discussion thread, see info thread sticky for updates
«
Reply #1300 on:
December 20, 2010, 03:25:36 PM »
Its solely based on the reports. For example, the lawsuit has a 2009 SBK .
Logged
Check out my oil filter forensics thread!
Offended? Click here
"Yelling out of cars, turning your speakers out the window to blast your music onto the street, setting off M-80 firecrackers, firing automatic weapons into the air—these are all well and good. But none of them create a merry atmosphere of insouciance and bonhomie quite like a revving motorcycle.
corey
Is that a throttle tube in your pocket? Or just your
Hero Member
Offline
Posts: 2799
'06 Tang/Black S2R800
Re: Plastic Tank problems: Discussion thread, see info thread sticky for updates
«
Reply #1301 on:
December 20, 2010, 07:06:30 PM »
looking through that PDF, it seems that because of the reported leakage issues, a recall may be pursued.
as they (ducati) would be unable to determine which tanks will leak, and which will not, would this not then lend itself to a recall of all plastic tanks for Monsters Model Year 2004-2007 (according to the document)
Logged
When all the land lays in ruin... And burnination has forsaken the countryside... Only one guy will remain... My money's on...
ducatiz
No trellis. no desmo. = Not Ducati.
Post Whore
Offline
Posts: 15590
Re: Plastic Tank problems: Discussion thread, see info thread sticky for updates
«
Reply #1302 on:
December 20, 2010, 07:10:25 PM »
Quote from: corey on December 20, 2010, 07:06:30 PM
looking through that PDF, it seems that because of the reported leakage issues, a recall may be pursued.
as they (ducati) would be unable to determine which tanks will leak, and which will not, would this not then lend itself to a recall of all plastic tanks for Monsters Model Year 2004-2007 (according to the document)
What I am irritated with is that they seem to exclude the tank deformation as a potential cause of the leak occurring. It's bizarre. It's a plastic tank, with a plastic flange and that flange is leaking. Flange is only going to leak because you put a crappy Oring on it, the fuel pump casting doesn't fit or the hole is changing shape. Hello??
But yes, if they find a defect (and NHTSA requires it to be "DANGEROUS" for it to be a legal defect. "mere" deformation may not be dangerous -- ie.. legal defect. ) they can force a recall.
Logged
Check out my oil filter forensics thread!
Offended? Click here
"Yelling out of cars, turning your speakers out the window to blast your music onto the street, setting off M-80 firecrackers, firing automatic weapons into the air—these are all well and good. But none of them create a merry atmosphere of insouciance and bonhomie quite like a revving motorcycle.
Bill in OKC
Hero Member
Offline
Posts: 897
S4Rs
Re: Plastic Tank problems: Discussion thread, see info thread sticky for updates
«
Reply #1303 on:
December 21, 2010, 01:19:43 AM »
The 2008 S4Rs Tricolor, even though it is the same bike as a 2007 S4Rs except for the paint scheme, is not included?
Logged
'07 S4Rs '02 RSVR '75 GT550 '13 FXSB '74 H1E '71 CB750
BoDiddley
Sr. Member
Offline
Posts: 376
S4Rs In Michigan
Re: Plastic Tank problems: Discussion thread, see info thread sticky for updates
«
Reply #1304 on:
December 21, 2010, 03:06:40 PM »
I recieved my Caswell today and then an hour later my dealer sent this email.
"Great news, Thanks to your efforts with the photos, Ducati North America has approved the replacement of your fuel tank. I will call you when the tank arrives. I ordered all the hardware necessary to make the swap. You can bring the bike to us or just the tank. I will need to retain the old tank for 90 days. Either way works for me!"
My man must have found the right route to the mountain top? Of course I am not actually looking at the tank yet. But if one dealer can do it. Am I opening up my big mouth risking bad karma or rath from the Duca gods, what the hell I can still fix my old tank.
07 S4Rs Red/white
Logged
"But sire what are we to do. You have taken all our weapons and now the heathen hordes are at the gate. Are we to lie down and give them our lives. Without weapons they will make us eat ourselves."
Pages:
1
...
85
86
[
87
]
88
89
...
191
Go Up
Print
« previous
next »
Jump to:
Please select a destination:
-----------------------------
Introductions
-----------------------------
=> Introduce Yourself
=> FAQs and Board Policies
-----------------------------
Moto Board
-----------------------------
=> General Monster Forum
=> In Memorium...Remembering our Friends
=> Riding Techniques
=> Tutorials
=> Tech
=> Accessories & Mods
=> Gear
=> Racing & Trackdays
=> Stolen Motorcycles
=> Random Cool Pics
-----------------------------
Kitchen Sink
-----------------------------
=> No Moto Content
===> Board Suggestions
===> Fixed Board Issues
=> Stella's Pop
-----------------------------
DMF Sponsors
-----------------------------
=> Valley Desmo Service
=> Ca-Cycleworks
=> New Enough.Com
=> Monsterparts
=> Minor Sponsors
=> Misc Info
-----------------------------
Local Clubs
-----------------------------
=> Monster Women
=> Ducati MOB
=> SoCal Monsters
=> CAM
=> OZ monsters
=> NorthWest
=> NEMHA
=> NYMMC
=> MHM
=> SoCO DOG
=> DFWM
=> MADDOG
=> MOCHA
=> THCM
=> AZDRA
=> M-ROC
=> Central Cal Monsters
=> DOCSF
=> MCMC
=> DDCM
=> DOCTOR
=> Hoosier Hooligans
=> OMHA
=> DOCIA
=> Rising Sun Ducatis
=> MCM
=> NMMR
=> MIA
=> Desmotropic
=> COW
=> MOTH
=> DesmOK
=> Bayou Country Ducati Riders
=> DeVal Mostro
=> Coastal Ducati Club
-----------------------------
Configurators and Calculators
-----------------------------
=> Valve Shim Calculator
Loading...
SimplePortal 2.1.1