GUN STUFF

[the_Journeyman]

I don't have any experience with the Jennings, but they get pretty lousy press.

There are lots of good semi auto pistols. Going to a range and renting is a great idea.

I'm lucky to get two shots before it jams.  It's terrible.  It's cheap to buy, but if you don't keep a round chambered, you might as well throw it at the assailant.

JM

[fastwin]

Hey JM,

Check out my wheel gun post a page or so back. I love 'em all (read: gun nut ) but if a revolver spins your prop then why the hell not? My story about my ex-wife says it all. After all the trials of finding her the right auto she went ape shit over my S&W model 65 wheel gun. I'd take that sucker and some HKS speed loaders into any gun fight. I love that gun. Would it be my personal first choice of all time? No. Refer to scattergun posts. But I know it well, trust it, am trained and practiced on it so if you tossed it to me when shit hits the fan I could run with it! And I practice all the time with .38spl in my .357 mag guns. I don't mind saving money. My ex didn't like the hot .357s but was happy and accurate with .38spl+p rounds.

I have a S&W model 29, blue w/ 6" barrel and I'm not sure why I have it. It was one of "those" buys. I would never use it for self defense and I don't hunt with it. I should probably sell it to my brother who goes salmon fishing in Alaska and has to contend with Grizzlies. Maybe he could get Sarah P to ride back up?

Again, I love my K frame Smiths and Ruger makes some darn nice revolvers too. Heck, so does Taurus! One nice thing about revolvers is they tend to never jam. Never seen a stove pipe jam or failure to feed on a wheel gun!

[ducatiz]

I only recently found out that the ATF has issued a guideline regarding pistol-gripped shotguns.  It was a shock to me, anyone else?

Certain commercially produced firearms do not fall within the definition of shotgun under the GCA even though they utilize a shotgun shell for ammunition. For example, firearms that come equipped with a pistol grip in place of the buttstock are not shotguns as defined by the GCA.

http://www.examiner.com/gun-rights-in-national/atf-position-on-pistol-grip-shotguns-creates-new-danger

EDIT:

So I read the ATF's bulletin..  They have basically reclassified pistol grip shotguns as handguns for the purpose of sale.  This means sgs like this:



not like this:

Pistol Grips and Shotguns
Firearms with pistol grips attached:
The definition of a shotgun under the GCA, 18 U.S.C.
§ 921(a)(5), is “a weapon designed or redesigned, made or
remade, and intended to be fired from the shoulder and designed
or redesigned and made or remade to use the energy of
an explosives to fire through a smooth bore either a number
of ball shot or single projectile for each single pull of the trigger.
Under the GCA, 18 U.S.C. § 921(a)(29)(A), handgun
means “a firearm which has a short stock and is designed to
be held and fired by the use of a single hand.” Federal law
provides under 18 U.S.C. 922(b)(1), that if the firearm to be
transferred is “other than a rifle or shotgun,” the purchaser
must be 21 years of age or older.
Certain commercially produced firearms do not fall within
the definition of shotgun under the GCA even though
they utilize a shotgun shell for ammunition. For example,
firearms that come equipped with a pistol grip in place of
the buttstock are not shotguns as defined by the GCA.
A firearm with a pistol grip in lieu of the shoulder stock is
not designed to be fired from the shoulder and, therefore,
is not a shotgun. Since it is a firearm “other than a rifle or
shotgun,” the purchaser must be 21 years of age or older.
Additionally, interstate controls apply. The licensee and
transferee must be residents of the same State.
Other questions raised pertain to entries made in the
licensee’s required records with respect to firearm “type.”
These entries should indicate the firearm type as “pistol grip
firearm.”

[ducatiz]

Sounds like you have experience.

i am a keen observer, so sayeth the judge in anne arundel county.

[Monsterlover]

<edit> jebus i need to learn to type faster on this thing

I had read somewhere online a copy of a (ill call it a proposal) to review the nature and intended use of shotguns.

The aim was to decide if certain styles of gun and accessories fell under the nature of sporting or hunting.

The article wanted to focus on things like:

Folding and or collapsible stocks

Pistol grips

Pic mounting rails anywhere other than the top of the gun (ie to mount sights)

The weight of the gun

The width and or thickness of the receiver

Ability to mount grenade launchers

No pistol grip fore end

Limit on mag caoacity. They specifically wrote that drum mags were for leo/mil only.

That's all I can remember. I felt ok about most if it. I do think pic rails are a good thing for mounting light/lasers, collapsible stocks are good for fitting the gun to your body as is the pistol grip.

This was the actual proposal drafted and I can't remember who wrote it, who was supposed to read it or where I found out about it.

I think its a slippery slope grey area and probably nothing will come of it.

That is, unless your link is about something else. It won't open on a phone.

[ducatiz]

It's a lot of nonsense, but that's all I'll say. 

[Monsterlover]

Edit2.0

What tiz posted is the first part of what I read. They did talk about pistol grip vs pg stock.

[fastwin]

Taurus makes that "Judge" pistol thing that will shoot .45 Long Colt and .410 shotshells. Wonder what the ATF thinks of that? I just don't see how after all these years they can claim that a shotgun is no longer a shotgun just because it has a pistol grip and not a full stock. It still shoots a shotshell or slug. Does trimming the tail feathers off a duck no longer make it a duck? It still quacks like a duck! Puzzling evidence. And what even initiated this action? They are a goofy group at times.

[ducpainter]

We aren't gonna do gun law kids.

Trust me on that.

[fastwin]

Nope!

[Monsterlover]

I can't stop thinking about that Damn kel-tec shotgun. Its all sorts of awesome.

However I think for half the money I can get me an 870 with an 18" barrel and longer mag tube and have a lot left over for shells.

Personally I have no interest in a pistol grip. Seems less mamagable to me. No fhe though. Never fired a sg before.

[Kopfjager]

No need for pistol grips on a shotgun. 



Beretta Xtrema2 Demonstration

[Monsterlover]

I've seen that before.

Pretty bad ass.

[fastwin]

I can't stop thinking about that Damn kel-tec shotgun. Its all sorts of awesome.

However I think for half the money I can get me an 870 with an 18" barrel and longer mag tube and have a lot left over for shells.

Personally I have no interest in a pistol grip. Seems less mamagable to me. No fhe though. Never fired a sg before.

10/4 on all of that. Yep, the Kel Tec is cool new stuff. But if you already don't have scatterguns out the wazoo then go 870 and dude it up as you see fit. Lots of great, quality add ons for the 870s if you feel the need. The Kel Tec is just something different and new. An 870 with a mag tube extension and maybe some ghost ring sights is as good as it gets. Hell, a good inexpensive 870 with only the mag extension is king. I have seen dozens of shooters in my classes and other classes I've been in that kicked ass with just a bead sight. Even on the slug range at 50-100 yards! It's the Chevy 350 small block V8 of shotguns. It's a great gun and an American classic. A hundred years from now people will still be praising it!

OK... I'm done.

[sugarcrook]

I've had my 870 to the indoor range once so far.  What's the process of installing ghost ring sights?  I'm guessing I'll need to take it to somebody.